WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.840 All right. Hey, we're here at the Beta Show, episode six here. Jeff Reed with the Church 00:00:04.840 --> 00:00:10.360 Digital and Stadia Church Planning. Of course, joined once again by Ray DeArmis over at Christ 00:00:10.360 --> 00:00:15.340 Feltshire Miami, digital pastor. Ray's promoting the shirt, getting the word out. Definitely 00:00:15.340 --> 00:00:21.660 looking good there. Ray, any thoughts today on this beautiful Wednesday afternoon on the live 00:00:21.660 --> 00:00:27.660 stream? I can't tell you, man. We are doing everything we can to speed up ending 2020. 00:00:27.980 --> 00:00:34.220 Christmas gear is going up before Thanksgiving. You know, we're already doing our New Year's 00:00:34.220 --> 00:00:38.880 countdown in the DeArmis household. I'm pretty sure that by Friday, we'll be counting down 2021. So 00:00:38.880 --> 00:00:45.000 the future is here, my friends. We are already there. That's a beautiful thing. Listen, 2020, 00:00:45.640 --> 00:00:50.400 you know, there's a scary thought. I don't want to get stuck here. But what if 2020 is not the bad 00:00:50.400 --> 00:00:55.740 year? What if 2020 is just the beginning of a bad decade? I don't necessarily want to like, 00:00:55.960 --> 00:01:02.920 get stuck on that. But it's a reality of, hey, let's really hope that 2021 can turn the corner 00:01:02.920 --> 00:01:09.660 here for us. But seven years, guys, seven years for all of our eschatology folks. What is happening? 00:01:09.940 --> 00:01:16.580 What is happening? Well played. So that, like I said, is a completely separate conversation here. 00:01:16.700 --> 00:01:21.940 Hey, listen, with the beta show, we answer your questions. Online ministry, church online, 00:01:22.540 --> 00:01:26.560 digital church, digital only expressions of church, digital church. If you're doing an online 00:01:26.560 --> 00:01:30.340 ministry, you've got questions on it. Where's your leadership getting stuck? Where are you getting 00:01:30.340 --> 00:01:38.300 stuck? We want to help answer that. Text us these questions at, for the church, 484-324-8724. 00:01:38.580 --> 00:01:43.780 Literally, take out your phone, text us, unless you're watching on your phone, and then wait till 00:01:43.780 --> 00:01:50.840 after the show. And then text us your questions, 484-324-8724. Well, this is episode six. We've 00:01:50.840 --> 00:01:54.720 been rolling through this. We're having a lot of fun with it. Here, in this episode, here's the 00:01:54.720 --> 00:02:02.540 question, basically, that we're asking. How can I help leadership see bigger, bolder ideas? And I hear 00:02:02.540 --> 00:02:08.680 this. This is a recurring question, at least, that I'm engaging with. For practical, this is the question 00:02:08.680 --> 00:02:16.260 that was texted in to us. Feels like our leadership is falling in love with our old ways. It's familiar, 00:02:16.840 --> 00:02:24.120 it's easy, and it's safe. How do I get my ministry leaders and leadership team on board with bigger 00:02:24.120 --> 00:02:30.540 and bolder ideas? And so there's a lot to unpack there. Ray, just kind of walking into this, man, 00:02:30.540 --> 00:02:37.200 what are you thinking about this? I think that this is something, you know, this question needs to be 00:02:37.200 --> 00:02:40.660 unpacked in so many different ways, because different people are asking this in different 00:02:40.660 --> 00:02:45.420 organizations, not even realizing and not giving their leadership enough credit in terms of how 00:02:45.420 --> 00:02:50.580 much they may have pivoted in 2020. Like, it's really easy to just look ahead and say, man, my 00:02:50.580 --> 00:02:55.460 leadership is trying to run away from new ideas, not even realizing, like, how much things that they may 00:02:55.460 --> 00:03:01.640 have already shifted in 2020. And so before we go bashing on, on, hey, man, we want to innovate, 00:03:01.720 --> 00:03:05.680 we want to move forward. Let's take a moment and even, and even in your own leadership, like 00:03:05.680 --> 00:03:10.080 acknowledge the changes that your leadership has been willing to make in the pivoting that they've 00:03:10.080 --> 00:03:16.500 done this year, because I guarantee you every leader is dealing with pressure in terms of the unknown 00:03:16.500 --> 00:03:20.900 and the uncertainty that they've had to deal with 2020. So before we go criticizing our leaders, 00:03:20.900 --> 00:03:25.780 let's also celebrate the pivoting and the adjustments that they've made this year, because I guarantee 00:03:25.780 --> 00:03:29.480 you, especially for those of us that are like an online ministry, like we're always trying to push 00:03:29.480 --> 00:03:33.140 innovation. We're always trying to push what's new, but let's also take a moment and celebrate the 00:03:33.140 --> 00:03:36.680 innovation that they've done too. Right, Jeff? I mean, let's, let's be real. It's been a year of change. 00:03:37.340 --> 00:03:44.340 Yeah, very well said. Every playbook, every training session, every learning that your leaders 00:03:44.340 --> 00:03:51.520 understood up until March, 2020 was teaching towards a different direction. And it's all trash 00:03:51.520 --> 00:03:57.700 at this point, every playbook, every strategy, everything needs, needs to get revisited. And, 00:03:57.700 --> 00:04:03.260 and people, some people are processing that well, to be honest, some people are struggling through 00:04:03.260 --> 00:04:07.660 this season. And, and so, and really like this gets us here to, to point one that I wanted to 00:04:07.660 --> 00:04:13.960 acknowledge here. Recognize where your leadership is. That may not be hard, but then the next step of 00:04:13.960 --> 00:04:21.700 why they are there. Don't just look at your leadership as saying, they're not this, but start 00:04:21.700 --> 00:04:29.240 to unpack why are they taking the stance, the position that, that they are. And the more that you can 00:04:29.240 --> 00:04:35.800 understand the, not only the, who they are, but why they are that way, it gives opportunities to 00:04:35.800 --> 00:04:42.040 engage with them to, to try to get there. So Ray, you know, just what experiences have you had in, 00:04:42.040 --> 00:04:48.100 in your ministry life where, you know, not only are you recognizing kind of like where, but, but also 00:04:48.100 --> 00:04:53.020 helping leadership understand or recognizing why the leadership is the way they are. 00:04:53.600 --> 00:04:57.780 Yeah. You know, this kind of brings me back to an old maxim that I'd heard back in the day that 00:04:57.780 --> 00:05:03.420 when people don't know what to do, they do what they know. And when you have so much success doing 00:05:03.420 --> 00:05:08.700 something a certain way and everything has to shift and then things kind of come back to what, 00:05:08.700 --> 00:05:13.160 what we may be considering normal. Of course, it's easy to want to run back to what was. And mind you, 00:05:13.220 --> 00:05:19.080 that is not unique to church. I mean, let me help you understand that. That is not unique to our way 00:05:19.080 --> 00:05:24.480 of life or to our, to our little part of the world that's in business. That's in so many different 00:05:24.480 --> 00:05:27.680 areas. And for some of you, that's even your households, right? Like we're having a hard time. 00:05:27.780 --> 00:05:32.760 We're navigating Thanksgiving right now with, with 2020 and with COVID because man, we want to run 00:05:32.760 --> 00:05:36.500 back to our traditional Thanksgiving, but we're recognizing, we're all hurting in the sense of, 00:05:36.580 --> 00:05:41.200 but what if we can't and how can we protect the most vulnerable among us and doing that? And so 00:05:41.200 --> 00:05:45.200 we have to recognize that, yeah, there's a lot of shifts and we have to recognize, and we have to, 00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:49.080 this is going to require some open and honest conversations with leadership and just ask, okay, 00:05:49.220 --> 00:05:53.980 so you guys were used to the old way of doing this. What is it about the old way that makes it seem so 00:05:53.980 --> 00:05:57.960 successful? And it's not that I'm trying to win you to a new way, but you have to remember that it's all 00:05:57.960 --> 00:06:03.200 about the mission and vision of the church. It's not just about the mission and vision of online and 00:06:03.200 --> 00:06:07.720 digital. This is where the whole digital thing comes into play, right, Jeff? And this is where we talk 00:06:07.720 --> 00:06:13.200 about making sure that your online campus or that your online ministry isn't separate and that you're 00:06:13.200 --> 00:06:17.700 trying to go so far different from what the church as a whole is trying to do. You have to be 00:06:17.700 --> 00:06:22.080 alignment in terms of where your leadership is. So if they're trying to retreat back to what was, 00:06:22.640 --> 00:06:26.160 recognize that it's probably because there was some kind of comfort or something in that. I know that 00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:30.240 there were areas where we tried to run back, you know, as soon as we reopened, we were like, oh man, 00:06:30.260 --> 00:06:34.800 we need to run back to some different way, some ways that we used to do things. And even it took some 00:06:34.800 --> 00:06:40.480 time and recognizing, oh, wait a minute, we're not there anymore. We're not there anymore. And our 00:06:40.480 --> 00:06:45.240 leadership took a long pause and they said, hey, look, you know what? We're not there anymore. We need 00:06:45.240 --> 00:06:50.800 to make sure that we go back and we reassess and we even retool and think through what does it 00:06:50.800 --> 00:06:55.520 mean to minister into the here and now? Things like, hey, so, you know, coming up this week, 00:06:55.540 --> 00:06:59.860 we're going to be doing our typical Thanksgiving serve. Oh, but not as many people are ready and 00:06:59.860 --> 00:07:04.180 willing to serve. So what can we do to meet some of those needs and to engage people where they're at? 00:07:04.700 --> 00:07:10.740 Those are things that we have to stop, reassess and retool and rethink instead of running back to 00:07:10.740 --> 00:07:14.260 what was, because that was comfortable and think about what we're moving forward. Jeff, what are some 00:07:14.260 --> 00:07:19.980 things that you're seeing from different churches out there? Yeah. Understanding that why is crucial 00:07:19.980 --> 00:07:27.780 because there's a reason they're thinking that way. You know, it's the church may, the leader may not 00:07:27.780 --> 00:07:34.260 understand the role of digital. He may be looking at the staff structure that's in place and saying, 00:07:34.320 --> 00:07:41.040 we don't have the personnel to go down this way. There may be a bias of someone else that's in leadership 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:49.660 or an elder board or a high level donor who has a bias and an overstressing towards a physical 00:07:49.660 --> 00:07:54.380 engagement instead of a digital. And so there's lots of, you know, sometimes we're getting into like 00:07:54.380 --> 00:07:58.880 the political nature of church. Sometimes it's just, hey, I don't really understand this digital 00:07:58.880 --> 00:08:05.600 thing and I'm not comfortable as a leader showing weakness in learning something different. I really 00:08:05.600 --> 00:08:10.900 want to operate in my strengths and therefore we all need to be operating in this physical space. 00:08:11.120 --> 00:08:15.940 And so there's, there's a why that's centered around it. And oftentimes when I have these 00:08:15.940 --> 00:08:23.080 conversations right to your question with other churches, it's the, the, the leader needs help 00:08:23.080 --> 00:08:28.420 in understanding it, but oftentimes doesn't, isn't comfortable asking those questions, isn't 00:08:28.420 --> 00:08:35.580 comfortable being transparent, isn't comfortable being vulnerable, even to the point. And so this is why, 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:42.120 for, for you listening audience out there, people who are at that level, understanding the why, 00:08:42.540 --> 00:08:48.180 why your leader is, is thinking the way that he is, which really gets into the second part, 00:08:48.680 --> 00:08:53.900 figuring out how your different ideas, or the ideas that you're pushing for, can help solve the 00:08:53.900 --> 00:08:59.320 problems, can help accomplish the mission, the vision, need to be integrated into the strategy 00:08:59.320 --> 00:09:05.460 of your church. Don't just push a good idea because it's, it's great. Hey, listen, if you're a physical 00:09:05.460 --> 00:09:11.020 church out there, you don't have an online presence and your solution is, Hey, I think we should start 00:09:11.020 --> 00:09:17.000 broadcasting on Twitch. Um, yeah, that's probably not going to help the mission and vision. It's a great 00:09:17.000 --> 00:09:22.040 idea and there's a wind towards it, but it's not aligning with the mission and vision probably 00:09:22.040 --> 00:09:29.100 of, of what your, your church is doing. And so mirror and mold what you're doing with what the 00:09:29.100 --> 00:09:32.820 problems and the issues that, that your leaders are facing, right? What are you thinking? 00:09:33.100 --> 00:09:39.120 Yeah. Well, it's that, and, and let's be honest, Jeff, influence comes with small wins stacked up 00:09:39.120 --> 00:09:43.860 one on top of the other. And so you have to go back and reassess your own leadership and ask yourself, 00:09:44.020 --> 00:09:48.300 well, how am I coming through on the things that I'm being asked before I bring my leadership, 00:09:48.300 --> 00:09:53.120 a whole lot of innovation? Like it's one thing to say, Hey, look, like we want to get all this stuff 00:09:53.120 --> 00:09:58.360 in line. We want to get all these new, uh, details in line. We want to be on Twitch. We want to be on, 00:09:58.360 --> 00:10:02.840 you know, name it, whatever kind of innovation you're trying to push, man. We want to live stream. 00:10:02.940 --> 00:10:07.540 We want to do something else, but your leadership has asked you to come through on some basic things 00:10:07.540 --> 00:10:13.160 like, Hey, is our message archive up online? Uh, you know, have we made sure that, that we're organized, 00:10:13.160 --> 00:10:17.400 that things are up to date, things are looking nice or, or Hey, like there's spelling errors on the 00:10:17.400 --> 00:10:22.120 website, you know, like, and you're over that. Or are you making sure and coming through on some of 00:10:22.120 --> 00:10:29.260 those basic procedures before you go and bring some grandiose idea? Because if you're not executing in 00:10:29.260 --> 00:10:34.760 the simple or to put it in a spiritual way, if you're not stewarding the small, how can you be 00:10:34.760 --> 00:10:39.700 trusted with much more? Right. And so this is where we have to be careful because as innovators, 00:10:39.800 --> 00:10:44.300 sometimes many folks are trying to push what's new, what's next on, on leadership, but leadership is 00:10:44.300 --> 00:10:48.100 still back here. Like, all right, but man, how can I trust you with that? If we're still trying to get 00:10:48.100 --> 00:10:53.200 some of the basics now from what they may perceive, what they may perceive as the basics. And to you, 00:10:53.280 --> 00:10:58.400 especially if you're, you know, a reckless creator in the sense of, man, I just want to break stuff and 00:10:58.400 --> 00:11:03.180 I want to try new things. That doesn't sound as sexy to you because man, that's maintenance, 00:11:03.180 --> 00:11:07.620 but I'm talking about leading down a new front. Okay. But your leader may need you to go back 00:11:07.620 --> 00:11:12.040 and help solve some of those problems. Exactly what Jeff's talking about. Solve some of those issues 00:11:12.040 --> 00:11:15.400 that they're saying, like, you may want to innovate in a specific area, but they're still trying to 00:11:15.400 --> 00:11:20.180 figure out, Hey, but we're still trying to transition people to online giving. How are you helping us 00:11:20.180 --> 00:11:24.840 with that area? See, I saw Jeff smile real big right there. I know I must have tweaked something 00:11:24.840 --> 00:11:30.020 there. Go ahead. Well, and it really does come down to understanding. This is part of it. 00:11:30.260 --> 00:11:36.000 Understanding where the leadership is. Leading from the second chair was a book. I don't know, 00:11:36.000 --> 00:11:41.840 I've read a decade ago, but it talks about get the wins that you want, but to do that, you have to give 00:11:41.840 --> 00:11:47.200 the wins that your leadership wants. And so like, if, if the challenge is online giving, 00:11:47.200 --> 00:11:53.960 how can online groups reinforce online giving? How can streaming online, how can online discipleship 00:11:53.960 --> 00:12:01.860 reinforce this change the way that you're, you're pitching this in such a way that it meets the needs 00:12:01.860 --> 00:12:07.820 of where leadership is? By the way, Chuck Brady comments in through Facebook, love this modern 00:12:07.820 --> 00:12:14.200 technology thing. He says, I fully agree, meet them where they're at and how to help them move into 00:12:14.200 --> 00:12:20.340 a place of, of understanding. And so like, listen, I've been the guy, thanks Chuck for that. I've been 00:12:20.340 --> 00:12:26.860 the guy over the years that just like, like with a sledgehammer tries to bang in ideas. I'm always the 00:12:26.860 --> 00:12:32.820 bleeding edge tech guy. I'm always talking about the thing out of left field. And so lots of times 00:12:32.820 --> 00:12:36.840 people don't understand that. And there've been seasons in my life where I just keep hammering the 00:12:36.840 --> 00:12:41.040 same nail over and over again, thinking that it's going to work. And you know what, at the end of 00:12:41.040 --> 00:12:46.460 the day, it really, it doesn't, it doesn't work. When you acknowledge where the people are and change 00:12:46.460 --> 00:12:52.460 the approach that way, that's where you really start to see engagement. When you talk to them, 00:12:52.460 --> 00:12:58.320 when you engage with them, it's, it's honestly, it's the whole two-way engagement thing versus a 00:12:58.320 --> 00:13:05.240 one-way just kind of talking at them approach. Yeah. You know, Jeff, and this is kind of, 00:13:05.320 --> 00:13:11.040 it takes me back in time to when, when Steve Jobs unveiled the iPad before his passing, he talked 00:13:11.040 --> 00:13:17.660 about how the iPhone was setting up for that moment, you know? And, and I remember that because 00:13:17.660 --> 00:13:24.520 they had to get that so right in order to help transition people over that it had to be a way 00:13:24.520 --> 00:13:29.580 that wasn't just innovative, but it had to work. It had to work in every facet. It had to execute on 00:13:29.580 --> 00:13:34.980 the simple. It had to be a phone that you could use and then it could become so much more. And so the 00:13:34.980 --> 00:13:40.740 same thing for us, Hey, innovation is wonderful, but you have to execute on what it is that you're 00:13:40.740 --> 00:13:45.520 promising. You have to be able to tell people, Hey, look, we're creating something simple. We're going to 00:13:45.520 --> 00:13:49.660 come through on it. And then from there, we're going to innovate and we're going to build on those 00:13:49.660 --> 00:13:56.720 wins. Definitely. And if you're Steve Jobs, you can execute. It's okay. Hey, listen to this up front. 00:13:56.840 --> 00:14:01.700 And if you're Steve Jobs, maybe this doesn't apply to you. I'm sorry. No offense. The majority of you 00:14:01.700 --> 00:14:08.800 out there are not Steve Jobs, uh, doing this well, figuring out how to speak to leaders, figuring out 00:14:08.800 --> 00:14:14.100 where the leaders, where their whys are doing, it takes more than one person dialogue with other 00:14:14.100 --> 00:14:22.580 people on your staff, um, high level volunteers, and also be willing to reshape the idea. Don't come in 00:14:22.580 --> 00:14:28.280 once again, trying to fit the square peg into the round hole, recognize it's a round hole and treat 00:14:28.280 --> 00:14:34.400 it more like clay, treat the idea more like fluid to massage it, to get to where that accomplishes what 00:14:34.400 --> 00:14:40.280 the leaders are looking for. And also accomplishes what you're trying to achieve through it. Find ways 00:14:40.280 --> 00:14:48.460 to work together in this, which is true. Go ahead. Anything? Yeah. And, and it's not about getting a 00:14:48.460 --> 00:14:53.500 higher position at the table. I need to be sure and kind of state this because so often when, when 00:14:53.500 --> 00:14:57.780 people feel like, Oh man, my ideas aren't being heard or, you know, we're not innovating the way 00:14:57.780 --> 00:15:01.860 that I want. It's not necessarily that you need a higher position at the table. It's that you need to 00:15:01.860 --> 00:15:06.480 expand your influence with the people that are there making those decisions. You need to make sure that 00:15:06.480 --> 00:15:12.780 they see that your wins are their wins and that it's all of us winning together. Um, and so this isn't 00:15:12.780 --> 00:15:18.040 about, Oh man, I need more political power within the organization. It's about, are you leveraging the 00:15:18.040 --> 00:15:23.580 influence that you have? And are you growing in that influence one win at a time? Totally. And 00:15:23.580 --> 00:15:29.540 completely be willing to be wrong. Once again, if you're being transparent, you're bringing others, 00:15:29.540 --> 00:15:35.460 people into, into the conversations, be willing to be wrong. Maybe that square peg just does not need to 00:15:35.460 --> 00:15:42.120 fit into that round hole, but also be willing to make others the hero of the situation. Um, and it's funny 00:15:42.120 --> 00:15:48.840 with that humility, with that, that relational leadership approach, you'll find that others will get more on 00:15:48.840 --> 00:15:54.860 board with ideas in the, in the weeks and the months and the years ahead. If all you are is the grumpy guy 00:15:54.860 --> 00:15:59.940 who's screaming about the bleeding edge tech, you're never going to get there. But if you're part of a team 00:15:59.940 --> 00:16:04.880 that's working towards something and if you're making others, the hero in that operating and humility, 00:16:04.880 --> 00:16:09.780 my gosh, you're going to see such a difference in pushing those ideas forward, right? You had 00:16:09.780 --> 00:16:14.320 something else? Yeah. And part of being willing to be wrong is admitting when you are wrong. 00:16:14.880 --> 00:16:19.820 And so you have to make sure and have the humility that, Hey, if you lead on a project and it doesn't 00:16:19.820 --> 00:16:23.720 work out, or if it doesn't work out the way that it was intended, obviously you don't want to over-promise 00:16:23.720 --> 00:16:28.360 and under deliver, but if you projected something and if it doesn't come through in that kind of way, 00:16:28.360 --> 00:16:32.600 you have to be, you have to be humble and go back to your leadership and say, Hey, I know that we 00:16:32.600 --> 00:16:37.040 thought it was going to do this. Uh, you may have had data saying that it was going to be the biggest 00:16:37.040 --> 00:16:42.780 thing, you know, since sliced bread, but the execution just didn't come through. Okay. Be humble, 00:16:42.980 --> 00:16:47.260 admit it and own it because that is once again, how you grow in your leadership and how you grow in your 00:16:47.260 --> 00:16:52.300 influence is when you can actually admit that you're wrong and not just move on to the next thing and act 00:16:52.300 --> 00:16:59.740 like that thing didn't exist. Yeah. And part of making sure that you don't go wrong is this next 00:16:59.740 --> 00:17:06.400 slide right here. Experiment, iterate, fire the BBs before you get to the bullets, fire the bullets 00:17:06.400 --> 00:17:13.180 before you get to the bombs, like grow the thing slowly. So often, especially in this COVID season, 00:17:13.180 --> 00:17:17.920 it's easy to look at scenarios and say, the end of the world is here. We have to pivot everything. 00:17:18.120 --> 00:17:21.860 We've got to burn our buildings. We've got to go a hundred percent digital. We've got to, 00:17:21.860 --> 00:17:27.260 and you live in this world of extremes because right now in 2020 fall, it's an extreme world that 00:17:27.260 --> 00:17:34.860 we live in. But I want to challenge you guys, pump the brakes, slow down, iterate, experiment with 00:17:34.860 --> 00:17:39.620 something. Did it work? Did it not work? And what's happening is not only are you fine tuning, 00:17:39.620 --> 00:17:45.780 like the idea of, of what you're trying to achieve to make sure that it'll work by iterating, 00:17:45.780 --> 00:17:51.320 by firing the BBs before bullets, you're building culture. Cause at the end of the day, 00:17:51.320 --> 00:17:56.340 you can have all the technology that you want. You can have all the functionality that you want, 00:17:56.340 --> 00:18:02.060 but if you don't have a church culture that's supporting it, that is understanding it, 00:18:02.180 --> 00:18:06.860 that's utilizing it effectively out there with the, with the people they're engaging with, 00:18:07.060 --> 00:18:12.800 without that culture, it's your, the idea is going to die. And so by going slowly, 00:18:12.800 --> 00:18:19.060 by taking leadership, by taking your staff, by taking volunteers through these experiments and 00:18:19.060 --> 00:18:23.940 letting them speak into it, by firing the BB before the bullet, you're going to find that 00:18:23.940 --> 00:18:28.600 you're changing and developing the culture as well as fine tuning the ideas on this. 00:18:29.060 --> 00:18:33.800 Yeah. And you know, this is where it gets tough, right? Because so many times people are thinking 00:18:33.800 --> 00:18:38.040 about bombs. They're thinking about full blown, full scale measures. They're going to cost a lot 00:18:38.040 --> 00:18:41.500 of money and this kind of thing. But what if for once you thought through how tech could save your 00:18:41.500 --> 00:18:47.140 organization money, as opposed to spending a lot more money, you know, for us coming back from 00:18:47.140 --> 00:18:53.700 COVID. Um, and you know, we had an opportunity to really hone in. We're a note-taking church here at 00:18:53.700 --> 00:18:59.020 Christ fellowship and the thought process of pre COVID of getting rid of the written worship folder 00:18:59.020 --> 00:19:06.520 was scary because that was something that was very, very difficult to move. Um, but with COVID in play, 00:19:06.520 --> 00:19:11.760 we had already established a note-taking section within the app that was already robust. That was 00:19:11.760 --> 00:19:16.960 already working fine so that it was already kind of firing the BB while we were closed and that we got 00:19:16.960 --> 00:19:22.160 people to use to doing this so that when we reopened, guess what? We can't hand out physical 00:19:22.160 --> 00:19:27.300 worship folders anymore anyways. So now the cost of printing, we're saving our organization money 00:19:27.300 --> 00:19:32.220 on that end. And at the same time, we were able to help transition this out. And we've got a great 00:19:32.220 --> 00:19:36.840 reason as to why we can't hand those things out either. Um, now on one side, we're saving the 00:19:36.840 --> 00:19:41.220 church, a lot of printing costs. And I hope that our church, you know, our, our church recognizes that 00:19:41.220 --> 00:19:44.580 on one end, because guess what? Printing those worship folders out week to week. Some of you are 00:19:44.580 --> 00:19:47.560 probably thinking that like you're either doing that yourself or you're going through a service 00:19:47.560 --> 00:19:53.820 that costs a lot of money versus the one-time cost of the app that we just, you know, encourage people 00:19:53.820 --> 00:19:57.520 to download every week. They can engage in so many different ways on our church, but at the same 00:19:57.520 --> 00:20:01.760 time, they can take those notes, they can save them. They can share them with a friend. It's digital. 00:20:01.880 --> 00:20:06.540 They can go back to them instead of losing those worship folders week to week. It's a better option, 00:20:06.700 --> 00:20:13.060 but it took firing the BB during COVID to make sure that by the time we got to the bomb, when we reopened, 00:20:13.240 --> 00:20:20.320 it was fine. And thank God it was. Very, very good with that. So experiment, find, and even things, 00:20:20.400 --> 00:20:28.260 you know, short of, of, uh, you know, COVID, a global epidemic, um, getting rid of the worship folders 00:20:28.260 --> 00:20:34.120 at Price Fellowship Miami would have been very hard to do. So there are things that you can wipe, uh, 00:20:34.120 --> 00:20:39.900 with a big slate and, and blame the global pandemic for it. Uh, but there are probably some things that 00:20:39.900 --> 00:20:46.280 it's like, Hey, I need to, we need to do a trial run on this. Um, let's, let's try doing the mobile 00:20:46.280 --> 00:20:51.460 app thing, but let's just try it on one campus or, Hey, let's, you know, for a couple services, 00:20:51.460 --> 00:20:56.040 let's just not print the worship folders and see what happens, what the, what the feedback is. 00:20:56.260 --> 00:21:02.060 Try to figure out, once again, the show is called beta. We need to figure out how to beta the ideas 00:21:02.060 --> 00:21:08.440 that you're wanting to do. What are small, simple approaches that can give you a basic amount of 00:21:08.440 --> 00:21:15.380 information, feedback from people that will allow you to make a decision to iterate, to build on the 00:21:15.380 --> 00:21:23.100 idea again. And so once again, now it's, let's find this idea that you want to do, figure out how to 00:21:23.100 --> 00:21:29.620 do it with a small number of people to pull in the data that's necessary for you to iterate and figure out 00:21:29.620 --> 00:21:36.700 what the next step is. So definitely love this idea of beta of experimenting, of, of wrestling with this 00:21:36.700 --> 00:21:43.240 stuff within the churches that, that you are. There's, there's no idea that's too bold in 2020 00:21:43.240 --> 00:21:49.920 that your church should not consider. But if the first step is we need to blow up, we need to bring 00:21:49.920 --> 00:21:55.180 in the bombs. We got to explode this thing and we need to rebuild it from scratch. Leadership ain't buying 00:21:55.180 --> 00:22:00.760 that. If it's, Hey man, here's an experiment. Let's try this. Here's the little bit of money. 00:22:00.760 --> 00:22:05.260 Here's the little bit of personnel. Here's the little bit of volunteer support. Here's the plan. 00:22:05.260 --> 00:22:11.700 And now you're iterating slowly on those ideas. That's how a church wins. That's how a church changes 00:22:11.700 --> 00:22:18.580 culture here in mid post COVID 2020. And so I would challenge all of you out there. I think that's 00:22:18.580 --> 00:22:23.920 really the challenge we should look at. So, Hey Ray, as we're landing the plane, um, any, 00:22:24.040 --> 00:22:28.880 anything on your end? Absolutely. Leadership is not the enemy in this. And I just want to make sure 00:22:28.880 --> 00:22:33.120 that that's understood. You know, it's very easy for people to draw lines when they want to innovate, 00:22:33.120 --> 00:22:39.100 like it's an us versus them kind of thing. Listen, it's a team, it's a together thing. And so make sure 00:22:39.100 --> 00:22:45.200 and work with your leadership as best as possible. And granted, you know, it, the greatest technology 00:22:45.200 --> 00:22:51.140 innovations may not come from the church anytime soon. That might not be our job, but it can be 00:22:51.140 --> 00:22:55.920 our job to leverage them for the purpose of what, for creating community. And the way that that happens 00:22:55.920 --> 00:23:00.380 is first with the community of your collective leadership, you've got to win them over within 00:23:00.380 --> 00:23:06.440 community and then slowly build on stuff. Last time we have, we heavily publicized, uh, Craig Groeschel's 00:23:06.440 --> 00:23:10.380 leadership podcast, Jessica did a deal about leading up. Let me encourage you once again, 00:23:10.400 --> 00:23:14.360 if you've not checked out that episode, uh, you need to check that out simply because you need to 00:23:14.360 --> 00:23:18.280 understand that your leadership needs you to lead up to it. That's why they brought you in there. 00:23:18.280 --> 00:23:23.980 You are there to lead up. I'm here at Christ fellowship to lead up in digital. Are, is it always 00:23:23.980 --> 00:23:29.100 going to be a hundred percent accepted or as a win? Absolutely not. Have I had room to fail? Yeah, 00:23:29.280 --> 00:23:34.520 I have. And so this is where it's my responsibility. It's your responsibility to stack one win at a time, 00:23:34.520 --> 00:23:39.020 but to do it together with leadership, not to rebel and go off into my own corner and do it 00:23:39.020 --> 00:23:45.340 separately. Very true. It's working together as a team and it's, it's breaking down some of those 00:23:45.340 --> 00:23:50.060 departmental organizational silos that you guys may have within the church, working together 00:23:50.060 --> 00:23:56.140 as a team, casting vision, and then attacking it with that approach, being flexible, uh, all along 00:23:56.140 --> 00:24:00.980 the way. So well said, Hey, listen, we're, we're going to wrap here. If you've got questions, 00:24:01.140 --> 00:24:08.720 text us 404-324-8724. Be sure to check out beta episode five as Ray was talking about, but Hey, 00:24:08.920 --> 00:24:14.640 we're going to, we're 2020 is crazy, right? Like it's been an insane year. It's been nuts. So we're 00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:21.380 going to pivot a little bit here next week. We're not beta. We're, we're debuting cray. So it's crazy. 00:24:21.840 --> 00:24:27.100 Same similar format, but at the end of the, we're talking about crazy, crazy things because listen, 00:24:27.100 --> 00:24:32.400 we need a break at the end of this. We need to figure out cray. We need to figure out how to be 00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:37.280 crazy, relax, have a little fun. So we're bringing in some guys, Ray. We're going to be joined by Andy 00:24:37.280 --> 00:24:42.680 Mage, Mark Brandt, some digital pastors around the country for Cray01. We are figuring out what the 00:24:42.680 --> 00:24:48.400 perfect Thanksgiving dinner is. So heading into the Turkey holiday here. Sorry. If you're in another 00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:53.880 country here in America, we're debuting Turkey and celebrating that next Thursday. So the Wednesday 00:24:53.880 --> 00:25:00.420 heading into it, Turkey day, Eve, the perfect Thanksgiving dinner broadcast live here. Yeah. 00:25:00.460 --> 00:25:06.820 Cause I need a break and so do you. So, Hey, Jeff for Ray, this is Jeff with the church digital 00:25:06.820 --> 00:25:11.200 stadium church planning. Thanks for being here. And we'll see you next time here on, well, I guess 00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:12.480 Cray. Have a good one. 00:25:12.580 --> 00:25:12.940 On Cray.