WEBVTT

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 Hey, we're going to get you to that podcast in one second, but before we get there, I,

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 Jeff Reed, the Church Digital, Stadia Church Planning, I wanted to have a conversation with

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 you, churches that are out there. One of the greatest things I arguably think that I've done

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 in my life, other than married and kids, okay, that aside, one of the greatest ministry things

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 I've ever done is this idea of the fidgetal learning communities that we are offering

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 through Stadia Church Planning. We want to help you. We want to help your church learn to thrive,

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 grow, and multiply digitally, physically, as well as digitally. We've seen about 200 churches go

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 through this already, and it's been a phenomenal result of it. Culture is changing within these

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 churches. They're understanding what it is to thrive. They're understanding how to grow people,

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 how to grow their church, even in the midst of this COVID, not COVID, wherever we are in the season,

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 and they're even starting to understand what it means to multiply in fidgetal space. There's no secret

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 sauce to doing a digital strategy. There's no secret sauce to doing a fidgetal strategy. There's no

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 secret sauce to making your church thrive, grow, and multiply. It takes work. I'm not going to lie,

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 but through the framework, through the questions, through the learning communities,

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 we connect you with churches. We give you some content. We coach you along the way to help you

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 make the decisions that you need to make so that your church's strategy can thrive, grow, and multiply

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 your church along the way. This is a great opportunity for your church. We would love to have you be a part

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 of it. For more information, check out StadiaChurchPlanning.org slash fidgetal, P-H-Y-G-I-T-A-L.

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 All right. Hey, that's it. We're going to get you back to that episode right now.

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 Hey, we got Beta Show, episode 15 here. I'm Jeff with the Church.Digital, Stadia Church Planning.

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 It's awesome to be with you. Now, hey, we're experimenting with the Beta Show. I think

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 we've got license. The show is literally called Beta. So, of course, we're going to experiment.

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 Of course, we're going to try something different. We're going to iterate. We tell you guys, we tell

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 churches, we tell digital pastors, lead pastors, you need to iterate. So, of course, we're going to

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 iterate and learn through it. I got to be honest with you. 15 episodes in here with Beta Show, and

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 I'm learning something. I love the Clubhouse platform. Now, the ability to engage, to dialogue

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 with people, to learn, to let others speak into situations and environments, to get Q&A, to

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 interact. I mean, literally, verbally hear people's voices talking. It's an incredible platform.

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 I loved it very much. And so, we're going to experiment in the next couple of weeks, months

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 with moving the Beta Show onto the Clubhouse platform. Here's what we're going to do.

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 We will record weekly, Thursday, 5 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. Every Thursday, 5 p.m. Eastern,

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 we will do a show on Clubhouse. Check us out on social media, thechurch.digital, me at Deerfedge,

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 Jeffrey backwards, and you will get information on the show, the link, whatever. But you can guarantee

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 it. We will be Clubhouse, 5 p.m. Eastern, always doing a show. And so, we will not only do that,

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 we invite people to come into Clubhouse. The reason we're doing a Clubhouse is because we want to hear

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 you. We want to answer your questions. We want to make this as practical and as real for you as

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 possible, not just spout philosophy. We do the philosophy through the Church Digital Podcast.

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 We really want with the Beta Show to interact. So, we want that live audience feel that Clubhouse

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 offers so well. Now, I hear you. Android audiences out there are people that are like,

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 Jeff, I don't want to download Clubhouse. But you have FOMO. You've got fear of missing out. You

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 don't want to miss the stuff that's happening. And so, similar to what we're doing with this episode

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 with Beta Episode 15, we're going to record Clubhouse, and we're going to make it available

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 on the podcast and maybe stream it later down the road. But definitely as an audio download on

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 podcast. So, if you're not able to join us in real time in that conversation in Clubhouse,

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 you still got access to the resources. So, those of the Android users who are out there right now who

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 are sending me hate mail that I've chosen a platform that they're not able to get on right now, relax.

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 It's okay. We got you covered. Majority of the conversations will make it to the podcast.

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 Life is good. We'll update you. And by the way, as soon as you get on Clubhouse, the better.

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 Okay. Awesome. Hey, so let's dig in specifically into Beta 15. I reached out to a friend, Jason Morris,

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 and said, Hey, Jason, I love the stuff that Westside Family is doing with this above the funnel. Thank you.

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 And let's talk about it. Now, above the funnel. Typically, pre-COVID 2019, churches, the front door,

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 the first step, the first place that they would really engage with, measure, track, keep track of a person

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 was that connection card. And it was somehow affiliated with a weekend service. Maybe even like

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 getting a kid checked in into the children's ministry, but it was centered around the one hour on Sunday,

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 right? And so now, 2021, and with the kind of the difficulties of engaging with people in the church

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 online service, really, we've seen some churches measure and start to work with and start to

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 intentionally develop relationships, call it above the funnel, above that weekend service. In other words,

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 like Westside Family is doing a lot in the space to develop relationships, discover people, engage with

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 people, build those relationships well before the one hour on Sunday. And that it's that intentionality

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 that's working very well for Westside beyond that one hour on Sunday, getting people connected into

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 groups, because really, those people are not watching church in isolation, even before they make it to the

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 church service. They're already connecting with people before they step foot physically or virtually

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 into that church service. And so it's this above the funnel thinking, really, that we wanted to start to

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 bring exposure to. Now there's typical Jason Morris, global innovations pastor over at Westside, typical

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 fashion for him. He's got so many resources. He's got so many vendors. He's got so many relationships.

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 And there's so many tools here, from a practical standpoint, that's going to help you. And there's,

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 we did Q&A at the end, like this was a phenomenal conversation. And I feel like it's a great first step

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 into this whole clubhouse beta show experiment that we're doing. So here for beta 15, once again,

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 I'm presenting Jason Morris, global innovations pastor, one of the OGs of church online from Westside

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 family into the conversation, Jeff, myself with the church digital and stated church planning, as well

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 as others from, from the audience in a conversation that I'm simply calling being the church above the

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 funnel. Okay, everybody, here you go. But hey, let's, let's dig in here. We've got,

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 got Jason Morris here, and looking forward to having a conversation. Yeah, thanks, man. Hey,

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 so let me lay the groundwork here. And then I'm going to just keep pinging people that are following

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 me and trying to bring some in. What we are trying to do. So we're going to, I'm recording this clubhouse

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 says that I have to put that disclaimer out there. And it's nice right on top of the screen. I'm

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 recording this, we're going to turn this into a podcast, maybe a live stream later on, because I'm

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 really hoping to have a solid conversation here. The heart of what we are trying to do as a church,

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 we want to connect with people that are, that are, that are called to Christ. We, there's, there's a

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 number, there's a large amount of outreach that we, the church, we're looking to do. And, and as a result

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 of this COVID season, not only are we struggling maybe to reach a new person, but we're even losing

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 the people that we are because they may or may not be disenfranchised with this whole, this whole

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 digital model. And so for me, I want to open up the conversation and, and, and I would love to hear

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 from Jason. And we, we sent an email trying to get some others to come in. Want to even hear from the

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 room, open up some insights that the challenge for me, when I look at this is, is that our, our weekend

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 services, essentially, we're the front door for our physical church services for decades. And I'm not

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 saying it wasn't working at the time. It probably was working effectively. Maybe it was diminishing

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 over the past decade. Like I said, attendance has been down, community influence has, has been down.

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 And so we're seeing the church really get devalued pre COVID leading into December, or excuse me,

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 February, 2020, when everything hit the fan as a result of COVID. So as, as a church, we're used to

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 that queen, that weekend service really shining. But what we're, we're finding is, is that, that weekend

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 service now coming out of COVID, it's struggling for a while. How do we, in physical space, maybe even

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 in digital space, how are we effectively reaching and connecting with those people? And I'll even throw

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 a stat here to back me up. It's sometimes I'm just talking crazy. Sometimes like there's legitimacy

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 behind it. So like Barna, December, 2020 did a digital church evangelism report and worked with,

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 with alpha on it. Jason, I'm sure you've, you've seen that or reference it, but what, what they found

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 was that 80% of people called to Christ who did not have a relationship with Christ, and we're not

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 connected to the church, 80% of those people don't give a garbage about a church service. Like if they

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 have spiritual questions, they're not going into a building or even an online service on a Sunday

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 morning to find out the spiritual answers for those questions. And so as we're trying to reach and

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 connect with people, maybe this Sunday morning service isn't, isn't the right thing to do. Maybe

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 there are other ways in digital environments and physical environments above that funnel where that

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 funnel would normally start. Maybe we can find a better way to connect. I want to throw it over to

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 Jason Morris. Hey man, as you're talking, as you're thinking, I know what I love about you is you've

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 already been kind of working above that funnel through Westside family as global innovations pastor

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 there. Like, what are you learning in this space? What are you seeing? Well, what, what I'm seeing is

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 kind of the, what the data bears out is, uh, the people that are coming back to church are church

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 people, those who are coming back. Um, now I do see new families coming in, but they are still churched

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 people. They might be coming in from other churches. This has done a big reset on a lot of things,

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 but who's not coming back are the people that hopefully we're burdened to reach in the first

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 place. Those who don't know Jesus yet. And so what, what I see in this scramble of, you know,

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 getting services online and, um, getting people back in the building and all of these things while

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 helpful doesn't address the bigger need. And the, the big thing that Jesus actually called us to do

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 was to go into all the world and make disciples of all nations and not necessarily make faithful

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 attenders of live religious community theater. So when, when I'm looking at this, I'm thinking, okay,

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 there are for us, like, for example, we've seen like a five X increase in, um, our counseling

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 department because of COVID. And, you know, those are folks just out in the community that are just

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 needing help in general. When we're talking about people that, um, are requesting help to talk with

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 somebody from ads like that CV outreach does, we're seeing, you know, we used to get like one or two a

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 week of those types of requests that are always fun conversations to have. Now we're getting like

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 five a day. So it's like going crazy. Now, none of these people, their, their first experience with

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 West side is not the church service. It is a human being that cares about them. And I feel like that

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 actually is probably maybe a more biblical way of approaching it. Just like Jesus said by this,

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 you know, you know, you know, they'll know you by your love. And so it's like, not that they'll know

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 you because of the nice building and church service, although those are wonderful tools to use. I think

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 that they have a different place in the discipleship continuum than they used to. But we're acting as if

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 they hold the same place as they used to when they don't anymore.

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 Hmm. Does that make sense? What I'm saying? I mean, as it came out, I wasn't sure

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 that it came out and made any sense or not. I like, well, a lot of times we, we feel like a church service

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 is supposed to do evangelistic work, like invest and invite style. Um, and it doesn't work for that

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 anymore. It works for other things wonderfully. Sometimes people look at, you know, a church service

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 as a discipleship tool and it can work for that. Although there are many other discipleship tools

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 that might work just as good or perhaps even better than a church service for that, uh, part of the

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 discipleship pathway. But what I'm talking about is that people's first interaction with faith is not

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 the church service anymore. And it probably never was. I think that we were kind of fooling ourselves

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 into thinking that people's first interaction with Jesus was through a church service when it probably

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 was through a believer first. Yeah. And what we're going to is we're, we're, we're rediscovering that

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 reality and saying, okay, if it's through a believer first, well then perhaps if we were to empower

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 believers to be salt and light where they are and, um, to help people that are in need, just like Jesus

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 did when he walked this earth and help them to just become like Jesus where they are, that is probably

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 way better anyway. It might leapfrog the whole church, invest, invite experience altogether because

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 the end result is for us to make disciples who make disciples.

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 And we're seeing this in, in real time. Like what you just described, Jason, like we're seeing

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 that come out factually that same Barna report. They, they interviewed people who were cold to Christ,

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 people who do not have a relationship with Jesus Christ, people who are not actively involved in

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 their church. And they asked when you have spiritual questions, where do you go? 40% of people who are

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 cold to Christ say that they will talk to friends that they see spirituality is important to. So in fact,

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 when people who are cold to Christ, when they are wanting to dialogue, when they are at the life's

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 hard point and they really want to have those conversations, they need help. They're going to

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 their friends. They're not going to a building. And what's fascinating to me, I want to also turn

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 the corner on this. Another 40% of people who are cold to Christ, who do not have a relationship with

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 Jesus, when they have those spiritual questions, they're going to Google. Exactly. Yeah. You know

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 what it's like? So, so that's what I love about some of these solutions that are out there like

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 glue connect and CV outreach is because when they're going to Google that then they will be introduced to

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 what could be a new friend. Yeah. So you're hitting both when you do that.

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 There needs to be intentionality. We talk a lot, you know, it's funny in this COVID season over the

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 past, can you believe it's almost been a year? Like the world was coming into an end early March,

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 2020, and we're just a couple of weeks away. You know, it's listen, the reality is a lot of our

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 digital strategy over the past year was spent on how do I get the stream? How do I chat? How do I, what's the

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 most effective connection card? And, and, and some of that may be valid. I don't, I don't want to demean the

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 service. I think the service, like you said earlier, we'll get there. I think it has a part, but I think there's a whole

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 other process that we need to start thinking about because if we really want to be effective in reaching

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 people in the future, it's not through our buildings. It's not setting up a system where one person standing

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 on a stage, exuding his spiritual gift in front of thousands. What we really need to start working on

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 is empowering our thousands to develop their spiritual gifts so that they can reach the tens of thousands

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 of people within their circle of influence. It's much better for us in this season. And I would argue,

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 even reverting back to a biblical standard of what was, and definitely it's going to be effective where

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 we're going, we need to start equipping people for these conversations, to be preparing them, to be

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 having them pray for opportunities to share with their people who don't know Christ. And to your point,

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 Jeff, I think that if you look at the prevailing model of church over the past two or three decades,

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 we were preparing people for a particular type of evangelistic style. It felt a lot like

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 partner with us. We're creating this church service, this moment for people. Partner with us by inviting

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 your friends. So over the past two or three decades, it's almost as if our people, the believers,

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 believers don't know how to lead people to Jesus anymore. They only know how to invite them to

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 church. And sometimes like when I'm talking with guys in the gym or whatever, they'll look at me

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 and the last thing they say, oh, you're just talking religious. You want me to go to your church? And I'm

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 like, I don't want you to go to my church. I don't want you to come to my church. I want you to come

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 to Jesus. You know, whether or not you go to church, that's on you, man. But Jesus is way more

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 important. But the problem is, is that we, we've done a lot of work training our people over the past

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 two or three decades to see inviting someone to church as their evangelism. And if that was our

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 whole strategy that worked for a long time, especially if we were any good at a church service,

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 that can work. But increasingly, especially now in COVID season, they don't want to come to church.

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 Even our own church people don't want to come to church because of all the weirdness. I mean,

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 only 30 to 40% are coming back. And those are church people, let alone the unchurched folks,

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 the people who they wouldn't even consider going to church to begin with. If someone invited them,

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 now there's so many more barriers that they have to go through in order to even show up. And even then,

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 in most cases, it's kind of a roll of the dice, whether or not it's going to actually meet their

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 needs or not. And that's one of the things that I feel is like missed opportunities where we use our

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 webpage or social media and all that to bring people to an event so that they could have an

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 experience so that maybe they can come to Jesus. And what I'm saying is just cut out the middleman.

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 Just do your social media and your webpage to bring people to Jesus, period. If they end up coming to

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 church or whatever, okay, fine. But that is part of the continuum afterwards, not the first thing that

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 they should do. You know, that's one of the organizations that has that mindset, and Jason,

00:20:00.120 --> 00:20:06.940
 I'm going to throw it right back to you, is this idea of CD outreach, where they work with churches

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 and funnel, create landing pages that funnels people, not necessarily into ministry, but answers some

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 of those questions that then later get some connected into ministry. Like I've, I've known them from the

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 outside for a while. I know, Jason, you're been much more active with CV outreach just for the room.

00:20:25.360 --> 00:20:29.300
 I mean, it's, it's a more practical approach, but let's dig in here. Talk a little bit about what

00:20:29.300 --> 00:20:35.240
 CV outreach is and how they can help in this type of situation. Well, what CV outreach does is they,

00:20:35.340 --> 00:20:44.540
 they do a lot of research on figuring out what types of keywords people are asking Google for,

00:20:44.540 --> 00:20:53.020
 for felt needs, and then serving up Google ads against those keywords and giving and pointing

00:20:53.020 --> 00:20:59.240
 them to Jesus. Giving people hope, especially in times like these, that's what people are searching

00:20:59.240 --> 00:21:05.360
 for. And so when they watch a video about how you can have hope. And if you'd like to talk to somebody,

00:21:05.360 --> 00:21:13.300
 you know, click this button. Well, what that does is that fires off an email to geofenced people that

00:21:13.300 --> 00:21:23.180
 are partners of CV outreach. And then, for example, we get a lot of people in the Kansas city metro,

00:21:23.180 --> 00:21:29.340
 actually it's bigger than that because we're getting people from Topeka, from, you know,

00:21:29.340 --> 00:21:37.660
 Great Bend, Lawrence, a lot of other places that are even two hours away. I'm getting emails saying,

00:21:37.820 --> 00:21:46.200
 Hey, you know, I'm considering, you know, suicidal ideation or my marriage is, is really having a rough

00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:52.540
 time with us in this COVID thing. And I need some help and some counseling, or I can't stand my kids

00:21:52.540 --> 00:21:57.340
 anymore, whatever it happens to be, right? Whatever that felt need happens to be that they were Googling

00:21:57.340 --> 00:22:06.040
 on, or that popped up on their Facebook feed. And so what I do at that point is I answer them back

00:22:06.040 --> 00:22:11.780
 with an email and say, Hey, so sorry to hear what's going on. You know, here's some of the ways that we

00:22:11.780 --> 00:22:18.600
 can help. Here's my phone number. I would love to have a conversation. You know, I would love to help in

00:22:18.600 --> 00:22:25.200
 any way we can. Here's the struggle that we have at this point. Our counseling team right now is

00:22:25.200 --> 00:22:31.600
 completely overwhelmed with the number of people that are needing, you know, mental health assistance

00:22:31.600 --> 00:22:39.980
 in this time. What from, and it's a whole spectrum of stuff. COVID has unearthed a lot of actual needs

00:22:39.980 --> 00:22:47.180
 needs that were under the surface being kind of maintained that now are just out in the open.

00:22:47.680 --> 00:22:53.040
 And so they, they've told me, they said, Hey, Jason, you know, before we could field all these

00:22:53.040 --> 00:22:59.720
 requests, but we're so overwhelmed, we can't anymore. And in my mind, I'm thinking, okay,

00:22:59.720 --> 00:23:06.760
 how do I manage the volume? And here's part of the dilemma that I have is I'm getting people from

00:23:06.760 --> 00:23:13.220
 all over the state of Kansas and in an online fashion. Yes, I can minister to them, but I would

00:23:13.220 --> 00:23:20.560
 much rather refer them to pastors in their area. But the problem is, is that there are churches that

00:23:20.560 --> 00:23:26.780
 don't know the CV outreach exists and they don't know how it can help their ministry, not to get them

00:23:26.780 --> 00:23:35.000
 necessarily into church, but to, to be Jesus for people that are in their city and just sit down and have,

00:23:35.120 --> 00:23:40.760
 I mean, I don't know of a pastor who would not love to have coffee with someone from the community

00:23:40.760 --> 00:23:48.260
 who is indeed, who would like to have some counsel. And, you know, like I said, you know, that would,

00:23:48.680 --> 00:23:54.180
 could be a lead that gets somebody into church, but I don't know that that is necessarily the,

00:23:54.180 --> 00:24:01.320
 the goal. The goal is to just help people. The goal is to be Jesus. Like you didn't see Jesus walking

00:24:01.320 --> 00:24:08.260
 around saying to the lame person, Hey, why don't you come to my healing service at the temple at nine

00:24:08.260 --> 00:24:14.320
 o'clock on Sunday? He didn't say that. You just healed him right then. And, you know, whatever the

00:24:14.320 --> 00:24:20.080
 need happened to be, he met it, he had compassion. And so I feel that that is the big opportunity for us

00:24:20.080 --> 00:24:27.300
 today is to show compassion to people, be human, you know, and double down on the relational side and

00:24:27.300 --> 00:24:34.380
 the human side of online ministry or on just church ministry in general. And you'll be way ahead of

00:24:34.380 --> 00:24:40.940
 where most people are at. Hmm. What, one of the things that just another quick question on CV Outreach

00:24:40.940 --> 00:24:46.980
 before we turn the corner here. My, my understanding is, is that it utilizes the Google grants. Like

00:24:46.980 --> 00:24:52.220
 there, there's an option. Google gives you, you know, I, hopefully this isn't a surprise. Google

00:24:52.220 --> 00:25:00.680
 gives churches, Google gives nonprofits $10,000 a month towards free AdWords. Now, if you are a

00:25:00.680 --> 00:25:08.540
 church that understands how to utilize Google and AdWords and create those accounts and market,

00:25:09.080 --> 00:25:16.000
 awesome. Do that. I can tell you just in my own experience, 98% of churches have no idea what I'm

00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:21.900
 just talking about. Yeah. I spent years doing it and it's, it's a full-time job like managing that

00:25:21.900 --> 00:25:27.140
 stuff. Well, I started doing it when the Google grant first came out and then I handed it off

00:25:27.140 --> 00:25:33.540
 to, uh, someone that I was contracting who did an amazing job of managing the Google grant at the

00:25:33.540 --> 00:25:41.800
 time. And we were, most people don't know this, but there's a, there's a $40,000 per month grant

00:25:41.800 --> 00:25:50.120
 available as well that has super high criteria, but, um, and I was really hoping that Westside would be

00:25:50.120 --> 00:25:56.700
 the first church to actually get to the place to need that grant and get it, but we never got it. We

00:25:56.700 --> 00:26:03.620
 got really, really close. You had to create like, uh, you had to, you had to like overuse the grant

00:26:03.620 --> 00:26:10.040
 every single month. Uh, and that's a hard thing to do. It's, it's a whole, because there's so much

00:26:10.040 --> 00:26:15.440
 complexity to it and that's where CV outreach, they can manage the grant for you. But really at this

00:26:15.440 --> 00:26:21.980
 stage, CV outreach has enough churches that are participating and enough grant money to do whatever

00:26:21.980 --> 00:26:28.760
 they want. That's not their issue. Their issue is not to get people clicking, but to get people to talk

00:26:28.900 --> 00:26:36.400
 to human beings on the receiving end to get the help that they need. Because if you like click on an ad

00:26:36.400 --> 00:26:41.920
 and it takes you to a webpage where you're reading, you know, suggestions on how to help, well, that's

00:26:41.920 --> 00:26:49.940
 okay, but it's so much better to talk with someone like a pastor who's in your area to get the help

00:26:49.940 --> 00:26:56.360
 that you need. That's so much better. Get into contact with people. So CV outreach, ideally what

00:26:56.360 --> 00:27:03.260
 they would love to do is to be the matchmaker or the middleman of people who are in need with people

00:27:03.260 --> 00:27:12.860
 in the church who can meet those needs. Kind of like how Airbnb, Uber, Lyft, all of these companies,

00:27:13.440 --> 00:27:19.280
 they're, they're matchmaking is what they're doing. They're, they're meeting people who need the service

00:27:19.280 --> 00:27:26.380
 with people who give the service, but are somehow disconnected from each other. And that's what CV

00:27:26.380 --> 00:27:30.980
 outreach is trying to do. It's trying to connect those things because how many people in church

00:27:30.980 --> 00:27:39.440
 want to be like Jesus, how many people in church want to share and show compassion to people in need?

00:27:39.440 --> 00:27:47.040
 How many people in church would love to lead someone to Christ? You know, I mean, yeah, I mean, you talk

00:27:47.040 --> 00:27:51.900
 to anybody in church, they would love to do that. And there's people in their communities that need

00:27:51.900 --> 00:27:58.380
 that. And how do you get those two together to meet each other's needs? That's the challenge.

00:27:59.520 --> 00:28:03.580
 Yeah. So let's, let's pull that thread, right? Let's, let's start to explore that. We, we said

00:28:03.580 --> 00:28:08.980
 earlier, Barna, thank you very much. 40% of people called to Christ. Um, they're, they're going to,

00:28:08.980 --> 00:28:14.280
 I call it pastor Google. They're going to the search engines. They're going, CV outreach is an

00:28:14.280 --> 00:28:20.580
 incredible resource. If you're not following Dave Adamson, uh, former, uh, North point social media

00:28:20.580 --> 00:28:24.900
 pastor, I want to think it's the title there. He's now back in Australia, working with orange.

00:28:24.980 --> 00:28:33.180
 That man is the King of, uh, YouTube and utilizing YouTube for its search engines. Um, like there's,

00:28:33.380 --> 00:28:37.540
 there's so many different ways to kind of do that. But Jason just brought up a really interesting

00:28:37.540 --> 00:28:43.360
 point talking about, okay, there's, there's another 40% of the equation here, um, that even

00:28:43.360 --> 00:28:48.820
 before people get to the funnel, quote unquote, before people even get to the church, there's an

00:28:48.820 --> 00:28:55.460
 opportunity for one-on-one conversations for personal mission for evangelism, uh, which is,

00:28:55.500 --> 00:29:00.720
 I mean, let's, let's call it. I ironically, I just did a webinar talking about this exact topic,

00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:06.980
 Jason with glue for glue connect. And so like, I'll, I'll spin it around, but if I only get that

00:29:06.980 --> 00:29:13.960
 happened today. And so we're going to, well, it's out there glue connect.church slash stadia.

00:29:14.080 --> 00:29:18.280
 I'm pretty sure it's, it's at that URL or if not, it will be sometime, but I would love to hear from

00:29:18.280 --> 00:29:24.420
 you, Jason. That was a unsolicited commercial. Oh yeah. I love glue connect. We use them. Um,

00:29:24.420 --> 00:29:32.420
 and we're experimenting. One of, here's one of the things, uh, glue connect is great. Uh, CV outreach

00:29:32.420 --> 00:29:37.000
 is great. It sounds like they're doing the same thing, but here's the subtle nuance of, of the

00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:43.360
 differences between the two. And we use both, um, CV outreach wants to get you into personal connection

00:29:43.360 --> 00:29:52.300
 with people who are in need. Glue connect is a, uh, church directory, um, recommendation engine

00:29:52.300 --> 00:30:00.620
 using on the front end, the same types of, uh, strategies of, you know, Google keywords, Google

00:30:00.620 --> 00:30:05.320
 ads, Google grants, all of those things in the front end, they're practically identical in the way

00:30:05.320 --> 00:30:13.480
 that they're approaching it. But once one gets into the system and clicks on that ad or video

00:30:13.480 --> 00:30:20.920
 or reads the content, the call to action is slightly different. In glue connect, the call to action is

00:30:20.920 --> 00:30:29.940
 here's the church that's near you that you can, um, that you can contact in CV outreach. It's more like

00:30:29.940 --> 00:30:36.320
 a person is going to call you or email you. That's the difference. One is connecting you to a church.

00:30:36.460 --> 00:30:43.640
 Another is connecting you to a person. And if I had my, you know, my, and I've talked with, I know a lot of the

00:30:43.640 --> 00:30:52.340
 guys at glue. They're good friends of ours. Um, and we have like glue staff on staff here at Westside. So I

00:30:52.340 --> 00:30:59.660
 talk to these guys all the time and, uh, I've told him straight up. It's like, okay, giving someone, like if you're a

00:30:59.660 --> 00:31:07.340
 person in need and you see a church directory, most people, I think if they're an unchurched person that

00:31:07.340 --> 00:31:14.740
 might be a leap too far, but if you're talking about, uh, okay, someone's going to call me or there's a

00:31:14.740 --> 00:31:20.900
 hotline that I can call and talk with a real person about this thing that I'm feeling right now. Um, that

00:31:20.900 --> 00:31:29.140
 to me feels a little bit of an easier step for your average unchurched person in need. Now here's the

00:31:29.140 --> 00:31:36.720
 catch though. A lot of our churches are not designed to receive that kind of volume of needs. And so I

00:31:36.720 --> 00:31:43.160
 can understand the glue connect strategy in that, okay, here's the church call them. And then, you know,

00:31:43.380 --> 00:31:51.440
 I can, you know, my hands are clean. Right. But when, uh, you do like the CV outreach methodology,

00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:58.260
 it's like, okay, I've got a queue of people now that I need to contact and my phone dings with a

00:31:58.260 --> 00:32:05.000
 notification and I got to get to them right away. It's a different type of ministry where a lot of

00:32:05.000 --> 00:32:13.200
 times when you're dealing with like church organized, uh, types of like institutional sorts of ministry,

00:32:13.200 --> 00:32:21.280
 it's like, Oh, when, you know, during office hours or once a week on Sunday. And if that's this kind

00:32:21.280 --> 00:32:27.740
 of, uh, ministry man, if that's the kind of ministry volume that you can handle as a church, well then

00:32:27.740 --> 00:32:34.080
 fine, do that. It's better than nothing. It feels totally different though. When your phone dings at

00:32:34.080 --> 00:32:39.720
 two o'clock in the morning and someone is wanting to commit suicide and you're texting them that feels

00:32:39.720 --> 00:32:47.800
 different. So I think there's, there's a place for both approaches and there's, you know,

00:32:47.800 --> 00:32:54.940
 much work that needs to be done on both sides of the equation. Um, what I love about both approaches

00:32:54.940 --> 00:33:04.440
 is that, um, they're both pre church service. And that I think is territory that we need to explore

00:33:04.440 --> 00:33:14.500
 in even more ways thinking of how do we help people who need Jesus find Jesus, whether or not a church

00:33:14.500 --> 00:33:22.160
 service is in the equation that is territory that we need to explore. Let me, let me back up. Cause I just,

00:33:22.160 --> 00:33:28.120
 you said, you talked about the 2am ding with the suicidal person. I'm, I'm curious. And cause you,

00:33:28.120 --> 00:33:33.500
 you're implementing these systems. Is that, is that a pastor that's getting that ding? Is there a

00:33:33.500 --> 00:33:40.080
 role that's a volunteer starting to explore that to me? Yeah. That's the thing is like, uh, it started

00:33:40.080 --> 00:33:45.480
 off with me just doing it because I wanted to wrap my brain around it and figure out, okay, what is this

00:33:45.480 --> 00:33:52.520
 like, is this sustainable? Is it something that I could create a volunteer team around to service these

00:33:52.520 --> 00:34:00.260
 sorts of things? Um, like for example, if you knew that someone in your neighborhood was considering

00:34:00.260 --> 00:34:07.760
 divorcing, would you want to talk to that person? My gut tells me, yes, yes. You know? And so it's

00:34:07.760 --> 00:34:13.080
 like at that point, that's where CV outreach is kind of like that matchmaker that way. Now I wish their

00:34:13.080 --> 00:34:18.940
 geofencing worked a little bit better because again, me talking to someone in Topeka, that's an

00:34:18.940 --> 00:34:24.360
 hour and a half away. The types of resources that I can give to that person is very different than the

00:34:24.360 --> 00:34:30.280
 person that's right down the street. And so the problem that we have is a density problem that there

00:34:30.280 --> 00:34:37.740
 aren't enough churches or aren't enough people that are willing to field these types of requests.

00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:43.520
 And what I ended up doing was because at the, at the time, cause we did this, like we started two

00:34:43.520 --> 00:34:48.920
 years ago. Um, at the time I was getting like, you know, a couple of requests a week, completely

00:34:48.920 --> 00:34:57.500
 manageable. And I had to take a trip to India to do a church planting training. And I handed it off to

00:34:57.500 --> 00:35:04.460
 the, um, receptionist of our counseling ministry and said, you kind of handle a lot of these sorts

00:35:04.460 --> 00:35:10.600
 of requests anyway. Can you do this for me while I'm gone in India? She's like, no problem. So I gave

00:35:10.600 --> 00:35:16.360
 her all the credentials. You can set up teams inside the tool and all that. So I added her to the tool.

00:35:16.540 --> 00:35:21.920
 And so she started fielding these requests. And when I came back from India two weeks later,

00:35:21.920 --> 00:35:26.460
 she said, you know what, Jason, this is probably stuff that I should be doing anyway,

00:35:26.460 --> 00:35:34.120
 because this is right in our lane. So, you know, I can just take it. And I'm like, awesome. One less

00:35:34.120 --> 00:35:39.820
 thing for me to do, you know? And so basically it's like our counseling ministry has been doing it all

00:35:39.820 --> 00:35:47.500
 the way up until about two weeks ago. So two weeks ago, um, Jodi, the receptionist, she came to me and

00:35:47.500 --> 00:35:55.600
 she said, you know, we are just swamped. We are overwhelmed. And because of the fact that, uh,

00:35:55.600 --> 00:36:02.720
 a lot of these requests I have to do research on to find out where they can get help in these places

00:36:02.720 --> 00:36:09.300
 that are outside of the Kansas city metro area, it doesn't, they're not warm leads for counseling

00:36:09.300 --> 00:36:17.200
 here because they're two hours away. And so she's like, I don't know now because of COVID,

00:36:17.660 --> 00:36:23.100
 everything just blew up and we're getting so many more requests than normal. And a lot of them are

00:36:23.100 --> 00:36:28.040
 outside of the Kansas city metro. You know, well, a few of them are in the metro, but the vast majority

00:36:28.040 --> 00:36:36.280
 are not. And I, I spend time doing this while I have people that are two or three deep in line

00:36:36.280 --> 00:36:43.640
 in front of my desk right now. And so I can't, I can't do both anymore. And so I'm like, I'm at the

00:36:43.640 --> 00:36:50.020
 point right now where I'm like, okay, do I hand this off to a volunteer? Now I have people that say,

00:36:50.100 --> 00:36:57.140
 yes, I want to help people who are in need. But when the rubber meets the road and you're having

00:36:57.140 --> 00:37:03.900
 family dinner and your phone dings, because someone's marriage is in crisis, what are you

00:37:03.900 --> 00:37:09.840
 going to do? Yeah. You know, that's the trick right there. And I believe that there are people

00:37:09.840 --> 00:37:17.380
 out there who have a heart for this, um, that would be willing to drop everything and meet that person

00:37:17.380 --> 00:37:25.500
 in their deepest need and make an instant friend, uh, for life and help somebody out. I'm sure that

00:37:25.500 --> 00:37:31.140
 there are people like that. Not everybody's built for that though. And especially like you need an

00:37:31.140 --> 00:37:37.940
 intern, like you need a, need a digital ministry, digital pastor, intern, somebody with a counseling

00:37:37.940 --> 00:37:43.120
 background, you know, maybe somebody in the audience is, is that person, but, uh, that, that, that's

00:37:43.120 --> 00:37:48.160
 beautiful, man. Um, there, there's a, so we, we, you know, we talked about the, the technical

00:37:48.160 --> 00:37:52.840
 aspects and, and, and glue connect. I'm not kidding. Love the organization. Love what they're

00:37:52.840 --> 00:37:59.060
 doing. Glue connect dot church slash stadia, go swing over there and, and, and learn more

00:37:59.060 --> 00:38:05.880
 about that and what they're offering. Uh, as well as, you know, CV outreach, uh, I think

00:38:05.880 --> 00:38:11.360
 it has incredible, both of these have incredible potential given the level of involvement that

00:38:11.360 --> 00:38:17.300
 you want to have in what's happening there. So, so explore that, but I would be missed here. And Jason,

00:38:17.300 --> 00:38:21.440
 I do want to come around and take some questions here in a minute, let the audience kind of speak

00:38:21.440 --> 00:38:26.380
 into it, but let's, let's talk a little bit because the other half of the equation, it wasn't just

00:38:26.380 --> 00:38:32.620
 the, you know, pastor Google, 40% are hitting up pastor Google, 40% are going to their, their

00:38:32.620 --> 00:38:37.120
 friends. And so there's, you know, personal evangelism, personal mission that that's in place.

00:38:37.120 --> 00:38:41.400
 Now, you know, little known fact of Jason E.T. is that he's a, he's a former missionary. Like this

00:38:41.400 --> 00:38:46.960
 guy spent international time and has done a lot of work internationally, um, you know, maybe coaching

00:38:46.960 --> 00:38:51.820
 and doing some of these things. So I'm, I'm just curious, talk to me a little bit, intentional

00:38:51.820 --> 00:38:57.420
 disciple making, intentional evangelism. What, what are some practices? What are some things that,

00:38:57.500 --> 00:39:02.080
 that you've done? What do you see work in, in a, in a physical environment, in a digital environment?

00:39:02.320 --> 00:39:05.580
 What, what does this look like 2021 mid post COVID?

00:39:06.660 --> 00:39:16.600
 Well, the, what we've done up until COVID and even in COVID with a few tweaks is a super easy

00:39:16.600 --> 00:39:22.600
 thing we call bless. Um, and you've probably heard it before. It just works. It, it's an acrostic

00:39:22.600 --> 00:39:32.340
 that is begin with prayer, eat, uh, listen to their story, serve them, and then share your story.

00:39:32.660 --> 00:39:39.500
 That's it. It's super simple. And if you follow that basic continuum, don't try to share your story

00:39:39.500 --> 00:39:45.720
 first. You start first in prayer. That's what you do. And then you just end up eating with people.

00:39:45.720 --> 00:39:53.080
 And it's odd that when, even when you find Jesus, uh, in the gospels, especially in the gospel of Mark,

00:39:53.720 --> 00:39:59.800
 um, he was either eating somewhere, going to somewhere to eat or coming from somewhere that he

00:39:59.800 --> 00:40:04.900
 had just come from eating. And he was called, you know, a glutton and a drunkard because he spent so

00:40:04.900 --> 00:40:12.940
 much time with people around the table for whatever reason, when you get around the table with someone,

00:40:12.940 --> 00:40:20.280
 your guard drops. People have experienced this everywhere. You eat a meal with someone and

00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:25.220
 instantly you're having conversations that you would never have otherwise, you know, dating

00:40:25.220 --> 00:40:31.980
 relationships start this way. You know, even Psalm 23 talks about you prepared a table before me in the

00:40:31.980 --> 00:40:38.660
 presence of my enemies. You know, it's like you're reconciling people to each other. You, um, there's

00:40:38.660 --> 00:40:43.940
 just barriers that come down. I can't explain it any other way. Sometimes it's over coffee. Sometimes

00:40:43.940 --> 00:40:48.220
 it's over a meal. Sometimes it's, you know, inviting other people to your house. Are you going to other

00:40:48.220 --> 00:40:53.560
 people's houses? It doesn't matter, but you're getting in contact with people, um, after having

00:40:53.560 --> 00:41:00.740
 prayed. And then you just listen, you don't talk, you just listen. That's it. Um, and especially even

00:41:00.740 --> 00:41:11.340
 on social media, that's what we're on. It's unfortunate that, um, the technology isn't primed to listen.

00:41:11.620 --> 00:41:17.640
 It's primed to first talk. And that's what I love about these tools like clubhouse is that for

00:41:17.640 --> 00:41:24.480
 whatever reason it's, it reverses the equation and it puts me in a posture of listening first.

00:41:25.240 --> 00:41:36.100
 And that's what I love about it. Um, so it's like begin a prayer, listen, eat, uh, then serve somebody

00:41:36.100 --> 00:41:41.760
 like find out where their point of need is and serve them and be willing to be served. Um, and then

00:41:41.760 --> 00:41:49.080
 inevitably when those things are in place, um, they ask you, well, what's up with you and you just

00:41:49.080 --> 00:41:56.640
 share your story and that's it. And we've seen so many people come into the kingdom through that very

00:41:56.640 --> 00:42:04.080
 simple, basic framework that can be executed online too, by the way, even the eat part, it can be done.

00:42:04.320 --> 00:42:10.560
 Um, that it's just kind of crazy. It, you just got to make it super simple, you know? And at the end of

00:42:10.560 --> 00:42:17.920
 the day, when people start sharing their story of how God has helped them, then it's so funny how

00:42:17.920 --> 00:42:23.520
 natural it is without like this formal gospel presentation, people come into the kingdom,

00:42:23.520 --> 00:42:29.840
 they get baptized and it's just coming out of this basic sort of blessed rhythm. We call it a blessed

00:42:29.840 --> 00:42:38.480
 rhythm. Each of the aspects of the blessed rhythm have, uh, input and an output. Like we begin in

00:42:38.480 --> 00:42:47.280
 prayer, uh, we pray for our city and we let people pray for us, you know, it goes both ways. Um, and

00:42:47.280 --> 00:42:54.080
 when we listen, we listen to other people and we listen to God, you know? So there's, there is, uh,

00:42:54.080 --> 00:43:01.760
 like an, we call it inhale and exhale. It's a rhythm that happens on all of those things. And it gets

00:43:01.760 --> 00:43:09.600
 funny when you get to the place of like eating and serving, allowing yourself to be served is something

00:43:09.600 --> 00:43:18.960
 that I find difficult. Um, but when I allow myself to be served by someone else, it opens up relationship

00:43:20.240 --> 00:43:28.080
 and I I'm always serving other people, but I don't let people serve me and I'm missing out on what could

00:43:28.080 --> 00:43:35.520
 be the start of a really great relationship that opens up to gospel conversations. So that's, you know,

00:43:35.520 --> 00:43:40.080
 just to answer your question, that's just one of the first things that pops out of my mind because

00:43:40.080 --> 00:43:46.320
 that's one of the things we do. Yeah. Honestly, the thing that I love about that is, is the simplicity

00:43:46.960 --> 00:43:52.880
 because the simplicity I think is, it is what leads towards reproduction of it. If, if it was so

00:43:52.880 --> 00:43:59.680
 complicated, if it was so, you may be able to get one generation, maybe you can influence somebody else

00:43:59.680 --> 00:44:05.840
 to tell somebody else, but you know, this, this blessed part, it's, it's so simple of approach.

00:44:05.840 --> 00:44:12.240
 You could, you know, you could see somebody three, four or five generations away sharing that story

00:44:12.240 --> 00:44:18.720
 and being able to, to express that. Now, one of the questions that I would ask is oftentimes,

00:44:19.360 --> 00:44:26.480
 I don't know, I feel like we, we, the church and, and I don't mean this negatively. And so I don't,

00:44:26.480 --> 00:44:34.560
 don't hear criticism. I think that sometimes we, we overtrain. We, we keep people on the bench

00:44:35.120 --> 00:44:42.080
 too long without releasing them, you know, and it's, you know, I do a lot of talking centered around

00:44:42.080 --> 00:44:49.440
 knowledge-based discipleship versus obedience-based discipleship, knowledge-based come do this six

00:44:49.440 --> 00:44:53.440
 month course, come do this nine month course, give three years of your life. And one day you'll be

00:44:53.440 --> 00:44:58.240
 able to have this conversation as opposed to obedience-based where it's more like, dude,

00:44:58.240 --> 00:45:02.800
 go have the conversation. Let the Lord lead you. When you get stuck, tell the guy, hey, let me,

00:45:02.800 --> 00:45:09.280
 I'll get back to you. Let me see what I can figure out. I'm just curious, just in time training.

00:45:09.280 --> 00:45:13.920
 Give me some feedback on that. What, what does that look like? How do we, because we want people to

00:45:13.920 --> 00:45:17.600
 have conversations. We don't want them to look like an idiot, but at the same point, we don't

00:45:17.600 --> 00:45:23.680
 want them sitting on the, on the bench, afraid to go have some of those conversations or, or stuck in

00:45:23.680 --> 00:45:29.280
 discipleship systems that it's more about the knowledge as opposed to activating and releasing out.

00:45:29.280 --> 00:45:35.600
 Give me a little bit here. Uh, well, here's, here's another, uh, obedience-based, you know,

00:45:35.600 --> 00:45:41.840
 kind of training thing that we do all the time that you can find in like the DBS method, um, where

00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:48.640
 it's like, what is Jesus telling you and what are you doing about it? That's it. Super simple. You can

00:45:48.640 --> 00:45:55.280
 ask that to anybody. Um, and we have like these fireside groups where you get guys around a fire

00:45:55.280 --> 00:46:00.720
 and you just ask those two questions. What is Jesus telling you? You go around the fire. What are you

00:46:00.720 --> 00:46:07.360
 doing about it? You know? And when you hit that second question, things get real quiet because we're not

00:46:07.360 --> 00:46:15.680
 used to doing that. And so like when we're talking about like the bless method, um, we'll spend a whole

00:46:15.680 --> 00:46:21.680
 week just saying, okay, we're just going to talk about beginning in prayer and, you know, just walk

00:46:21.680 --> 00:46:25.760
 around your neighborhood, pray for everybody, you know, figure out what their names are, pray for them

00:46:25.760 --> 00:46:32.640
 by name, you know, just do that. That's all you do the first week, you know, ask God to reveal to you

00:46:32.640 --> 00:46:38.800
 what he wants to do, where he is already working. And then you start listening to your community in

00:46:38.800 --> 00:46:43.680
 ways that you never had before. And it's like second week. It's like, okay, we're going to just listen.

00:46:43.680 --> 00:46:48.560
 What did you hear from your kid? You know, and they'll tell you all kinds of stuff. Okay. What are

00:46:48.560 --> 00:46:55.600
 you going to do about it? That's, it's really not hard, but what it does though, is it again is

00:46:55.600 --> 00:47:02.880
 obedience based and it comes alive because I think probably the academic setting is probably the

00:47:02.880 --> 00:47:09.440
 only setting that I know of that, um, expects you to learn things without actually putting them in a

00:47:09.440 --> 00:47:14.640
 practice. Like any other kind of training has the assumption you're going to actually do something.

00:47:15.520 --> 00:47:24.640
 And sometimes I think, you know, you get pastors coming out of seminary or, um, kind of, um, designing

00:47:24.640 --> 00:47:31.440
 things with an academic bent on them. And that's the unfortunate Achilles heel of that. A lot of the

00:47:31.440 --> 00:47:37.280
 educational system is that it teaches you stuff that you don't need to know today. It teaches you

00:47:37.280 --> 00:47:43.840
 stuff that you might need to know tomorrow. And most adults don't learn that way. They only care about

00:47:43.840 --> 00:47:49.920
 stuff that's going to help them today. And then once they start doing stuff, the learning is in the doing,

00:47:51.360 --> 00:47:58.080
 not in the, in the memorizing. So once you start doing stuff, it just comes alive. Just like,

00:47:59.040 --> 00:48:03.040
 you know, the basic principle of Jesus says, love your neighbor as yourself.

00:48:04.240 --> 00:48:11.360
 Super simple. Everybody understands that. Okay. Now go do that and come back to me next week and see how

00:48:11.360 --> 00:48:18.160
 that went. That's a completely different experience than just saying, oh yeah, I understand the principle,

00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:23.760
 but doing the knowing is in the doing. So whenever I do my church planner trainings or whatever,

00:48:24.960 --> 00:48:29.600
 they don't, you know, like the next module, they don't come back to the next module until they've done

00:48:30.240 --> 00:48:35.760
 what they were supposed to do from the first. And so if you didn't pray, then well, okay,

00:48:37.120 --> 00:48:43.360
 next week, try to do it next week. You know, there's no point in listening to your community

00:48:43.360 --> 00:48:51.040
 if you're not listening to God first. So that's it, you know, and that's the gate actually where you

00:48:51.040 --> 00:48:55.280
 don't progress. And that's another problem too, is that people progress in their knowledge without

00:48:55.280 --> 00:49:01.280
 progressing in their obedience. And that's dangerous. And unfortunately, even some of the ways that we

00:49:01.280 --> 00:49:07.440
 structure our discipleship or even the way that we structure our church service, where we tell people,

00:49:07.440 --> 00:49:14.720
 we fill people up with more knowledge than they have the capacity to obey. And what we inadvertently

00:49:14.720 --> 00:49:23.360
 do is we're priming them to disobey Jesus. And that's dangerous because James says, if you know to do

00:49:23.360 --> 00:49:30.960
 good and you don't do it, then it's sin. And I'm personally scared as a pastor or as a teacher,

00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:37.360
 to be teaching things that I know my people aren't ready for yet. Just like the Apostle Paul says,

00:49:37.360 --> 00:49:42.320
 you know, I would love, you know, you guys are only at milk level. I would love to give you meat,

00:49:42.320 --> 00:49:47.520
 but you can't handle it yet. I've got to give you milk because, you know, that's all you have the

00:49:47.520 --> 00:49:54.160
 capacity to obey at this point. Because it doesn't do anybody any favors if I give you more information

00:49:54.160 --> 00:49:59.920
 than you can actually obey. Because for two reasons. One is, I'm priming disobedience in you,

00:50:00.640 --> 00:50:07.040
 and I'm responsible. So I got to give an account before Jesus about that. And that's kind of scary

00:50:07.040 --> 00:50:14.880
 for me. Until you come back and obey, it's like, you know, I'm not going to talk about more stuff.

00:50:14.880 --> 00:50:19.600
 It's kind of like how Jesus, when he sent out the 70, very simple instructions, but there was a

00:50:19.600 --> 00:50:25.920
 feedback loop built into the system. They came back and told Jesus everything that they did. And Jesus

00:50:25.920 --> 00:50:31.520
 helped them with some of the problems that they had. And that's how people learn. The learning's in the doing.

00:50:33.520 --> 00:50:40.080
 I don't think I ever picked that up. Thank you for that. That's the thing I just learned from this

00:50:40.080 --> 00:50:47.200
 conversation. The feedback loop. The biblical kind of wiring that into that situation. That is

00:50:47.200 --> 00:50:53.920
 awesome. Thank you. Seriously. I will borrow that. I will use that. I'll give you credit half the time.

00:50:53.920 --> 00:51:01.120
 No, that's fine. Just, you know, I think a lot of times we look at Jesus' message,

00:51:01.120 --> 00:51:06.160
 but we don't use his methods. So when you look at the way that Jesus sent out the 70,

00:51:07.200 --> 00:51:15.600
 Why don't we do that? You know, look at it, like seriously, look at it as like a church plan or

00:51:15.600 --> 00:51:23.040
 training or as discipleship pathway. It will, it will blow your mind the way that Jesus did it

00:51:23.040 --> 00:51:29.120
 because he was amazing. Cool. Hey, I want to, so I'm going to want to do two things. I'm going to,

00:51:29.120 --> 00:51:33.920
 we're going to open up for questions in just a couple minutes. So if you've got questions, comments,

00:51:34.560 --> 00:51:39.520
 thoughts, would love to hear it. Go ahead and raise your hand. I do want to ask one question in this

00:51:39.520 --> 00:51:44.160
 transition. Raise your hands and we'll, I'll bring you up after this. One of the, one of the favorite

00:51:44.160 --> 00:51:50.960
 things. So do we have people from Gluconnect here? I'm not sure if they made it in or not. I'm not

00:51:50.960 --> 00:51:56.880
 recognizing names on there. Raise your hand if you're Gluconnect. We'll bring you up, but otherwise,

00:51:56.880 --> 00:52:03.840
 you know, definitely other comments or questions, feel free to raise up. I did want to ask one kind of

00:52:03.840 --> 00:52:09.680
 follow-up question. You have one of the things that I love about what you're doing is how you're

00:52:09.680 --> 00:52:17.600
 utilizing HubSpot to track awareness. Like you've almost got a separate database for above the funnel

00:52:17.600 --> 00:52:21.840
 thinking. Right. It's a free. I would love for you maybe to unpack that. Yeah. Yeah. This is like top

00:52:21.840 --> 00:52:30.080
 of the funnel stuff too. So one of the things about HubSpot, like the glue pixel, is that you can place it on

00:52:30.080 --> 00:52:39.840
 all of your assets. So we put the HubSpot pixel on a chop as well as our webpage and all of the other

00:52:39.840 --> 00:52:49.120
 things that we do. So when someone interacts with or fills out a form, HubSpot can scrape the information

00:52:49.120 --> 00:52:56.960
 from that, even though like we're a church that uses CCB, you know, a church community builder as our CHMS or

00:52:56.960 --> 00:53:05.360
 church, you know, management system. Um, but I also put the HubSpot pixel on our webpage and in chop,

00:53:05.360 --> 00:53:12.640
 even though they're filling out a CCB form, HubSpot will scrape that information and create a profile for me.

00:53:12.640 --> 00:53:22.400
 And that profile then can be, uh, across all of the assets that we have online and where that comes

00:53:22.400 --> 00:53:30.000
 in super handy is when, for example, someone's in CHOP and they request prayer, right? We can have a

00:53:30.000 --> 00:53:38.400
 conversation with them using the HubSpot conversation utility that it has. It's got, you know, like a little chat

00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:44.880
 chat sort of thing that you can interact with people. And I can see on the history of that person.

00:53:45.760 --> 00:53:51.760
 Um, I can see their email address that they have not put into CHOP, but they put in to our webpage,

00:53:51.760 --> 00:53:59.040
 or I can see that they clicked on something concerning family on the webpage. And now they're in CHOP asking

00:53:59.040 --> 00:54:06.480
 for help with their, with their family problems. So it connects dots for me that I otherwise wouldn't

00:54:06.480 --> 00:54:14.160
 know. And on top of that, it creates a history of interaction. So if someone like when we're not

00:54:14.160 --> 00:54:20.000
 having like a live service or whatever, and they submit a prayer request through HubSpot.

00:54:20.000 --> 00:54:25.920
 Now, when I respond to them through HubSpot, I can see a history of all of the times that they've

00:54:25.920 --> 00:54:31.600
 requested prayer in the past and all the different things they've clicked on in the past. And that way,

00:54:31.600 --> 00:54:37.680
 I can be more precise with the way that I do follow up with these people, because here's what happens

00:54:37.680 --> 00:54:43.520
 in CHOP. Inadvertently, all I have with CHOP is an email address. I don't have an address. I don't

00:54:43.520 --> 00:54:48.480
 have a phone number. I don't have all the information that I would need to create a CCB profile.

00:54:48.480 --> 00:54:59.280
 And so what this acts then as is almost like a pre-CHMS for CCB. So it allows me over time to start

00:54:59.280 --> 00:55:07.440
 collecting different data points, different parts of their profile before I create a CCB profile for

00:55:07.440 --> 00:55:14.720
 for them as, you know, officially part of our church. So it's like, before someone even is a part of our

00:55:14.720 --> 00:55:22.320
 church, I might have just an email address or just a phone number, or maybe a first name. But over time,

00:55:23.120 --> 00:55:29.360
 I might get a name one week and I might get a, you know, a phone number the next week, and I might get

00:55:30.080 --> 00:55:35.920
 email address the next week. And it starts building over time this profile that becomes robust enough for

00:55:35.920 --> 00:55:43.280
 for me to even do, you know, email drip campaigns on stuff in HubSpot before they even come on site or

00:55:44.720 --> 00:55:46.720
 become a member of our church.

00:55:46.720 --> 00:55:55.120
 Yeah, it's it's that that intentionality to track without feeling in every database manager is

00:55:55.120 --> 00:56:00.720
 always like, hey, there's like 27 fields. I want to know the birthdays of the children.

00:56:00.720 --> 00:56:06.720
 Exactly. Nobody's getting in the database until I know Jimmy's birthday. And that's, you know, from

00:56:06.720 --> 00:56:12.240
 from our vantage point, trying to work above the funnel. Nobody's going to give you Jimmy's birthday

00:56:12.240 --> 00:56:19.040
 on on a web form. That's crazy. And so being able to do what they're doing by utilizing HubSpot,

00:56:19.040 --> 00:56:24.080
 which is a it's just any given database. It's a marketing database. I use it through the church

00:56:24.080 --> 00:56:32.080
 digital. And so but utilizing a tool like that to to track sounds creepy, but to to connect with to

00:56:32.080 --> 00:56:38.320
 engage with to to have metrics to have information available, even for follow up before you before

00:56:38.320 --> 00:56:44.480
 you truly engage with them at a level and get them connected into the church piece. I when he told me

00:56:44.480 --> 00:56:48.560
 that idea, I don't know, maybe six months ago, and I my jaw hit the table. I was blown away. Like,

00:56:48.560 --> 00:56:53.920
 that's, that's an incredible idea. Yeah, one of the things it does, too, is if you know that

00:56:53.920 --> 00:57:00.720
 that you don't have to have all the information in the beginning, then you can meter it and your forms

00:57:00.720 --> 00:57:07.680
 and your and the interactions and engagement can be much more immediate, because I'm telling you,

00:57:07.680 --> 00:57:14.000
 if you give me a form that has 50 things on it, I'm not filling it out. But if all I have to put in

00:57:14.000 --> 00:57:21.280
 is my name and my email address. I'm good. I can do that super easy. And if the next time it's asking me,

00:57:21.280 --> 00:57:24.400
 because it already knows who I am at this point, it's like, hey, Jason.

00:57:26.720 --> 00:57:31.040
 You know, it already knows it doesn't ask me for my email address again. So now it can ask me for,

00:57:31.760 --> 00:57:38.160
 you know, my phone number. And then over time, now I've got a complete profile, you know, and it's not

00:57:38.160 --> 00:57:44.080
 so taxing on the person because the person in the moment, I don't know of anybody who shows up to a

00:57:44.080 --> 00:57:53.440
 webpage or to CHOP and their first thought is, oh, I can't wait to fill out a form. Nobody wants to do

00:57:53.440 --> 00:57:59.920
 that, right? What they're thinking is, oh, I want to find a friend. I want to have somebody pray for me.

00:57:59.920 --> 00:58:04.480
 You know, I want, you know, there's a gazillion other things. And what we're doing is, okay,

00:58:04.480 --> 00:58:09.040
 in order for you to get what you want, you've got to fill out this form. Well, if that's true,

00:58:09.280 --> 00:58:17.680
 then okay, let's make that form just as frictionless as possible. So that's why a lot of this technology

00:58:17.680 --> 00:58:22.800
 is so helpful because it, it doesn't get in the way for real ministry.

00:58:24.960 --> 00:58:30.480
 Love, love that. Does not get in the way of real ministry. It empowers that. It sets that up. So

00:58:30.480 --> 00:58:36.400
 we've talked a lot about above the funnel here. Um, we, we, we've talked about how we're utilizing,

00:58:36.400 --> 00:58:42.160
 um, the, the Google, the search engines, the, the CV outreach glue connect, putting those,

00:58:42.160 --> 00:58:45.360
 those pieces together. We've talked about the discipleship side,

00:58:45.920 --> 00:58:51.760
 bless empowering individuals to have conversations above the funnel, letting that be the, the,

00:58:51.760 --> 00:58:55.280
 I tell the story, by the way, if you've got questions, I'm going to tell the story. If you've

00:58:55.280 --> 00:59:00.720
 got questions, raise your hand. I promise we'll get the questions in 60 seconds, but I would love to

00:59:00.720 --> 00:59:06.320
 hear it. Let's see. I know. I haven't raised their hands. Somebody raised their hand and then they put

00:59:06.320 --> 00:59:10.320
 it down a couple of times. And I'm like, wait, is that for real or not? Does it, do I count that for,

00:59:10.320 --> 00:59:15.280
 for the baptism reports? Like what do I need to do? So if you've got questions or thoughts,

00:59:15.280 --> 00:59:20.720
 dialogue, but like, um, I mean, Seth Godin, we all know Seth Godin, top marketing guy in the country,

00:59:20.720 --> 00:59:26.560
 if not the planet, um, thought innovator in the space, not a Christian Jewish guy. Um,

00:59:26.560 --> 00:59:30.480
 Seth Godin on, on his podcast, maybe a year ago, actually, Jason Morris was a guy who connected me

00:59:30.480 --> 00:59:36.560
 to Seth Godin podcast, not necessarily this episode, but, um, Seth Godin was asked the question,

00:59:36.560 --> 00:59:42.480
 how do I get my message heard around the world? And a Jewish guy, not a Christian basically says this,

00:59:42.480 --> 00:59:46.800
 a billion people don't care about anything you have to say. Um, there's no way to get a billion

00:59:46.800 --> 00:59:52.880
 people to agree. A hundred million, 10 million, 1 million still don't, you're not going to get all

00:59:52.880 --> 00:59:57.920
 of them on the same page. A hundred thousand, 10,000. If you want to get people, you want to get your

00:59:57.920 --> 01:00:02.320
 message heard around the world, tell the smallest number of people possible and ideal,

01:00:03.920 --> 01:00:13.120
 get them to own it and then get them to replicate it. That's to me. Hello, not Jewish or a Jewish,

01:00:13.120 --> 01:00:16.480
 not Christian, basically describes the method that Jesus used to build his church.

01:00:17.280 --> 01:00:21.520
 And, and, and as we're looking at how to be effective for the future, to me, I think this

01:00:21.520 --> 01:00:25.360
 is like one of the greatest course corrections in the history of the church, because now we have an

01:00:25.360 --> 01:00:30.400
 opportunity to think like that. Let's create resources online to connect people, but let's also

01:00:30.400 --> 01:00:35.360
 empower people. It's, it's not about that one man on stage exuding a spiritual gift in front of

01:00:35.360 --> 01:00:40.320
 thousands. It's about, and I think I said this, it's about releasing thousands to exude their

01:00:40.320 --> 01:00:46.800
 spiritual gifts among more. And so this is the opportunity. This is the waking point, hopefully

01:00:46.800 --> 01:00:50.720
 for the church in this season. Let's not forget where we were at Tom Pounder. We were talking about

01:00:50.720 --> 01:00:55.440
 that at the beginning. Let's not forget where we were. Let's acknowledge and let's keep moving forward

01:00:55.440 --> 01:01:02.160
 on this new path. So, Hey, look, I can ramble all day, but at this point, I want somebody else to

01:01:02.160 --> 01:01:08.000
 walk into the screen. So if somebody wants to raise their hand and dialogue, I, my finger is hovering

01:01:08.000 --> 01:01:14.320
 right above the button. And so let's, let's come up, let's dialogue into it. Um, any takers?

01:01:15.680 --> 01:01:19.680
 I mean, Jason, we can, we can ramble, but I think it's more effective if we get some other

01:01:19.680 --> 01:01:25.920
 voices in here. Absolutely. Yes. Tyler Ash is coming up. Cool. So the software is working

01:01:25.920 --> 01:01:30.560
 and Tyler is coming in. Hey man. Hey, how are you guys doing? Doing great. Hey,

01:01:30.560 --> 01:01:35.360
 Tyler was one of those false, um, hand raises. I was a false. You got, you got going and I was like,

01:01:35.360 --> 01:01:39.680
 I'll just get out of the way. Yeah, no, that's awesome. Thanks. Thanks for the follow through

01:01:39.680 --> 01:01:43.440
 though. We are going to count you for that baptism report now coming up soon. There you go. Yeah.

01:01:43.440 --> 01:01:50.160
 Hey man. And it's awesome. Technically I think, uh, clubhouse is telling me I have to tell you that

01:01:50.160 --> 01:01:55.680
 we're recording this. There you go. Um, yeah, you're welcome. So, uh, Hey, what, what are you thinking?

01:01:56.400 --> 01:02:01.440
 Well, um, it's, it's less on the technical side. One, Jason tell Derek Davis. I said, hello. I used

01:02:01.440 --> 01:02:07.120
 to work with him. Yes. He's in the office right next to me. Okay. Yeah. He's a good buddy of mine.

01:02:07.120 --> 01:02:12.080
 And, uh, he's a fellow big family guy. So he's got a lot of, he's got all boys. I've got mostly girls,

01:02:12.080 --> 01:02:18.160
 but, um, we, uh, something that you said earlier, Jason got me thinking where you're talking about

01:02:18.720 --> 01:02:24.880
 kind of more along the lines of like teaching methods. Right. And one of the, one of the best things

01:02:24.880 --> 01:02:31.600
 that I've experienced or thought through in, in my ministry has been rather than like taking

01:02:31.600 --> 01:02:35.600
 time and informing people, cause it isn't about the information. It's about understanding where

01:02:35.600 --> 01:02:40.640
 they are and helping them from there. It's like putting, putting their faith and practice where it

01:02:40.640 --> 01:02:47.840
 is teaches us where we need to focus our teaching for them. Right. So we see their gaps and we don't

01:02:47.840 --> 01:02:53.120
 waste time heaping information on mountains that they have instead of taking information and putting

01:02:53.120 --> 01:02:57.360
 into the valleys that they have. That's right. That's what a good coach. I love what you were

01:02:57.360 --> 01:03:02.560
 saying about that. I just, it was super, it was a different way of saying some of the same thoughts,

01:03:02.560 --> 01:03:10.400
 but I loved it. I'll shut up now. You don't have a question. No, I just, I was, I just wanted to say

01:03:10.400 --> 01:03:13.760
 how much I appreciate what you said. And I'm learning about the technical side of things that you're

01:03:13.760 --> 01:03:19.440
 talking about. Cause you're talking about this, uh, app scraping things. And I'm just like, wow,

01:03:19.440 --> 01:03:26.000
 that's a, I didn't even know they did that anymore. Yeah. It happens, man. Yeah. That's

01:03:26.000 --> 01:03:32.320
 precisely how, well, here's, here's what I love about it is that we're all being targeted for all kinds of

01:03:32.320 --> 01:03:40.720
 stuff by businesses all the time. Um, and personally, I think that's good because I would much rather

01:03:40.720 --> 01:03:47.040
 see ads of things that I care about than stuff that I don't. All right. So I'm cool with it.

01:03:47.040 --> 01:03:54.480
 Yeah. But, uh, how I, when I see stuff like that, I think, wow, what kind of opportunity for the

01:03:54.480 --> 01:04:00.320
 kingdom could this be? And, you know, we've done retargeting and all that kind of stuff. And if you put

01:04:00.320 --> 01:04:06.480
 yourself in the shoes of someone who's really struggling and they're going online for solutions,

01:04:07.440 --> 01:04:14.960
 man, how can Jesus not be at the top of that list? That's how I see it is like, we've got to figure

01:04:14.960 --> 01:04:21.520
 this out because Jesus is the answer for all that. Yeah. What was it? And I've, I've told this story

01:04:21.520 --> 01:04:27.280
 several times. It's, it's actually a Dave Adamson story. We mentioned them earlier. Uh, what I think

01:04:27.280 --> 01:04:33.120
 David create went on YouTube and like searched something to the extent of, I don't know how to

01:04:33.120 --> 01:04:39.120
 pray, like teach me how to pray. How do I pray? How do I talk to God? Search that on YouTube. Now he

01:04:39.120 --> 01:04:46.720
 found thousands of videos that are out there. And what's interesting is that as he scrolled through

01:04:46.720 --> 01:04:53.680
 the pages of results, it took them like several hundred videos, five, six pages deep before he

01:04:53.680 --> 01:04:59.280
 actually got to the one that was created by a church. Now I don't want to discredit the hundreds

01:04:59.280 --> 01:05:05.440
 of videos that were created by individuals up and above where people are doing this and talking about

01:05:05.440 --> 01:05:11.680
 prayer on YouTube, but the church, we didn't figure out how to do it. And it's funny. Like there was

01:05:11.680 --> 01:05:17.760
 actually, there was one organized pastor, uh, like, uh, Joyce Myers, uh, was, was one and she's on the

01:05:17.760 --> 01:05:22.640
 first page. And it was actually, it was like based off of one of her books. I don't remember what it was

01:05:22.640 --> 01:05:28.320
 at the time, but it wasn't even a Joyce Meyer created video. It was somebody illegally ripped a DVD

01:05:28.320 --> 01:05:34.320
 from the nineties and uploaded it to the YouTube. Uh, so like there was no, there was no church presence

01:05:34.320 --> 01:05:40.880
 speaking into that. And so we've, we've got this opportunity to, to look at some of this technology

01:05:40.880 --> 01:05:47.840
 to engage with people. And what I love is maybe four or five years ago, like I was championing this

01:05:47.840 --> 01:05:54.720
 idea of, of utilizing YouTube in this way, but a lot of the stuff that Jason's talking about with HubSpot

01:05:54.720 --> 01:06:01.600
 and utilizing some of these vendors, I like, I'm not, I'm not dependent on, on a YouTube chat room

01:06:01.600 --> 01:06:06.400
 to, to connect with people. There's some of this technology and there's landing pages in there and

01:06:06.400 --> 01:06:13.040
 others. There's forms that tie in the database and there's tools for us to work above the funnel.

01:06:13.040 --> 01:06:19.600
 It's not, Hey, I'm just, I'm praying that somebody will, will watch this YouTube video and will email

01:06:19.600 --> 01:06:25.040
 us directly, or we'll call us on the 800 number. Like it's set up in such a way now that we can

01:06:25.040 --> 01:06:29.600
 effectively work and discover who these people are. There's still opportunities to grow, but it's a whole

01:06:29.600 --> 01:06:35.120
 lot better now than it was even merely a couple of years ago. Yeah. It's funny when you, when you talk

01:06:35.120 --> 01:06:41.840
 about that story of, you know, typing prayer and not seeing a church and I've got to wonder

01:06:42.960 --> 01:06:49.760
 because I know this is true. How many pastors have preached a message on prayer? Probably all of them,

01:06:50.720 --> 01:06:59.200
 but that somehow there's a disconnect between their content that they're creating, you know,

01:06:59.200 --> 01:07:06.240
 and they're working hard every single week to make that content happen. And it gets lost as soon as it

01:07:06.240 --> 01:07:15.040
 leaves his mouth and everybody drives home. And that's a shame because he worked hard. I know because I've

01:07:15.040 --> 01:07:19.760
 worked on my messages and I'm putting so many hours on that sucker, man. It's like, dude,

01:07:19.760 --> 01:07:26.800
 I'm going to squeeze every little bit of impact that, that I put into this. And so that's where,

01:07:26.800 --> 01:07:32.800
 you know, keyword research and just titling your videos correctly, or putting them up on YouTube

01:07:32.800 --> 01:07:39.040
 in the first place, who knows, maybe someone will hit it and get encouraged, you know, or structuring your

01:07:39.040 --> 01:07:46.640
 talks in such a way that it would actually work in for a YouTube audience to begin with. You know,

01:07:46.640 --> 01:07:53.360
 there's so many things about that story. I think to myself, it's like, holy cow, there's so much

01:07:53.360 --> 01:08:00.880
 missed opportunity, especially with, I mean, we have this mentality when it comes to the gathering,

01:08:00.880 --> 01:08:11.200
 which is important. The gathering as an ephemeral live experience that we're missing the long tail

01:08:11.200 --> 01:08:20.720
 evergreen content that we could be creating in a compounding fashion. Because here's, here's what

01:08:20.720 --> 01:08:25.840
 happens a lot of times. And one of the downfalls, in my opinion, of the whole invest and invite strategy

01:08:25.840 --> 01:08:31.520
 is you invite somebody, and they have a particular need, like they have marriage issues or whatever,

01:08:31.520 --> 01:08:37.600
 and you invite them to church. What if they're not talking about marriage when they show up at church?

01:08:37.600 --> 01:08:44.720
 How many times does that happen? Right? But if you have, if you are digitally targeting people

01:08:44.720 --> 01:08:50.960
 who have problems with their marriage, and you're saying, here's content that directly addresses

01:08:50.960 --> 01:08:59.440
 the issue that you're facing, that can live on for years, and still be relevant. Like it, it's like,

01:08:59.440 --> 01:09:04.880
 and I wish that we were even better at it. We're constantly tweaking. One of the things we started

01:09:04.880 --> 01:09:10.640
 doing was just lopping off all the dates on all of our titles, because it's irrelevant. You know,

01:09:10.640 --> 01:09:16.560
 it's like, why am I putting the date on here? It's easier for our, our video managers to

01:09:16.560 --> 01:09:25.280
 administrate. Yeah. But what we're also doing is we're inadvertently telegraphing that this is old

01:09:25.280 --> 01:09:30.720
 content, therefore not relevant for you today. And that's, that's a shame. It shouldn't be that way.

01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:36.400
 Well, and it's completely invalidating every search engine algorithm, which by the way,

01:09:36.400 --> 01:09:41.520
 YouTube is tied to Google so well, like it's, it's ridiculous. So huge, huge power there. Hey,

01:09:41.520 --> 01:09:45.760
 I'm, I'm, I'm excited for this. Katie raised her hand. I have been wanting to meet Katie. I've been

01:09:45.760 --> 01:09:50.960
 seeing Katie around in some other clubhouses and mentally I'm like, Hey, I'm really interested in

01:09:50.960 --> 01:09:56.400
 learning what she has to say. And so I'm excited. I get to like, get her to unmute and talk here a

01:09:56.400 --> 01:09:59.200
 little bit. Katie, nice to meet you. Thanks for joining us. What, what are you thinking?

01:09:59.200 --> 01:10:04.000
 Hey, Jeff, and thanks. And nice to meet you. I know I've been lurking a lot of these rooms.

01:10:04.000 --> 01:10:09.840
 So it's funny what Jason was just saying, actually, he started to check off all the boxes that I was

01:10:09.840 --> 01:10:17.760
 going to talk about. But no, it's true. So to give you context, so I'm the communications director

01:10:17.760 --> 01:10:23.200
 for the diocese of Maine, the Episcopal diocese of Maine. So we manage 58 churches, 18 summer chapels,

01:10:23.200 --> 01:10:31.280
 a summer camp, and some non-food essential pantries. And we just had this discussion and training

01:10:31.280 --> 01:10:39.360
 last week, talking about themes like forgiveness and prayer and how honest to God, all of our videos

01:10:40.160 --> 01:10:44.720
 for our churches. So we've got a diocesan channel, but then all of our churches have their own channels.

01:10:45.360 --> 01:10:50.000
 And they're, they have great content. They have beautiful content. They're talking about really

01:10:50.000 --> 01:10:58.880
 important themes. And what are they titling their videos? Sermon from January 17th with absolutely no

01:10:58.880 --> 01:11:06.000
 description, no keywords, no nothing. Now think about, you know, we're a small population state,

01:11:06.000 --> 01:11:10.480
 but we're a large geography state. Lots of people do have computers, so they're searching for stuff.

01:11:11.120 --> 01:11:16.480
 And for 58 churches and like max that out to, you know, 12,000, 15,000 folks who are,

01:11:17.040 --> 01:11:23.920
 you know, attached to those churches to not find that content is heartbreaking. And so as we've done this

01:11:23.920 --> 01:11:30.320
 training on the flip side with some of the stuff at our diocesan level, where we're trying to be the,

01:11:30.320 --> 01:11:36.240
 you know, the lead learners and lead teachers, you know, we've had reach out from like Tampa to us

01:11:36.240 --> 01:11:40.400
 about some of the content that we've put together. And it's like, that's an interesting connection.

01:11:40.400 --> 01:11:46.240
 And where did they find us? YouTube through that. So I just wanted to throw that in that,

01:11:46.240 --> 01:11:52.720
 you know, that's, it's such a simple thing. Right. But for things like that to change for the message

01:11:52.720 --> 01:12:00.720
 to be found is so important. So thanks for allowing me on stage. Awesome. Yep. One of the principles

01:12:00.720 --> 01:12:07.200
 that I've even heard in context of YouTube is, you know, so often we try to come up and Jason was

01:12:07.200 --> 01:12:12.960
 alluding earlier to like the creative sermon title. Like I've known guys to go back in,

01:12:13.520 --> 01:12:19.600
 even just change it once it's recorded and label it something completely different and something

01:12:19.600 --> 01:12:24.720
 that's, you know, more search friendly, more applicable, less creative. I've worked with pastors

01:12:24.720 --> 01:12:30.400
 that, that, you know, lead communicators that are very creative and have their particular phrases and

01:12:30.400 --> 01:12:36.160
 like the catch words and the key and the cute stuff. But that doesn't necessarily equate to

01:12:37.520 --> 01:12:43.440
 what people are searching for. Like, I don't know, your message on divorce. I don't want to get

01:12:43.440 --> 01:12:49.680
 divorced. How do I not get divorced? Like be very creative in context of that. And I'll even, you know,

01:12:49.680 --> 01:12:56.000
 tell a story based off it. When, as I was a digital pastor at Christ Fellowship Miami, we actually had

01:12:56.000 --> 01:13:01.600
 a, in a church in Miami, Florida. We had, we had a woman in Atlanta, Georgia, who would honestly,

01:13:01.600 --> 01:13:06.320
 if you were to get her on zoom here, whatever we're on now, clubhouse, she would tell you that

01:13:06.320 --> 01:13:09.440
 Christ Fellowship Miami and the lead pastor Rick Blackwood saved their marriage.

01:13:10.320 --> 01:13:16.080
 Because she was looking for a divorce. She and her husband were going through a hard times

01:13:16.080 --> 01:13:20.800
 in the Atlanta area. And she's literally Googling, I don't want to get a divorce.

01:13:20.800 --> 01:13:26.800
 And in context of that, she runs across a YouTube video of a sermon series that was initially called

01:13:26.800 --> 01:13:32.560
 Fight. Now, Fight's not necessarily a bad label, but I had relabeled it because Fight didn't carry

01:13:32.560 --> 01:13:38.880
 over the whole divorce marriage approach. I relabeled it on YouTube, something completely different,

01:13:38.880 --> 01:13:43.360
 much more related to the topic. I don't remember what the words were, it was like five years ago.

01:13:44.640 --> 01:13:50.000
 True story here. Like, she found the video, she watched one of the sermons. She watched the entire

01:13:50.000 --> 01:13:55.360
 sermon series. She started watching other videos. She shared the sermon series with her husband.

01:13:55.360 --> 01:14:01.120
 They started watching it together. They started going to marriage counseling together. They worked

01:14:01.120 --> 01:14:06.720
 it out together. Now they did not start attending Christ Fellowship Miami online. They felt like they

01:14:06.720 --> 01:14:14.400
 wanted to find a local church to worship together, which is awesome. And so like we, as a church,

01:14:14.400 --> 01:14:19.200
 we're able to get, we were able to literally save a marriage of a woman in Atlanta. I

01:14:19.200 --> 01:14:24.560
 can honestly tell you, I've never met her, but hearing her, hearing her husband's story

01:14:24.560 --> 01:14:29.040
 and physically, I've seen her on zoom and then helping them get connected, restore their marriage.

01:14:29.040 --> 01:14:32.640
 And now, you know, serving faithfully in a church in Atlanta, that is a huge win.

01:14:33.280 --> 01:14:38.560
 And that happened as a result, because that content that exists for that one hour on Sunday,

01:14:38.560 --> 01:14:45.200
 there was intentionality to make sure that it existed in a search engine format and it was available out

01:14:45.200 --> 01:14:50.720
 in the interwebs and YouTube and wherever else. So much effort goes into that one hour on Sunday.

01:14:50.720 --> 01:14:55.840
 And it's a shame that it dies on the one hour on Sunday. It can live far beyond that.

01:14:55.840 --> 01:15:02.480
 We just need to be intentional with that space. Hey, any other, listen, opening it up. Any other

01:15:02.480 --> 01:15:07.600
 questions, comments, thoughts, feel free to raise your hand. Tyler, anything else from y'all's perspective?

01:15:09.760 --> 01:15:12.400
 No, I mean, I'm just, I'm learning. This is all good.

01:15:12.400 --> 01:15:19.600
 Awesome. Love it. Hey, Jason, what do you think? There's, there's an opportunity where like,

01:15:20.400 --> 01:15:25.680
 think about this for a second. What if, and we're, we're doing this with our AT communities and stuff

01:15:25.680 --> 01:15:32.960
 like that. And we've talked about this at length, but what if, instead of looking at our weekend

01:15:32.960 --> 01:15:41.520
 gatherings as ephemeral experiences, what if we were more strategic with them beyond just thinking

01:15:41.520 --> 01:15:47.680
 through, oh, I want to teach on this, this series, or even planning out for the year. What if we were

01:15:47.680 --> 01:15:58.160
 to think of ours as a discipleship continuum that would step people one step at a time from seeker

01:15:58.160 --> 01:16:05.360
 to believer, to follower, to leader. What if we were to take these types of, this type of content

01:16:05.360 --> 01:16:15.600
 on a continuum, and then have it be evergreen for other places in the world to use and follow that same

01:16:15.600 --> 01:16:22.720
 journey. So like in a lot of cases, when one does a church plant, that's how it works. They get a small

01:16:22.720 --> 01:16:29.280
 group together, and they start setting DNA from the beginning, and there's a lot of intentionality in the first

01:16:29.280 --> 01:16:35.760
 year, even before they start their first church service, as to how they are going to be discipling,

01:16:35.760 --> 01:16:40.480
 what they're going to be doing. And in my mind, I'm thinking, dude, why don't we just use that

01:16:41.440 --> 01:16:49.040
 and help other Acts 2 communities, help other church plants start all around the world,

01:16:49.040 --> 01:16:55.200
 if you digitize that continuum, and then you just rinse and repeat that whole thing all over. And

01:16:55.200 --> 01:17:02.560
 oddly enough, when when church planners get started, they do a lot of the right things. And then once the

01:17:02.560 --> 01:17:09.440
 church service, and the building, and the staffing, and the offerings, and all of those things start

01:17:09.440 --> 01:17:18.400
 coming into play, it almost feels like that initial momentum gets lost. And I, it's, it's odd to me. Okay,

01:17:18.400 --> 01:17:25.200
 here's, this is just me thinking, and if I'm wrong, please, please tell me. Please tell me I'm wrong.

01:17:26.320 --> 01:17:31.200
 It feels like, with a prevailing model of church, and the way that we're used to doing things,

01:17:32.240 --> 01:17:39.040
 that the church planters are the only ones that are truly getting discipled. And I mean that not to

01:17:39.040 --> 01:17:43.840
 make anybody mad. It's not that there's not Bible teaching going on, or that there's not discipleship

01:17:43.840 --> 01:17:50.640
 going on. But when you train a church planter, you're going through the entire continuum

01:17:50.640 --> 01:17:55.360
 of what the real discipleship journey is, which means you're going to be making disciples.

01:17:56.160 --> 01:18:02.400
 Most, most people that are into discipleship don't get to that place. And, but church planters do. So it

01:18:02.400 --> 01:18:07.920
 feels like in some ways, there's are the only ones that are getting completely discipled. That's one.

01:18:08.560 --> 01:18:15.360
 And then there, when they start their first year, maybe two years, is when they see the most

01:18:15.360 --> 01:18:22.560
 growth in their ministries. And then it tapers off. And so what happens is, I believe, is that a lot of

01:18:22.560 --> 01:18:29.440
 that discipleship continuum, that discipleship journey, that that completely discipled church

01:18:29.440 --> 01:18:35.120
 planter embarks on a group of people and takes them on a journey for two years and then doesn't know what

01:18:35.120 --> 01:18:42.480
 to do with all of the people that are showing up to church, then it just kind of plateaus. And when

01:18:42.480 --> 01:18:48.560
 people look at the data, they say, the way that you evangelize a nation is by planting churches,

01:18:49.280 --> 01:18:58.800
 because new churches reach new people. That's true. But maybe if you look at a couple of correlative

01:18:58.800 --> 01:19:08.480
 things to that equation, maybe it's just that discipled people preach people. Or maybe when

01:19:09.440 --> 01:19:18.080
 completely discipled people reach other people with an intentional strategy, maybe that evangelizes better

01:19:18.080 --> 01:19:23.600
 than anything. And that feels to me a lot like what Jesus did in the Gospels.

01:19:25.600 --> 01:19:31.680
 I'll tell you this. Right now, out of this, maybe, I don't know, 16, 20 people in Clubhouse. And so

01:19:31.680 --> 01:19:37.360
 I'm going to tell you something that, honestly, I've never really... I don't talk about this publicly.

01:19:37.360 --> 01:19:42.000
 I don't say this a lot. And so you 20 people, you're getting the... And by the way, whoever's

01:19:42.000 --> 01:19:43.040
 listening on the podcast...

01:19:43.040 --> 01:19:44.400
 This is going to be good. I can tell.

01:19:44.400 --> 01:19:52.960
 This is going to go everywhere, right? But the reality is, is I sat down maybe three years ago,

01:19:52.960 --> 01:20:01.200
 four years ago. I had one of my volunteers, he was a 20-something millennial. I was a digital pastor

01:20:01.200 --> 01:20:09.120
 at a church. And he wanted to have a conversation about the discipleship at the church that I was at.

01:20:09.120 --> 01:20:16.160
 And so I sat down with him and listened to him to share and talk. And so we're at a pizza parlor.

01:20:16.160 --> 01:20:22.880
 And this guy, this millennial, is yelling at me. It is me and him in this restaurant. No one else is

01:20:22.880 --> 01:20:27.840
 there except the cooks and the people behind the counter. And he's yelling at me at the lack of

01:20:27.840 --> 01:20:35.920
 discipleship. And I'm like, dude, it's in a mega-giga-church environment. It's called small

01:20:35.920 --> 01:20:42.640
 groups. It's not. You're making a big deal about it or nothing. And he keeps yelling at me. And so

01:20:42.640 --> 01:20:47.760
 finally, after about 15 minutes of them yelling at me, this is honest to God truth. This is my midlife

01:20:47.760 --> 01:20:54.240
 crisis. I listened to him and I realized, oh crap, he's right. And all of a sudden, talking about the

01:20:54.240 --> 01:20:59.760
 stuff that you learned when you're planning a church, when I was doing college ministry 20 plus

01:20:59.760 --> 01:21:06.000
 years ago, all that training on discipleship, all that stuff that honestly, after 20 years of ministry,

01:21:06.000 --> 01:21:12.480
 I had forgotten it transparently. It wasn't a part of my life anymore. And so because I was doing this

01:21:12.480 --> 01:21:18.000
 other system, all of that started flooding, coming back to me, listening to this millennial yell at me

01:21:18.000 --> 01:21:23.920
 about how the church did not have a good discipleship strategy. And all of a sudden,

01:21:23.920 --> 01:21:29.760
 I realized I have to do this. And so in conversations like this, working with churches

01:21:29.760 --> 01:21:36.000
 ad nauseum, helping them convert, recognize, shift over towards a more intentional discipleship process,

01:21:36.000 --> 01:21:42.160
 having conversations with Jason Morris, talking about bless and reproducing that model, reproducing that

01:21:42.160 --> 01:21:47.120
 structure in and among others. So others can tell others who can tell others. It's crazy.

01:21:47.680 --> 01:21:54.080
 Pre-COVID, nobody was buying this stuff. Because why would I listen to this? The big,

01:21:54.080 --> 01:21:58.320
 the big building's fine. Yeah, I mean, we've got millions invested. Yeah, tenants is down, but we'll be

01:21:58.320 --> 01:22:04.320
 okay. Like we just, we just need to work harder, just need to make more calls. But now, as a result of

01:22:04.320 --> 01:22:12.720
 COVID, that model, the large gathering, like it's not effective. And so much energy even still goes into

01:22:12.720 --> 01:22:17.360
 that. If we would pour the energy of the large gathering, and Jason, I think you're right. There

01:22:17.360 --> 01:22:22.560
 has to be a point where the large gathering can connect to, where we can start to reproduce people.

01:22:22.560 --> 01:22:27.440
 We just have to figure out that sauce. Right, right. It's like you, the gathering in my mind is

01:22:27.440 --> 01:22:37.760
 something that happens as a result of a group of disciples that happens as a result of a disciple

01:22:37.760 --> 01:22:45.040
 maker. So the, I think a lot of times we flipped what we're supposed to do and what Jesus is supposed

01:22:45.040 --> 01:22:52.240
 to do. Because Jesus told us to make disciples, and he said that he would build his church. And I think we

01:22:52.240 --> 01:22:58.640
 make the mistake of trying to do Jesus' job of building a church, hoping that Jesus will make

01:22:58.640 --> 01:23:05.760
 disciples for us. And we're, we're doing the wrong job. It's our job to make disciples. If you truly do

01:23:05.760 --> 01:23:12.560
 make disciples who make disciples, that will become a church. But if you plant a church, you, or rather,

01:23:12.560 --> 01:23:15.840
 if you plant a church service, you may or may not always get disciples.

01:23:15.840 --> 01:23:25.040
 Yeah, so true. Jason, you and I did a podcast a month ago, two months ago. We said, I want to say it was 2021,

01:23:25.040 --> 01:23:29.680
 early 2021. We did a podcast. We were talking about the A2 communities, the house church, the micro church.

01:23:29.680 --> 01:23:36.320
 Oh yeah. And so it's a great podcast. At the end of the podcast, I made this statement. If you are out there,

01:23:36.320 --> 01:23:40.760
 church staff, and you've never been discipled, here's my cell phone number, 484-324-8724.

01:23:40.760 --> 01:23:42.320
 Oh yeah, I remember that. Did anybody call you?

01:23:42.320 --> 01:23:49.200
 You remember that? I had three texts. I had three texts. And I'm honest to God, I got them connected.

01:23:49.200 --> 01:23:53.760
 I have a friend of mine that teaches the Timothy initiative. And so I've got a friend of mine,

01:23:53.760 --> 01:24:00.240
 literally teaching people, discipling people, teaching them a disciple making system and kind

01:24:00.240 --> 01:24:06.240
 of doing that walkway. And so listen, and I would say the same thing here, you know, the people listening,

01:24:06.240 --> 01:24:11.280
 if we've been talking a lot about discipleship, honestly, I didn't anticipate it going this deep.

01:24:11.280 --> 01:24:16.560
 I thought we'd touch on it, but hey, that's cool. If you're like, hey, you know what? I've been doing

01:24:16.560 --> 01:24:21.680
 this church thing, but you're talking about a whole other level that I've never understood before.

01:24:22.480 --> 01:24:30.720
 My text number, my cell phone number is literally 484-324-8724. I would love to have a conversation with you.

01:24:30.720 --> 01:24:38.640
 I want to challenge you to something. Instead of pawning off a person who's trying to connect with you for

01:24:38.640 --> 01:24:41.680
 discipleship, you do it. I know.

01:24:41.680 --> 01:24:42.560
 You make disciples.

01:24:43.920 --> 01:24:44.160
 Yeah.

01:24:45.440 --> 01:24:52.000
 Dude, I see people here like Ben and George. I want to hear from them. Man, there's people that I recognize

01:24:52.000 --> 01:25:00.160
 here and yeah. So anybody else, come on up. I've got, I got five minutes and I got to go,

01:25:00.160 --> 01:25:02.640
 but I would love a closing thought from somebody. Somebody jump in.

01:25:05.440 --> 01:25:09.040
 And my phone just beeped. George Holloway coming up.

01:25:10.400 --> 01:25:10.800
 Okay.

01:25:11.280 --> 01:25:15.680
 Hey, I've loved this conversation. I just wanted to just kind of, since you can't,

01:25:15.680 --> 01:25:19.760
 there's no reactions in Clubhouse when you're in the audience. I just wanted to clap

01:25:19.760 --> 01:25:20.720
 to what Jason said.

01:25:20.720 --> 01:25:21.520
 Oh yeah, that would be cool.

01:25:22.000 --> 01:25:28.480
 You do it is a message that I think pastors need to hear when I do discipleship.

01:25:29.920 --> 01:25:37.280
 That's something I'm real passionate about. And picking up the phone and calling the people in

01:25:37.280 --> 01:25:44.080
 your church. Like, how are you doing? What's going on in your life? How can I speak the gospel into

01:25:44.080 --> 01:25:50.320
 what you're going through? And like, it's, I feel like too often we're looking for a program that

01:25:50.320 --> 01:25:57.280
 like systematizes discipleship, but I just loved what you said. You just, you do it, pastor. You do it.

01:25:58.000 --> 01:26:04.640
 Yeah. And here's, here's the trick with that is that, and dude, I can, I can have the same kind

01:26:04.640 --> 01:26:16.320
 of hypocrisy where, you know, there's 2,543 churches that have been planted. Um, 10,000 people,

01:26:16.320 --> 01:26:22.000
 over 10,000 people last year that were baptized, not even ones that, you know, twice the amount,

01:26:22.000 --> 01:26:27.120
 that amount gave their lives to Christ that I've had the privilege to empower.

01:26:28.560 --> 01:26:37.440
 But if I am not personally doing the exact same thing that I am asking everyone else to do and all

01:26:37.440 --> 01:26:44.880
 of their followers to do, then I'm a hypocrite. Really? And not only that, but I am also teaching

01:26:45.440 --> 01:26:54.080
 it, it affects negatively my training because I cannot give current examples from current experience

01:26:54.720 --> 01:27:01.600
 that would make my training come alive because there's nothing like doing. There's nothing like

01:27:01.600 --> 01:27:08.080
 obeying Jesus because once you start doing that and you start obeying, then your spiritual life just comes

01:27:08.080 --> 01:27:21.520
 alive. So true. So true right there. Love that. Hey, I'm trying to get, uh, I see pastor. He's like

01:27:21.520 --> 01:27:29.600
 the first guy. Yeah. It's his first time here. It's awesome. And, uh, the software is not letting

01:27:29.600 --> 01:27:38.080
 me get you up. There you go. Oh, he was there and he's gone. Hey Jeff, I'm here. Awesome. I'd rather

01:27:38.080 --> 01:27:46.720
 be, I'd rather be Wayne air late than the late Wayne air. Uh, I just need that phone number. I've got a

01:27:46.720 --> 01:27:52.320
 number of, uh, interns that I want to pass that along to, uh, and not for the sake of Jeff, not for the

01:27:52.320 --> 01:27:57.840
 sake of, uh, even if they end up, uh, you know, getting connected with you or not getting connected

01:27:57.840 --> 01:28:02.000
 with you. It is just going to be such an encouragement for them to know that there's

01:28:02.000 --> 01:28:06.160
 somebody out there that will do this, that I can, that I can be a part of it too, as well. Like I,

01:28:06.800 --> 01:28:12.320
 I would love to just be able to zoom with you once a month and just keep us on track here at First

01:28:12.320 --> 01:28:19.360
 Baptist because, you know, I grew up in the Maritimes and, uh, of Canada. And I can't remember

01:28:19.360 --> 01:28:25.440
 one time in my entire existence as a pastor, anybody ever saying, Hey, we're starting a

01:28:25.440 --> 01:28:30.480
 discipleship program here at our church. So I know that's unfortunate, but that's just, that's just the

01:28:30.480 --> 01:28:36.000
 culture. You know, it was such high church. It was such all about the Sunday morning, Wednesday night,

01:28:36.000 --> 01:28:40.320
 Sunday night, being in your place. If you're not in your place, you know, if you're not on your bus

01:28:40.320 --> 01:28:46.760
 route, you know, you better get right with God. So, um, I really appreciate, I really appreciate what

01:28:46.760 --> 01:28:50.240
 you're sharing. And so if you could pass that number along again, that's really all I want.

01:28:51.440 --> 01:29:00.560
 Awesome. I'm happy to do that. 484-324-8724. It just happens to be number four, the church.

01:29:01.280 --> 01:29:07.040
 Um, thank you, Google voice, uh, number four, and then spell out the church in telephone alphabet.

01:29:07.520 --> 01:29:14.240
 Uh, but yeah, we would love to connect with you, uh, pastor Wayne. And so learn, learn more about you.

01:29:14.240 --> 01:29:18.960
 Uh, definitely want to be a resource and if I can encourage them and turn along the way,

01:29:18.960 --> 01:29:24.640
 uh, God, God bless them. So yeah, let's, let's get together on that. Well, I hate to do this. I have

01:29:24.640 --> 01:29:29.680
 to go, I have to have to go be dad. I got to go, uh, take my son to Taekwondo. He's going to do like

01:29:30.720 --> 01:29:34.480
 kick kids in the head. And so I get to watch that for a while and it's going to be awesome.

01:29:34.480 --> 01:29:40.560
 But Hey, I want to thank, uh, Jason for jumping on here. This has been great. Uh, Katie, George,

01:29:40.560 --> 01:29:46.400
 thank you for sharing. Uh, pastor Wayne is a pleasure to meet you. And I'm serious. Anybody,

01:29:46.400 --> 01:29:52.240
 I would love to dialogue more about this information to contact me is in my bio through

01:29:52.240 --> 01:29:57.040
 clubhouse. You can click on that. And, uh, I know there's at least, uh, the church.digital slash

01:29:57.040 --> 01:30:01.520
 clubhouse. You can book time with me through there if you want to jump on a zoom call or something,

01:30:01.520 --> 01:30:05.360
 but we'd love to dialogue more about this. Hey, I'm going to be doing these every

01:30:05.920 --> 01:30:10.480
 Thursday at five o'clock for, for definitely for a while, but locked in gear five o'clock Eastern,

01:30:11.120 --> 01:30:16.880
 five o'clock Eastern. Thank you for that. So, um, I will get, uh, I'm trying to actually remember what

01:30:16.880 --> 01:30:22.960
 my next topic is, uh, how digital is different. Uh, and so I had a church planner down here in South

01:30:22.960 --> 01:30:29.760
 Florida or a, um, a, uh, there was a Liz, Liz Rios is down here. She's not a planner, but she's a

01:30:29.760 --> 01:30:34.320
 denominational lead for church planners in South Florida. And so she and I were talking on Facebook

01:30:35.040 --> 01:30:40.560
 and I was like, Liz, come up with the topic. I'll do it on clubhouse, invite whoever you want. And

01:30:40.560 --> 01:30:45.280
 she says, Jeff, I want you to talk about how digital is different. So we're going to do it. We're going

01:30:45.280 --> 01:30:49.920
 to talk about how digital is different than physical and how you need to treat digital in different to

01:30:49.920 --> 01:30:56.400
 be successful. That is coming up next Thursday, 5 PM Eastern here at clubhouse for, for Jason, for,

01:30:56.400 --> 01:31:01.760
 for pastor Wayne, for, for George, Katie, didn't mean to leave you last, but definitely loved having

01:31:01.760 --> 01:31:06.240
 you on as well. Jeff with the church digital and stadia church planning. Hey, thanks y'all for,

01:31:06.240 --> 01:31:09.120
 for being here and we'll see you next week. Evidently y'all have a good day.