WEBVTT

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 You don't have to add anything to your busy schedule in order to bless somebody.

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 Just instead of eating by yourself, ask somebody to join you.

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 And again, I think online, like if you're, I mean, we're all working out of the house,

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 right?

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 But you're still going to stop and eat.

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 So call somebody up and say, hey, how about noon?

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 Let's just take a break at the same time and share a meal.

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 Welcome to the Church Digital Podcast.

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 Through this podcast, we'll talk about the technological innovations within the church.

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 But more than tech for tech itself, we'll address deeper questions.

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 Is disciple making possible digitally?

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 How should we approach the digital mission field?

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 Can a biblically grounded church operate in digital space?

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 Oh, and where does the metaverse fit into all this?

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 Whether you're a big or small church, an established church, or a startup church plant,

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 the Church Digital's goal is to help churches like yours learn to be a multiplying church,

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 digitally and physically.

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 Our heart, that churches like yours will discover a newfound focus on disciple making

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 that will revolutionize your church.

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 And now, here's your host, Jeff Reed.

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 All right, hey, welcome to the Church Digital Podcast.

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 And it's great to be here again with you.

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 It's episode 216.

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 Excited about where we're going with this conversation and today's guest.

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 Hey, we are doing the Leadership Network is doing a metaverse church summit.

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 We're doing a free conference on a metaverse church and what's happening in that space just

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 a mere couple of days away.

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 If you're listening in real time when this podcast released, we're doing it Wednesday.

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 I believe that's going to be like the 17th.

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 And so 1 to 4 p.m.

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 Head over to the website leadnet.org.

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 For more information, man, there's going to be, I could just start naming the number of

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 people, but anybody, a lot of the people that have been on this podcast, we got to come in

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 and talk about metaverse church.

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 And so if you are considering the metaverse, maybe you've talked about doing some stuff in

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 virtual reality or some of the other Web3 technologies.

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 You've talked about it to your leadership and they're not sure.

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 You know what?

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 Get them to watch that summit and get them exposed to maybe some of these ideas.

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 It's interesting, just real quick.

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 There's been a pastor I've been trying to connect with for four years and the person, long story

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 short, just keeps blowing me off.

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 Jeff, you know, really not interested in metaverse.

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 Jeff, really not interested in having conversations about digital.

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 Guy signed up for the summit.

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 So Leadership Network is throwing their credibility behind this and that's exciting.

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 So go check out leadnet.org for more information on that and get connected into that summit free

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 if you're watching it live here in a couple of days.

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 It's going to be great.

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 And that's actually, it's going to set up awesome because while we're talking metaverse and while

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 we're talking crazy, I've got my friend here, John Ferguson from, you know, loosely with New

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 Thing Network, definitely with Community Christian Church up in Chicago here on the podcast.

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 So John, thanks for coming on with us.

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 Yeah, great to be with you, Jeff.

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 Thanks.

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 I thought it was interesting.

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 You said if you want to be a part of metaverse, I didn't know it was optional anymore, but

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 it's good that you're still giving people the out.

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 Well, it's interesting.

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 I wrote a really great comment.

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 I actually wrote a blog about how a lot of churches are still operating in a web one in

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 an information age mentality where, hey, let's put our information on the website about

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 our services and let's just expect people to show up on our services.

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 And that may have worked in, you know, 2005.

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 I think in 2022, not sure it's going to get the results that you're looking for.

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 And we're definitely trending away from that.

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 No, I know.

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 I mean, I know this isn't exactly where we're going with this conversation, but just quick,

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 quick, quick story if it's okay.

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 Just past few weeks, we lead a small group right here in this home.

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 It's my house.

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 I live on the north side of Chicago in the city.

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 And a couple contacted me.

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 Hey, I'd like to connect with your small group.

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 And I'm like, okay, I don't think I've ever seen them on a Sunday.

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 How did they find out about us?

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 And through the course of conversation, they said, yeah, well, we've actually been a part

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 of community since last August and just been with you guys online and really enjoyed it

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 and loved it.

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 But I feel like now it's time for us to connect to a small group.

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 Still haven't finally showed up one time on a Sunday for the first time, but been a part

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 of the small group now for about a month, giving generously to the church.

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 But, you know, their almost entire experience has been online.

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 And so it's really, really fun to see.

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 And another young woman who's never been to one of our locations in the city next, this

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 coming Sunday is going to get baptized.

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 She took an alpha course online with us.

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 She took a rooted course with us online, but has never been to any one of our in-person

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 services.

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 But she's getting baptized at one of our physical locations.

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 Because maybe you figured that out.

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 Is there a way to get baptized without showing up at a physical location?

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 Well, it's funny you ask that.

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 Yeah, there are.

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 It's funny.

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 There's probably three or four different methods that digital churches are using.

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 Everything from, I think, Jay Cranda over at Saddleback's told stories about literally

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 flying across the country to go baptize somebody.

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 And so there is a little bit of that.

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 There are churches, when I was at Christ Fellowship Miami, we did trainings where we would

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 train people on how to baptize.

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 And so as long as they were Christian, we were training others to do the baptism.

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 A really funny video of somebody getting baptized at a house church that was meeting in a New

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 York City apartment.

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 And when they actually did the dunking in the little five-square-foot bathroom in a New

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 York City apartment, they didn't dunk away from the nozzle.

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 They dunked towards the nozzle.

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 And there was like an inch.

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 It didn't actually hit.

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 John Ferguson's freaking out on me just in space.

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 It didn't hit, but it was like an inch away.

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 It caused for a lot of humorous and drama from it.

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 But yeah, listen, baptism's a real thing.

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 Communion.

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 How do you do communion?

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 I jokingly talked in COVID about how I did communion with my family with Coca-Cola and

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 cauliflower wafers, because that's the closest thing we had to grape juice and unleavened

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 bread in the house.

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 A lot of grape juice substitutes, for sure.

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 A lot of grape juice substitutes for that season.

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 Yeah, you got to be careful with those in-home baptisms.

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 You know, you have to have people sign some sort of like release or waiver that if they're

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 injured, you know, they can't hold the church liable for any injuries.

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 So true.

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 By the way, like I really have enjoyed this conversation.

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 I am a employee of Community Christian Church in Chicago.

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 And so like I'm literally sitting here having a conversation with a co-worker.

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 So this has been great, John, man.

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 Thanks for jumping in this and having it.

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 Like this is like relaxing and fun.

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 Normally working with like new thing people talking, I'll shop.

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 But hey, this is great.

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 Just chewing the fat.

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 Maybe we'll talk about eating.

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 I have a feeling here in a little bit.

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 So here, I got a drink too.

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 Cheers.

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 All right.

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 Hey, iced tea at its finest.

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 Very good.

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 All right.

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 Hey, so let's dig into this.

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 Here's what we're talking about today.

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 We're brainstorming here with Digital Church Network, with New Thing Network.

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 How to become, how to train, how to equip digital missionaries.

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 And so the idea we've been talking about like from an influencer perspective.

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 And just last week, we did a podcast with Tyler Sansom, who was talking a lot about his

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 approach to First Capital Christian on how to train digital missionaries.

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 And honestly, his approach is very technical.

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 It's very detailed.

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 It's very thorough.

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 And it's not necessarily for everybody, but it's very effective for those that are wanting

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 to do it.

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 By the way, we're going to start to release some of that through Digital Church Network

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 in the months to come.

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 So you want to pay attention if you're interested in kind of adapting more of this like influencer

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 approach and using that influencer gaining to point people to Christ.

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 Now, for today's conversation, I really want to start to, you know, peel back some layers

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 here because John Ferguson and his brother, you know, maybe you've heard of him, Dave Ferguson.

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 The two of these guys got together, I don't know, years ago and wrote this book, Bless.

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 Bless Practices.

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 We'll put a link to it in the show notes, but it really started to impact how to be a missionary,

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 how to connect with people in the physical realm.

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 And I sat down in just a casual moment doing work, looking at blessed practices, looking

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 at kind of what we could do digitally.

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 And I started to ask the question, what would it look like if we utilize this blessed foundation,

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 not necessarily from an influencer perspective, but much more at an individual level, at a

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 personal level, and started to connect with people almost as a digital missionary through

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 it.

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 And so the theory, the hypothesis is, is can we use blessed practices towards it?

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 Now, the beauty of this is that John Ferguson, I really have not unpacked this idea, neither

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 have Dave and I.

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 And so we're doing a training with Dave in a couple of weeks through DCN on this as well,

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 but would love to maybe get some conversations here.

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 John Ferguson, let's just even start with this.

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 So blessed practices, what, describe for me a little bit, what is blessed practices?

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 What does this actually mean?

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 Yeah, great, great question, Jeff.

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 Thanks again for the opportunity to talk about this.

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 And yeah, I don't claim to be the expert on digital evangelism, but I do think blessed is

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 the kind of thing that could apply to just about any context and definitely in the digital

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 realm as well.

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 So, you know, at Community, our mission is helping people find their way back to God.

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 And I think, I will speak for Dave, I do that quite frequently, I will now as well, in saying

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 that, you know, I think both of us personally experienced some of the same frustration many

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 others have felt when it comes to sharing your faith, whether that's, you know, actual in

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 person or digitally for that matter.

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 And I think, you know, so often in spite of our best efforts, you know, it feels, it almost

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 comes off like a sales pitch or an effort to get somebody to do something they didn't

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 necessarily want to do.

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 And so the last thing anybody I think wants to do is turn somebody off in an effort to

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 show them something as significant, as impactful as the love of Jesus.

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 And so, you know, we came up with what we found was really a theme throughout scripture that

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 we are called to be a blessing, to bless those around us.

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 I mean, I grew up in a Christian home and have experienced the impact of a life-changing

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 relationship with Jesus.

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 And, you know, when you experience that, you naturally want to share that with others.

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 We just couldn't find a way to do it that felt natural and authentic.

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 And so in some ways, bless came out of, I think, our own personal frustrations, but also

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 since that same frustration in the lives of the people in our church.

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 I mean, good night.

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 Our mission is helping people find their way back to God.

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 People in our church could recite it.

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 They could point to it on the website.

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 They could see it on the signs when you walk in.

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 I mean, it was everywhere.

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 I remember Ed Stetzer at one time coming to community and we had lunch afterwards and he's

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 shaking his head and he's going, he's going like this, like, man, 13 times, 13 times.

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 And I'm like, 13 times what?

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 And he says, I heard somebody say, helping people find their way back to God at least

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 13 times from the moment I walked in the doors to the time I had left, you know, your facility

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 today for church.

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 And in some ways that's awesome, right?

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 People could say it, right?

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 I mean, people really were hoping their people would find, their friends and family would

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 find their way back to God.

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 But we wanted to kind of move it from not just hoping our friends and family would find

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 their way back to God, but actually helping them find their way back to God.

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 And so, man, those frustrations and what we were seeing in the lives of our people really,

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 I think, is what kind of spurned us on to look for something that would be really practical,

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 simple, biblical.

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 And it just turns out that these five practices reflect the very things that Jesus did when

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 he walked the earth.

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 So that's what, that's what bless is all about.

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 It's just, you know, living like Jesus and being real specific and practical about what

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 it looks like to interact with people in hopes of sharing the love of Jesus with him in a

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 real practical way.

00:12:13.760 --> 00:12:14.820
 Yeah, I love it.

00:12:14.900 --> 00:12:19.380
 So it's even just for the audience that maybe isn't aware of the details of bless.

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 From an overview briefly, let's go ahead and hit the five, B-L-E-S-S.

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 What are these five elements that are tied into bless?

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 Yeah, for sure.

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 And again, you know, just to kind of lay the foundation too.

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 I mean, you look at Genesis 12.

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 What did, what did God say to Abraham?

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 Go from your country and your people, your father's household to a land I will show you.

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 I will make you in a great nation.

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 I will bless you.

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 I will make your name great.

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 You will be a blessing.

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 And through you, I will bless all nations on earth.

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 And, and that continues.

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 And, and when you start to look at bless, it's amazing how much you see that from Genesis

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 all the way through revelation.

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 Paul says that as heirs of Abraham, we too are blessed to be a blessing.

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 So yeah, real quick, if you look at B-L-E-S-S, it's the B is for begin with prayer.

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 The L is for listen.

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 All right.

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 The E is my favorite.

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 That's for eating, you know, sharing meals.

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 The S, the first S in bless is serve.

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 And then the second S in bless is story.

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 It's to tell your story.

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 So B-L-E-S-S, real simple, acrostic, begin with prayer, listen, eat, serve, and tell your

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 story.

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 Awesome.

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 So maybe there's some challenges around eat, eat together in digital space.

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 But remember, we're talking here, we're hypothesizing how can bless, how could that work as a, as

00:13:37.640 --> 00:13:42.500
 a digital missionary and how can we use this to equip maybe our people or maybe even ourselves

00:13:42.500 --> 00:13:46.360
 towards embracing a digital or a metaverse mission field.

00:13:46.440 --> 00:13:48.740
 But Hey, let's, let's, you know, just get some, go ahead.

00:13:48.900 --> 00:13:51.860
 I was going to say, Jeff, it's interesting because I was thinking about our talk today and

00:13:51.860 --> 00:13:54.760
 I came on that eat, you know, we'll talk a little bit more about this in depth, but just

00:13:54.760 --> 00:13:58.480
 since you brought it up, let's not forget the skills that we learned during the pandemic.

00:13:59.160 --> 00:14:04.280
 I mean, a lot of us were actually setting up and having meals with people over Zoom, right?

00:14:04.320 --> 00:14:05.860
 I mean, Hey, you know, it's noon.

00:14:05.920 --> 00:14:06.380
 I'm going to be eating.

00:14:06.420 --> 00:14:08.720
 You want to like get on Zoom and let's, let's have a meal together.

00:14:08.820 --> 00:14:09.520
 You eat where you are.

00:14:09.700 --> 00:14:10.300
 I eat where I am.

00:14:10.800 --> 00:14:12.000
 Why not still do that?

00:14:12.660 --> 00:14:12.940
 Right.

00:14:13.000 --> 00:14:16.880
 I mean, just because the pandemic's over doesn't, we mean, we can't still use some of those,

00:14:16.980 --> 00:14:19.440
 I think skills that were actually effective back then.

00:14:19.480 --> 00:14:20.340
 So anyway, sidebar.

00:14:20.420 --> 00:14:20.920
 Sorry about that.

00:14:21.140 --> 00:14:21.720
 No, beautiful.

00:14:21.840 --> 00:14:22.200
 Love it.

00:14:22.240 --> 00:14:25.460
 I mean, ironically, that's, that's why I brought a drink into the conversation because I was

00:14:25.460 --> 00:14:29.120
 like, Hey, might as well model this while we're actually having the conversation here.

00:14:29.480 --> 00:14:30.580
 But let me ask this question.

00:14:30.580 --> 00:14:31.940
 Let's just back up a little bit.

00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:34.640
 Bless it in the, in the physical realm.

00:14:34.820 --> 00:14:40.980
 How are you seeing like churches implement this, apply this people, individuals, like maybe

00:14:40.980 --> 00:14:45.000
 do you have some stories about how people are utilizing this bless framework?

00:14:45.440 --> 00:14:46.000
 Yeah, absolutely.

00:14:46.320 --> 00:14:50.980
 I mean, you know, obviously a community we're, we're using it and we started talking and teaching

00:14:50.980 --> 00:14:54.200
 and training people in these five practices.

00:14:54.720 --> 00:14:59.660
 Ah, boy, I would say at least 10 years ago, the book wasn't actually published until 2021,

00:14:59.660 --> 00:15:04.160
 but it's something that we've seen people put into practice for, for a number of years

00:15:04.160 --> 00:15:04.460
 now.

00:15:04.540 --> 00:15:08.220
 And I think, um, you know, what we tried to do, and this is what we encourage churches

00:15:08.220 --> 00:15:11.680
 to do, you know, whether it's, uh, in-person digital, however you want to talk about it.

00:15:12.000 --> 00:15:15.780
 Uh, we encourage you to, you know, let's, let's focus on your leadership first, your staff

00:15:15.780 --> 00:15:21.440
 team, and really help them understand and begin to practice these bless, um, rhythms

00:15:21.440 --> 00:15:21.920
 first.

00:15:22.400 --> 00:15:24.140
 Uh, so you have some stories to tell.

00:15:24.140 --> 00:15:28.900
 And so it was really important for Dave and myself and our staff team to begin to look

00:15:28.900 --> 00:15:32.640
 at our own lives and, and really begin to put these into play in our own world before

00:15:32.640 --> 00:15:36.340
 we were talking about it and beginning to implement it on a, on a church wide scale.

00:15:36.540 --> 00:15:41.180
 And so, I mean, like one of the simple, uh, practices that I know, uh, Dave has is, and

00:15:41.180 --> 00:15:45.580
 myself too, is when I'm, when I'm journaling in the morning and I don't journal every day,

00:15:45.580 --> 00:15:50.020
 but you know, pretty good practice of reading scripture and reflecting and just spending

00:15:50.020 --> 00:15:52.340
 some quiet time with God on a, on a daily basis.

00:15:52.460 --> 00:15:55.300
 I actually have the word bless on, in my journal.

00:15:55.400 --> 00:15:57.260
 Now I, I have been a journal on my laptop.

00:15:57.260 --> 00:16:01.980
 And so I kind of have a set up sort of a template that I use for my, for my daily journaling for

00:16:01.980 --> 00:16:03.280
 reflecting on scripture and praying.

00:16:03.440 --> 00:16:04.920
 And in there is the word bless.

00:16:05.360 --> 00:16:10.440
 And underneath that is a list of people that, you know, on a regular basis, I'm saying, okay,

00:16:10.440 --> 00:16:14.960
 God, you know, give me opportunities to bless these people, whatever that might look like,

00:16:15.420 --> 00:16:19.720
 whether it's, you know, I see them, um, via online or in person, uh, throughout the course

00:16:19.720 --> 00:16:21.160
 of my day, give me an opportunity.

00:16:21.260 --> 00:16:23.620
 Some of those people are folks that live right across the street, right here.

00:16:24.300 --> 00:16:28.440
 Others are people that I'm in contact with, uh, through other connections, you know, throughout

00:16:28.440 --> 00:16:29.120
 the course of the week.

00:16:29.160 --> 00:16:33.260
 But that's one practice that, you know, anybody can put into place every day.

00:16:33.260 --> 00:16:36.780
 So I'm, I'm asking God, help me look for opportunities to bless those people.

00:16:36.880 --> 00:16:41.980
 But then also I know there's going to be sort of, um, impromptu opportunities throughout

00:16:41.980 --> 00:16:46.740
 the course of my day, also to bless the people that I come across, um, you know, wherever

00:16:46.740 --> 00:16:47.380
 that might be.

00:16:47.440 --> 00:16:51.880
 And so I'm also saying, God, help me also to keep in mind that I'm blessed to be a blessing.

00:16:52.420 --> 00:16:55.940
 And that might be with someone that I don't even, I don't even know that person yet.

00:16:55.940 --> 00:17:01.480
 I don't even, I don't even know who that might be, but give me a chance to have that mindset

00:17:01.480 --> 00:17:03.400
 of being a blessing to whoever it might be.

00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:07.580
 So, yeah, I mean, there's lots of things that, that we're putting into practice.

00:17:07.640 --> 00:17:10.500
 That would be, you know, just one example of what we try to do on a daily basis.

00:17:10.960 --> 00:17:13.780
 I had no idea the book was written in 2021.

00:17:14.460 --> 00:17:19.320
 Like, I feel like I've known about less for a, of like, I don't want to say a decade, but

00:17:19.320 --> 00:17:20.960
 it's been a minute, right?

00:17:21.220 --> 00:17:25.080
 Did so like, this was just like running in the background and you guys decided to put it

00:17:25.080 --> 00:17:25.500
 on paper?

00:17:25.900 --> 00:17:26.420
 Pretty much.

00:17:26.480 --> 00:17:31.120
 I mean, we, like I said, we put it into practice in our church for a number of years and, uh,

00:17:31.120 --> 00:17:36.920
 but it wasn't until, uh, January of 2021 when we actually, uh, got it published and, um,

00:17:37.220 --> 00:17:39.180
 yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's done pretty well.

00:17:39.180 --> 00:17:46.420
 I think people just are longing for something that's simple, memorable, practical, that allows

00:17:46.420 --> 00:17:49.060
 them and helps them do something they feel compelled to do.

00:17:49.200 --> 00:17:52.640
 And, and then let's face it, a lot of people feel guilty that they're not doing it too.

00:17:52.720 --> 00:17:52.920
 Right.

00:17:53.740 --> 00:17:57.520
 And, and yet so many of the methods, I think approaches that maybe we've been trained in

00:17:57.520 --> 00:18:00.100
 or, or learned when we were younger.

00:18:00.100 --> 00:18:04.400
 I mean, you know, you, I don't know what you're growing up was like, or your teen years or

00:18:04.400 --> 00:18:09.420
 twenties, but you know, it maybe is for spiritual laws, or maybe it was like the two diagnostic

00:18:09.420 --> 00:18:10.960
 questions of angels and explosion.

00:18:11.520 --> 00:18:17.660
 I mean, great methods, I think for a, for an era perhaps, but, um, I think people are looking

00:18:17.660 --> 00:18:22.980
 for something much more relational now that, uh, you know, so much of the focus, I think

00:18:22.980 --> 00:18:27.280
 of the past was a little, you know, it's, it's, it's about the, um, the verbal witness,

00:18:27.380 --> 00:18:27.580
 right?

00:18:27.580 --> 00:18:31.940
 You've got to tell them that's important, but all right.

00:18:31.940 --> 00:18:34.140
 So often people, they want to see it first.

00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:35.760
 They want to experience it with you first.

00:18:35.760 --> 00:18:42.840
 And that's, you know, why these five practices really are sort of, uh, I think the, the, the

00:18:42.840 --> 00:18:44.320
 fancy word is epigenetic.

00:18:44.320 --> 00:18:45.660
 They're like, there's a flow to them.

00:18:45.660 --> 00:18:50.520
 And there's a, there's a sequence to them and story is at the end for a reason, because

00:18:50.520 --> 00:18:54.900
 it's often takes time to build that credibility, build that relationship to the point where

00:18:54.900 --> 00:18:58.380
 hopefully a person will ask you to tell you, tell them your story.

00:18:58.740 --> 00:18:59.900
 No, this is, this is beautiful.

00:18:59.900 --> 00:19:00.780
 And you're right.

00:19:00.920 --> 00:19:03.000
 I don't know what that word epigenetic means.

00:19:03.020 --> 00:19:05.300
 I'll have to go back to the, to the play to listen to it again.

00:19:05.300 --> 00:19:11.380
 But I do think that some of the, the shifts that, that you're doing here, um, do represent

00:19:11.380 --> 00:19:12.240
 a digital audience.

00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:16.800
 Well, we, we find that people, uh, it's better when digital space, it's better to ask questions

00:19:16.800 --> 00:19:17.540
 than make statements.

00:19:17.540 --> 00:19:21.860
 If you want to have a conversation with someone, you look at, let them do the talking first,

00:19:21.860 --> 00:19:25.740
 because in listening to them, you actually build that trust.

00:19:25.740 --> 00:19:30.920
 Um, we, we also find that people often connect to community before they connect to Christ.

00:19:30.920 --> 00:19:35.080
 And this is often a little different than what we see in our physical churches, but in digitally,

00:19:35.080 --> 00:19:40.680
 uh, it's not uncommon, even in the metaverse, it's not uncommon to find atheists or agnostics

00:19:40.680 --> 00:19:46.540
 connected to your church and part of the community and through the relationships now getting them

00:19:46.540 --> 00:19:47.800
 connected into Jesus.

00:19:47.800 --> 00:19:49.340
 But they need that relationship.

00:19:49.340 --> 00:19:51.900
 They need that community before they'll even listen.

00:19:52.100 --> 00:19:56.640
 So a lot of these pivots that, that you're, you're addressing and looking at, my gosh, there's,

00:19:56.960 --> 00:20:01.560
 there's a lot of really intentional things that I think can speak well in digital or metaverse.

00:20:01.640 --> 00:20:06.640
 Well, let me ask this, like you, uh, you came out with this book and so maybe got some,

00:20:06.740 --> 00:20:10.780
 some larger exposure in, in the middle of COVID still shocked at that.

00:20:11.040 --> 00:20:13.340
 Um, what lessons did you learn in COVID?

00:20:13.500 --> 00:20:15.240
 Like, were there any, any takeaways?

00:20:15.240 --> 00:20:17.560
 Was there anything that was like, Hey, that or that?

00:20:17.700 --> 00:20:20.740
 Like what, what did you learn in the COVID season around bless?

00:20:21.200 --> 00:20:22.180
 Uh, that's a great question.

00:20:22.280 --> 00:20:26.300
 I think what we learned is, is, and I think what you're, you're sort of expressing it today

00:20:26.300 --> 00:20:31.080
 is that, um, bless works, you know, in or outside of a pandemic.

00:20:31.080 --> 00:20:33.620
 We actually wrote an article blessed during a pandemic.

00:20:33.940 --> 00:20:37.840
 And as we walked through these blessed practices, we started having to ask ourselves, okay,

00:20:37.960 --> 00:20:43.820
 are, are we limited to blessing people only through, um, you know, physical in-person contact?

00:20:43.820 --> 00:20:45.540
 And what we discovered was no.

00:20:45.540 --> 00:20:48.920
 And in some ways the, the pandemic afforded us additional opportunities.

00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:55.900
 I think the bless in ways, um, that, uh, we hadn't otherwise, uh, certainly the, the incredible

00:20:55.900 --> 00:20:59.440
 needs that occurred around us, uh, provide lots of ways.

00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:03.300
 You know, if you, if you start walking through these, uh, blessed practices, lots of ways

00:21:03.300 --> 00:21:04.200
 to serve people.

00:21:04.700 --> 00:21:07.900
 Um, but even, even, you know, when begin with prayer, for example, I mean, if you want to

00:21:07.900 --> 00:21:12.960
 start there, I mean, you know, the pandemic didn't stop us from praying.

00:21:12.960 --> 00:21:13.340
 Right.

00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:19.240
 I mean, and I think, uh, you know, when, when Jesus started his earthly ministry, you know,

00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:22.420
 Luke, the doctor and historian says that he went out in the mountain and he prayed first.

00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:27.760
 And, um, you know, we see that over and over again, you know, Jesus retreating, uh, to praying.

00:21:27.760 --> 00:21:35.100
 And I think, you know, we, we tend to minimize maybe the value of prayer in, in evangelism

00:21:35.100 --> 00:21:36.480
 or in, in reaching people.

00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:41.160
 Um, man, we tell people all the time, if you're not sure, um, who God is calling you

00:21:41.160 --> 00:21:44.020
 to reach or to bless like Jesus, just begin with prayer.

00:21:44.420 --> 00:21:48.220
 Um, you know, prayer is how you can ask God to help, you know, who to bless, but it's also

00:21:48.220 --> 00:21:49.840
 a way to begin blessing people.

00:21:50.500 --> 00:21:56.020
 Um, you know, I, a while back, somebody, somebody said something to me that that's really stuck

00:21:56.020 --> 00:22:01.580
 with, they said, they said, you know, John, uh, there are people around you every day who

00:22:01.580 --> 00:22:04.100
 have never once had someone pray for them.

00:22:05.280 --> 00:22:10.660
 Now, I don't know, Jeff, what it's like for you, but my, I mean, like my mom and dad, super

00:22:10.660 --> 00:22:13.380
 committed followers of Jesus, just wonderful people.

00:22:13.740 --> 00:22:20.960
 They both have been praying for me, uh, before I even, you know, was alive and continue to,

00:22:21.120 --> 00:22:24.640
 you know, to this very day, but there's people around us that have likely never had one person

00:22:24.640 --> 00:22:25.060
 pray for them.

00:22:25.060 --> 00:22:28.740
 And I don't mean, you know, stop them in the middle of the street and pray out loud and

00:22:28.740 --> 00:22:30.040
 raise one hand to the sky.

00:22:30.140 --> 00:22:37.040
 I just mean simply asking God to bless someone that you maybe are sitting across, um, uh,

00:22:37.040 --> 00:22:41.980
 the bus seats from, or someone that passes you by on your street, or maybe it's a neighbor

00:22:41.980 --> 00:22:45.680
 that you happen to catch when they're going through something, you know, we, we don't have

00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:48.520
 to stop them and, and lay hands on them in order to pray for them.

00:22:48.580 --> 00:22:49.420
 You can bless anyone.

00:22:49.480 --> 00:22:54.260
 You can bless anyone by praying for them, a neighbor, a coworker, or a friend and, and

00:22:54.260 --> 00:22:56.080
 prayer counts, you know?

00:22:56.540 --> 00:23:00.060
 And, um, I always tell people, if you're not sure how to pray for someone, just think

00:23:00.060 --> 00:23:04.400
 of it like the golden, uh, golden rule of prayer, prayer for them, pray for them as you would

00:23:04.400 --> 00:23:06.800
 have them, um, you know, pray for you.

00:23:06.880 --> 00:23:07.080
 Right.

00:23:07.540 --> 00:23:11.860
 Um, but again, you don't, in the, in the pandemic that didn't stop us from praying.

00:23:12.180 --> 00:23:16.260
 And there are certainly plenty of opportunities to pray for folks and bless them in that way.

00:23:16.440 --> 00:23:18.260
 Even if we didn't have physical contact.

00:23:18.760 --> 00:23:23.460
 Well, and in prayer, even to start it off, like there's, there's a little bit of a, uh,

00:23:23.460 --> 00:23:28.900
 humility in that, let me go before God, uh, and, and pray for others in that.

00:23:28.980 --> 00:23:32.540
 And that, that puts you in a, uh, in, in the humble state.

00:23:32.540 --> 00:23:35.920
 So you can listen, so you can serve.

00:23:35.920 --> 00:23:41.480
 And so it kind of gets you in that place, by the way, even talking, you know, as a digital

00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:44.780
 missionary, like there were, there were stats that came out.

00:23:44.780 --> 00:23:45.880
 I forget what it was.

00:23:45.960 --> 00:23:49.940
 We'll try to find the link and put it in, but, but Barna in the, in the COVID season

00:23:49.940 --> 00:23:55.440
 was finding stats that so many people who were called to Christ, there was this huge percentage

00:23:55.440 --> 00:24:02.520
 of people that were open to being prayed for digitally or open to the idea of prayer happening

00:24:02.520 --> 00:24:03.560
 digitally.

00:24:03.620 --> 00:24:06.080
 And, and to me, I remember talking about it.

00:24:06.080 --> 00:24:10.800
 It was like one of the biggest misses I think of the church in the COVID season that we really

00:24:10.800 --> 00:24:16.860
 didn't embrace the idea of praying as much because people were far more receptive to that than

00:24:16.860 --> 00:24:21.200
 consuming product for, you know, a church service online or, you know, other things that the

00:24:21.200 --> 00:24:22.620
 church was trying for that season.

00:24:22.980 --> 00:24:23.020
 Yeah.

00:24:23.060 --> 00:24:26.900
 I mean, I've always been amazed when, when even a simple, a simple, like a Facebook post

00:24:26.900 --> 00:24:32.200
 or, um, you know, whatever it might be, Instagram, Twitter, anything where you say, Hey, I'm,

00:24:32.200 --> 00:24:34.680
 I'm, I'm, uh, going to be praying today.

00:24:34.680 --> 00:24:37.380
 If there's something I could be praying for you about, please let me know.

00:24:37.840 --> 00:24:38.620
 I mean, that's not hard.

00:24:38.660 --> 00:24:38.900
 Right.

00:24:39.380 --> 00:24:40.820
 And yet people respond.

00:24:40.920 --> 00:24:43.960
 I mean, they, they, they, uh, want to be prayed for.

00:24:44.040 --> 00:24:49.880
 Not, I, you know, I honestly can't remember a time when I offered to pray for somebody and

00:24:49.880 --> 00:24:50.780
 they said, no, no, no, no, no, no.

00:24:50.780 --> 00:24:51.320
 I'm good.

00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:55.440
 You know, usually it's like, you know, they might not, they, maybe they won't have something

00:24:55.440 --> 00:25:03.100
 specific, but I don't think anybody's offended or hurt or put off by me offering to just,

00:25:03.320 --> 00:25:05.320
 Hey, I just, you know, I'd love to be praying for you today.

00:25:05.400 --> 00:25:08.180
 Something, something I could mention to God and pray on your behalf.

00:25:08.540 --> 00:25:12.260
 And even put in doing that social media post, how can I pray for you?

00:25:12.380 --> 00:25:18.200
 To be honest, some of the most engaging posts, conversational posts I have on social media

00:25:18.200 --> 00:25:20.660
 is when I post that, how, how can I pray for you?

00:25:20.900 --> 00:25:26.580
 And the thing that I love, even going back to a digital missionary, it's this idea of by

00:25:26.580 --> 00:25:31.880
 doing that when, when people, we know this 80, 80% of people, according to Barna, December

00:25:31.880 --> 00:25:37.320
 2020, uh, digital evangelism report, 80% of people that are called to Christ, when they

00:25:37.320 --> 00:25:42.860
 have spiritual questions, uh, they're going to either Google to find the answers to their

00:25:42.860 --> 00:25:47.980
 spiritual questions or they're going to their friends who they think will have the spiritual

00:25:47.980 --> 00:25:49.320
 answers to their questions.

00:25:49.320 --> 00:25:52.540
 And even something simple, like, how can I pray for you?

00:25:52.860 --> 00:25:57.780
 Even if no one's responding, the people that are seeing that are recognizing, Hey, here is

00:25:57.780 --> 00:26:00.580
 a person that is spiritually in tune.

00:26:00.740 --> 00:26:03.480
 And when they have questions, they'll go to that person.

00:26:03.960 --> 00:26:09.700
 And so being able to even put some of these posts out there, engage with people and just

00:26:09.700 --> 00:26:13.360
 humbling yourself in this situation and allowing God to control.

00:26:13.660 --> 00:26:15.000
 Oh my gosh, it's so beautiful.

00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:16.080
 Even in digital space.

00:26:16.320 --> 00:26:17.600
 I love this.

00:26:17.600 --> 00:26:22.960
 Well, one of the studies that Barna had, maybe this is the same one, I don't know, where he

00:26:22.960 --> 00:26:28.480
 asked our friends and neighbors what they would value in a person with whom they would talk

00:26:28.480 --> 00:26:29.240
 to about spiritual matters.

00:26:29.300 --> 00:26:30.040
 You heard this before?

00:26:30.600 --> 00:26:31.120
 No, go for it.

00:26:31.260 --> 00:26:33.220
 What he found was there were three qualities.

00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:35.900
 And this is not like our Christian neighbors and friends.

00:26:35.940 --> 00:26:37.700
 This is like all of our neighbors and friends.

00:26:38.480 --> 00:26:40.100
 Three qualities came to the service.

00:26:40.320 --> 00:26:43.120
 They, number one, want someone who will listen without judgment.

00:26:43.840 --> 00:26:44.500
 Shocking, right?

00:26:45.700 --> 00:26:48.640
 They want someone who will allow them to draw their own conclusions.

00:26:49.380 --> 00:26:52.300
 And then they want someone who can speak confidently about their own story.

00:26:53.080 --> 00:26:57.140
 Listen without judgment, draw my own conclusions, speak confidently about their own story.

00:26:57.540 --> 00:27:01.220
 I mean, people are looking for somebody to be a friend, right?

00:27:01.280 --> 00:27:02.820
 I mean, isn't that what we all want?

00:27:03.380 --> 00:27:08.740
 And so, again, I think this whole idea of praying for people that comes out of relationship.

00:27:08.980 --> 00:27:10.480
 I mean, Jesus was known as a friend of sinners.

00:27:10.560 --> 00:27:12.860
 He got in trouble for hanging out with the wrong people, right?

00:27:13.400 --> 00:27:17.640
 And, you know, I think, again, we just have to understand it's not our job to convince,

00:27:17.820 --> 00:27:18.860
 coerce, or cajole.

00:27:19.240 --> 00:27:23.400
 It's our job to love people the way Jesus loved people and then let God do the work of

00:27:23.400 --> 00:27:26.400
 convicting and converting, you know?

00:27:26.680 --> 00:27:31.340
 And I think the blessed practices just give us a little bit of a platform or a path to do that.

00:27:32.300 --> 00:27:32.820
 So true.

00:27:32.940 --> 00:27:38.260
 Let's pivot and let's swing over to the L, which is going to be a listen.

00:27:38.580 --> 00:27:40.120
 Let's describe for me, John, here.

00:27:40.180 --> 00:27:40.900
 Let's set it up.

00:27:41.400 --> 00:27:46.060
 What role does listen play in the idea of bless?

00:27:46.440 --> 00:27:48.020
 Well, and you've already touched on it, Jeff.

00:27:48.100 --> 00:27:54.120
 I think so many times the importance and significance and opportunity we have digitally to be good

00:27:54.120 --> 00:27:54.560
 listeners.

00:27:54.720 --> 00:28:00.580
 Because if, I mean, if people are known for anything online, whether it's, you know, Twitter,

00:28:00.720 --> 00:28:03.600
 Facebook, it's not about listening.

00:28:03.600 --> 00:28:05.960
 It's about telling and talking and saying, right?

00:28:06.040 --> 00:28:12.320
 And so what a witness we can be if we figured out ways to actually, you know, listen in the digital

00:28:12.320 --> 00:28:12.760
 world.

00:28:13.500 --> 00:28:19.880
 And, you know, Christians especially, right?

00:28:19.880 --> 00:28:24.060
 For talking and listening.

00:28:24.060 --> 00:28:27.840
 That, you know, asking questions and listening to people.

00:28:27.880 --> 00:28:30.560
 I mean, that was central to Jesus' life and teachings.

00:28:32.340 --> 00:28:34.920
 Martin Copenhaver wrote a book, Jesus is the question.

00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:40.500
 And he says that Jesus asked 307 questions and answered only three of them.

00:28:40.580 --> 00:28:44.020
 Now, I haven't gone through all the questions and the gospels to make sure that's accurate.

00:28:44.080 --> 00:28:44.840
 I assume it is.

00:28:45.180 --> 00:28:48.540
 But he asked 307 questions, answered only three.

00:28:49.500 --> 00:28:54.680
 Like, so ask 100 questions for every one you answer online and see if you don't make some

00:28:54.680 --> 00:28:55.120
 friends.

00:28:55.940 --> 00:28:56.520
 Am I right?

00:28:58.020 --> 00:29:01.960
 Wow, I had, where was that, where was the quote from, Martin?

00:29:02.100 --> 00:29:03.040
 You said it was Martin Coleman.

00:29:03.160 --> 00:29:04.020
 What was the book?

00:29:04.100 --> 00:29:04.420
 Do you know?

00:29:05.060 --> 00:29:08.340
 Martin Copenhaver, C-O-P-E-N-H-A-V-E-R.

00:29:08.800 --> 00:29:10.520
 The book is Jesus is the question.

00:29:11.460 --> 00:29:13.780
 And he says that Jesus asked 307 questions.

00:29:13.820 --> 00:29:15.120
 Jesus is the question.

00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:15.500
 Yeah.

00:29:16.000 --> 00:29:16.180
 Yeah.

00:29:16.440 --> 00:29:17.000
 Jesus is the question.

00:29:17.200 --> 00:29:18.520
 Ask 307 answers.

00:29:18.740 --> 00:29:19.340
 Oh my gosh.

00:29:19.580 --> 00:29:20.300
 I'm shocked.

00:29:20.360 --> 00:29:21.300
 We'll put a link in the show notes.

00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:22.660
 Like that, that's incredible.

00:29:23.460 --> 00:29:24.580
 What a ratio.

00:29:24.900 --> 00:29:26.360
 I'd never, I'd never heard that one before.

00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:27.480
 That, that one's new to me.

00:29:28.220 --> 00:29:33.580
 But no, that, that, that, that, that's beautiful to put you almost in the point of, of being,

00:29:33.660 --> 00:29:34.600
 once again, being a learner.

00:29:34.900 --> 00:29:36.680
 I want, I want to learn through the situation.

00:29:36.860 --> 00:29:42.660
 Tell me about you and positioning yourself in such a way builds that trust that, that,

00:29:42.740 --> 00:29:43.520
 that allows that.

00:29:43.520 --> 00:29:48.980
 I mean, just even thinking about in digital context of, of the, of the hellfire that's

00:29:48.980 --> 00:29:53.640
 become Facebook and Twitter, if we positioned ourselves with humility, if we positioned

00:29:53.640 --> 00:30:00.000
 ourselves as, as a learner within those, these communities and, and meeting people, uh, and

00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:03.540
 through that, through the relationship, through listening point to Jesus.

00:30:03.540 --> 00:30:04.380
 Oh my gosh.

00:30:04.940 --> 00:30:05.520
 So good.

00:30:05.820 --> 00:30:05.920
 Yeah.

00:30:05.940 --> 00:30:09.820
 Well, you know, you've, you've heard it said like, if you want to be interesting, be interested.

00:30:10.080 --> 00:30:10.340
 Right.

00:30:10.340 --> 00:30:14.080
 I mean, it's just, it's just true, you know, ask questions.

00:30:14.080 --> 00:30:17.220
 And I mean, we've all been in those situations.

00:30:17.220 --> 00:30:21.560
 I'm sure you have Jeff, as have I, where, you know, you're talking to somebody and you

00:30:21.560 --> 00:30:24.260
 can just tell they're not really listening to you.

00:30:24.340 --> 00:30:28.520
 They're like looking almost past you in the conversation.

00:30:28.720 --> 00:30:32.660
 But on the other hand, you've also been in those situations where, man, somebody was just

00:30:32.660 --> 00:30:37.560
 like, they, they were dialed in and you felt genuinely listened to.

00:30:37.980 --> 00:30:44.300
 And I think that truly listening may be, uh, the kindest and most loving gift you can give

00:30:44.300 --> 00:30:49.520
 someone and, uh, you know, even during the pandemic, you know, I mean, as long as you were

00:30:49.520 --> 00:30:53.760
 socially distanced, you know, you could still talk to people when you were out and about.

00:30:54.000 --> 00:30:57.600
 And, and if you weren't comfortable leaving your home, then you could use FaceTime or zoom

00:30:57.600 --> 00:30:59.520
 or, you know, try and make it a phone call.

00:31:00.060 --> 00:31:01.840
 Remember those voice to voice phone calls.

00:31:03.500 --> 00:31:03.840
 Yeah.

00:31:04.380 --> 00:31:10.160
 Um, so yeah, listening, man, I, I, I just think you got to land there for a little bit and

00:31:10.160 --> 00:31:14.380
 there's lots of opportunity to listen and the power of being a good listener.

00:31:14.460 --> 00:31:18.880
 I, I have so much, I have so much work to do in that area, man, because I'm always thinking

00:31:18.880 --> 00:31:21.440
 about what I'm going to say next while you're saying what you're saying.

00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:27.480
 And, uh, what a powerful witness, uh, if we can become more like Christ and, and how we

00:31:27.480 --> 00:31:31.060
 listen and what a tremendous way to truly bless people.

00:31:31.140 --> 00:31:37.880
 We just underestimate the power of listening to people and how desperate they are for someone

00:31:37.880 --> 00:31:39.100
 to love them in that way.

00:31:39.540 --> 00:31:42.380
 And I don't even know if I should like have a follow-up comment after that.

00:31:42.440 --> 00:31:44.880
 She's just even talking about, uh, listening.

00:31:45.040 --> 00:31:46.100
 Probably a question, right?

00:31:47.180 --> 00:31:47.580
 Probably.

00:31:47.700 --> 00:31:47.840
 Yeah.

00:31:47.840 --> 00:31:54.340
 Um, but I mean, here is the, the danger is digitally is if you surround yourself in

00:31:54.340 --> 00:32:01.340
 an echo chamber, you're not really listening at least to anybody that's saying anything different

00:32:01.340 --> 00:32:02.480
 than, than you.

00:32:02.680 --> 00:32:08.720
 And so the danger of these algorithms and Facebook and Twitter is that they give you people that

00:32:08.720 --> 00:32:14.320
 sound like you and, and, and talking to someone who sounds like you doesn't give you the

00:32:14.320 --> 00:32:18.480
 opportunity to listen to people who are different than you.

00:32:18.480 --> 00:32:22.020
 Uh, and so there's, there, there's ways to overcome that.

00:32:22.120 --> 00:32:27.240
 And, and, and if we are going to be digital missionaries, I think that we need to be intentional

00:32:27.240 --> 00:32:35.060
 about overcoming the algorithm and intentionally going into Facebook groups, intentionally connecting

00:32:35.060 --> 00:32:40.200
 on hashtags on Twitters or in, in, uh, Twitter spaces and whatever their communities are called

00:32:40.200 --> 00:32:46.300
 and, and start to engage in areas in with people that are outside of the echo chambers that

00:32:46.300 --> 00:32:46.800
 we are.

00:32:46.920 --> 00:32:52.280
 And once again, if that's infused with prayer, which is where we're supposed to start, the

00:32:52.280 --> 00:32:56.040
 humility that comes with listening to people outside of our echo chamber suddenly becomes

00:32:56.040 --> 00:32:57.620
 a lot more effective.

00:32:57.980 --> 00:32:59.580
 And so thank you.

00:32:59.780 --> 00:33:02.500
 So far we're two for two here on digital missionary.

00:33:02.640 --> 00:33:03.340
 What were you going to say, John?

00:33:03.500 --> 00:33:06.160
 Let's just begin with prayer and let's, let's just do that.

00:33:06.320 --> 00:33:06.760
 Right.

00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:09.200
 I mean, think how much progress we can make.

00:33:09.700 --> 00:33:14.340
 Um, man, one of the most, um, fascinating things we saw, which I think a lot of churches

00:33:14.340 --> 00:33:22.480
 did was, um, the power of, uh, alpha, the alpha course online, particularly during the

00:33:22.480 --> 00:33:22.780
 pandemic.

00:33:22.780 --> 00:33:28.420
 And you've probably heard, uh, Nikki Gumbel talk about how prior to COVID, no way you can't

00:33:28.420 --> 00:33:29.080
 do alpha online.

00:33:29.080 --> 00:33:29.680
 It's not going to work.

00:33:29.740 --> 00:33:33.300
 You got to have the face to face, got to have the meal, all that, blah, blah, blah.

00:33:33.680 --> 00:33:36.520
 And suddenly the pandemic, they got to change like everybody else.

00:33:36.520 --> 00:33:37.880
 They're doing these alpha courses online.

00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:43.240
 And what do you know, uh, people are like coming to Christ, supernatural stuff's happening.

00:33:43.420 --> 00:33:44.900
 People are praying bold prayers.

00:33:44.900 --> 00:33:47.480
 I mean, just remarkable, remarkable stuff.

00:33:48.380 --> 00:33:54.640
 And whether in person or online to me, like the secret to alpha is, is listen.

00:33:55.300 --> 00:34:00.940
 It's like just getting Christ followers like me and you to just for one time, not feel like

00:34:00.940 --> 00:34:02.160
 we have to be the shell answer person.

00:34:02.160 --> 00:34:02.440
 Right.

00:34:02.740 --> 00:34:08.760
 And just let people talk, let them work through their faith to the point where they kind of

00:34:08.760 --> 00:34:11.040
 convict them, but the Holy spirit convicts them.

00:34:11.120 --> 00:34:11.260
 Right.

00:34:12.020 --> 00:34:14.900
 And, uh, yeah, so listening is so important.

00:34:14.940 --> 00:34:16.340
 We could just talk about that all day.

00:34:16.560 --> 00:34:16.860
 Totally.

00:34:17.000 --> 00:34:18.940
 Let's shift gears to number three.

00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:19.820
 All right.

00:34:19.820 --> 00:34:20.960
 So we've got begin with prayer.

00:34:21.000 --> 00:34:26.060
 We've got, listen, the E in the conversation is eat together.

00:34:26.440 --> 00:34:27.460
 This will be interesting.

00:34:27.760 --> 00:34:28.720
 Eat together.

00:34:29.040 --> 00:34:30.460
 Why do I feel like it's a snack?

00:34:31.420 --> 00:34:31.660
 Yeah.

00:34:31.800 --> 00:34:37.200
 Like, so it was, and I've often wondered this, like, is, is, does it, is actual chomping?

00:34:37.680 --> 00:34:39.720
 I would normally make fun of something like this.

00:34:39.720 --> 00:34:43.560
 It's like, do we have to actually breathe the same air molecules to be in community?

00:34:43.560 --> 00:34:46.640
 But so, but you've got intentionality around eat.

00:34:46.840 --> 00:34:50.900
 Why the intentionality with the eat word other than it fits well within bless?

00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:53.680
 I think you and I should like go grab a snack from the refrigerator right now and bring

00:34:53.680 --> 00:34:54.080
 it back.

00:34:54.300 --> 00:34:55.300
 You can like live this way.

00:34:56.480 --> 00:34:57.360
 Or does this count?

00:34:57.440 --> 00:34:58.360
 Maybe the LaCroix counts.

00:34:58.460 --> 00:34:58.760
 I don't know.

00:34:59.820 --> 00:35:05.820
 Um, yeah, you know, again, going back to the life of Christ, I mean, he ate all the time

00:35:05.820 --> 00:35:06.200
 with people.

00:35:06.600 --> 00:35:09.880
 It's a, it's remarkable when you think about the, the number of meals that he shared,

00:35:09.880 --> 00:35:13.040
 um, you know, with folks, tax collectors and centers, right.

00:35:13.040 --> 00:35:13.920
 Known for that.

00:35:14.720 --> 00:35:19.840
 But I think just, uh, experientially, we all know, man, there's something really special

00:35:19.840 --> 00:35:26.140
 about sharing a meal with people that moves almost any relationship past acquaintance towards

00:35:26.140 --> 00:35:29.160
 friendship faster than just about anything else you can do.

00:35:29.700 --> 00:35:32.880
 We've, I've had that experience where, yeah, I didn't really know somebody.

00:35:33.240 --> 00:35:35.900
 And my wife's like, Hey, we're going to go out with the Smiths Friday night.

00:35:35.900 --> 00:35:36.800
 And you're like, Oh, okay.

00:35:37.140 --> 00:35:38.360
 You know, you're maybe excited.

00:35:38.440 --> 00:35:38.940
 Maybe not.

00:35:39.340 --> 00:35:40.520
 You go, you have a great time.

00:35:40.520 --> 00:35:43.960
 And they're like your best friends, you know, there's just something about that shared meal

00:35:43.960 --> 00:35:46.980
 that I think really fast tracks relationships.

00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:51.420
 And, um, well, I mean, Jeff, I would ask you, you know, I mean, think about the last time

00:35:51.420 --> 00:35:54.680
 you were asked by someone to join them for a meal.

00:35:54.780 --> 00:35:55.720
 Can you, can you think of it?

00:35:55.760 --> 00:35:59.700
 It was, whether it was at their house or at a restaurant, you remember that?

00:36:00.160 --> 00:36:00.280
 Yeah.

00:36:00.380 --> 00:36:04.560
 Well, I mean, I would even do a, a, a, a one up, like there, there's a, when the guy

00:36:04.560 --> 00:36:08.520
 who does my world building for virtual reality, his name's Michael used to Venice.

00:36:08.520 --> 00:36:11.660
 He lives, uh, maybe 90 minutes away from me.

00:36:11.840 --> 00:36:13.480
 And so he's up in Fort Lauderdale.

00:36:13.600 --> 00:36:14.240
 I'm in Miami.

00:36:14.400 --> 00:36:15.800
 He's, he's like the metaverse.

00:36:16.360 --> 00:36:19.520
 Uh, he's the metaverse pastor for a church in California.

00:36:20.780 --> 00:36:24.740
 And so, uh, was, I was on discord with him the other day.

00:36:25.420 --> 00:36:29.500
 And, um, and I honestly, we, I mean, like I said, we live like an hour away from each

00:36:29.500 --> 00:36:30.140
 other, hour and a half.

00:36:30.280 --> 00:36:32.200
 I haven't seen him in like four months.

00:36:32.920 --> 00:36:36.540
 And, uh, and, and, and he said, when we're on discord, he's like, Hey, when are the next

00:36:36.540 --> 00:36:38.620
 time you're up here, I want to spend some time with you?

00:36:39.340 --> 00:36:43.960
 And it's just the, the nature of reaction was, dude, I talk to you all the time, but

00:36:43.960 --> 00:36:51.080
 there is something unique in that physical experience in, in that, that sitting down and the sharing.

00:36:51.080 --> 00:36:54.200
 And so I was like, Hey, you know, there, there is something to that.

00:36:54.260 --> 00:36:55.920
 I can see some validity behind that.

00:36:56.260 --> 00:36:56.340
 Yeah.

00:36:56.560 --> 00:36:58.120
 And, and, and it was blessed.

00:36:58.220 --> 00:37:02.960
 I mean, it was a blessing to you just to even asked you haven't even had your meal yet, probably, but the fact that he wanted to.

00:37:03.140 --> 00:37:10.200
 So, and again, I think, you know, let's not forget some of the digital or online skills we learned during the pandemic are still useful.

00:37:10.660 --> 00:37:18.780
 And I think, again, that sharing a meal with somebody over zoom or whatever platform you might be using, we can still do that right miles apart.

00:37:18.880 --> 00:37:21.720
 And again, it's, it's, it's, it's also a way to bless people.

00:37:22.380 --> 00:37:25.000
 Um, I've also heard, I forgot who it was.

00:37:25.000 --> 00:37:29.020
 Was it Alan Hirsch or, uh, I can't remember.

00:37:29.160 --> 00:37:37.360
 Talk about the fact that, you know, the beautiful thing about this practice is that, you know, we all eat about 21 meals every week, right?

00:37:38.000 --> 00:37:39.900
 Three a day, seven days of the week.

00:37:40.400 --> 00:37:43.380
 You know, this is something that you're already doing.

00:37:43.700 --> 00:37:47.560
 You don't have to add anything to your busy schedule in order to bless somebody.

00:37:47.560 --> 00:37:50.680
 Just instead of eating by yourself, ask somebody to join you.

00:37:50.780 --> 00:37:55.700
 And again, I think online, like if you're, I mean, we're all working out of the house, right?

00:37:55.720 --> 00:37:56.920
 But you're still going to stop and eat.

00:37:57.200 --> 00:37:59.300
 So call somebody up and say, Hey, how about noon?

00:37:59.360 --> 00:38:02.180
 Let's just take a break at the same time and, and share a meal.

00:38:02.340 --> 00:38:09.860
 So, um, yeah, I, I, I think sharing a meal, whatever that looks like is a powerful way to bless the people around you.

00:38:10.220 --> 00:38:14.800
 And, uh, again, definitely listen, share a meal, eat together.

00:38:14.920 --> 00:38:20.520
 You know, one of the things that I love about the idea of the eating, um, is, is it brings out.

00:38:20.780 --> 00:38:24.140
 Uh, intentionality to not work.

00:38:24.140 --> 00:38:29.540
 Like, it's very hard to, to work while you're eating.

00:38:29.900 --> 00:38:42.220
 Like, you know, I mean, I guess if you're by yourself and you're, you're chomping on something, but if you've got somebody in front of you, um, like it, there is an intentionality while, while you're eating to how are the kids?

00:38:42.220 --> 00:38:42.920
 What's going on?

00:38:42.980 --> 00:38:45.420
 Tell me about your life in backstories.

00:38:45.420 --> 00:38:49.920
 And, and, and, and there's more, there's more relationships centered around that.

00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:55.120
 For me, it's, it's one of the reasons why, like, you know, I, I love Starbucks.

00:38:55.280 --> 00:38:57.940
 I actually having good coffee recently.

00:38:57.940 --> 00:39:01.980
 I don't know that I love Starbucks, but Miami only has Starbucks or Cuban bakeries.

00:39:01.980 --> 00:39:07.740
 And so I constantly find myself at Starbucks, um, having a conversation with someone digging in.

00:39:07.880 --> 00:39:13.660
 And so for me, the idea of, of that, that relationship in, in the physical realm is, is Starbucks.

00:39:14.060 --> 00:39:17.020
 I think there's a challenge for us digitally.

00:39:17.900 --> 00:39:25.780
 Can we carve out time to actually have a relationship level conversation digitally?

00:39:26.360 --> 00:39:30.460
 I mean, yeah, we can jump on VR, put on a goggle headset and have a conversation with someone.

00:39:30.700 --> 00:39:33.840
 We can play around video games and connect with people.

00:39:34.040 --> 00:39:38.700
 Like there's plenty of, of those level conversations.

00:39:38.700 --> 00:39:41.520
 There's plenty of that relationship stuff that's happening.

00:39:41.860 --> 00:39:50.780
 But can we intentionally carve out time, not, you know, setting aside what we're playing with whatever video game it is,

00:39:50.780 --> 00:39:53.740
 but instead now actually having a conversation.

00:39:54.400 --> 00:39:55.320
 How, how's your wife?

00:39:55.520 --> 00:39:56.320
 How are the kids?

00:39:56.600 --> 00:39:57.340
 How's life?

00:39:57.780 --> 00:39:58.900
 Um, what's going on?

00:39:59.140 --> 00:40:00.360
 How's God teaching you?

00:40:00.460 --> 00:40:01.700
 What, what's God showing you?

00:40:01.840 --> 00:40:07.740
 Like, I think there has to be an intentionality around this that I think really the idea of, of eating and blessing is.

00:40:07.740 --> 00:40:13.960
 It's not, it's not something that's haphazard, but I think there's intentionality centered around that, especially with digital.

00:40:14.280 --> 00:40:15.900
 No, I, I love how you're saying that, Jeff.

00:40:15.940 --> 00:40:28.640
 And I think, you know, most of us know too, and, and there's something that makes conversation easier or, um, more likely to happen when you're, when you're drinking or, or eating.

00:40:28.780 --> 00:40:32.760
 I don't know what it is, you know, but you, you know, you go to a party, yeah, give me a drink and you're standing around.

00:40:32.900 --> 00:40:37.260
 If you don't have, there's just, yeah, there's something about that.

00:40:37.260 --> 00:40:40.980
 I think that stimulates conversation in a, in a really unique and powerful way.

00:40:40.980 --> 00:40:56.360
 And you also brought to mind too, you know, if you're thinking about like, um, doing this digitally, one of the things I think we also learned, you've probably talked about is that when you're, when you're doing this, like right now, you're, you're talking to me in my, talking to me in my context.

00:40:56.360 --> 00:40:56.660
 Right.

00:40:57.300 --> 00:41:04.600
 And so you're, you're seeing what's going on behind you or what's not going on, but you, you have a different feel for like, oh, I could kind of see where Ferguson lives.

00:41:04.680 --> 00:41:05.340
 You know what I mean?

00:41:05.340 --> 00:41:06.940
 Like, interesting.

00:41:07.140 --> 00:41:09.880
 What, what about that helps you get to know me better?

00:41:09.880 --> 00:41:11.580
 I mean, you've got all these books behind you, right?

00:41:11.600 --> 00:41:13.980
 I'm going, man, Jeff must be a scholar.

00:41:14.500 --> 00:41:15.840
 Look at those books back there.

00:41:16.720 --> 00:41:23.920
 I used to run a Christian bookstore in fairness, probably not a scholar, more of a salesman, but that's, that's another conversation for another day.

00:41:23.920 --> 00:41:32.100
 It's just the, the notion that the, the, this digital way of, of connecting also allows us to see people in their context.

00:41:32.100 --> 00:41:39.260
 I mean, you know, you've, we've all seen all the funny videos of the little kids running in when the guy's doing an interview on national TV, you know, that kind of stuff.

00:41:39.260 --> 00:41:45.180
 And it's just, there's something endearing about that and also helps us, I think, learn about people in a way we might not otherwise.

00:41:45.600 --> 00:41:45.960
 Beautiful.

00:41:46.140 --> 00:41:46.400
 All right.

00:41:46.440 --> 00:41:47.020
 So here we are.

00:41:47.060 --> 00:41:48.760
 We've got begin with prayer.

00:41:48.960 --> 00:41:51.040
 We've got, listen, we've got eat together.

00:41:51.320 --> 00:41:54.920
 The first S, number four here is serve.

00:41:55.240 --> 00:41:56.480
 I'm looking forward to this one.

00:41:56.980 --> 00:41:57.340
 Serve.

00:41:57.480 --> 00:41:59.040
 So start to unpack serve for us.

00:41:59.420 --> 00:41:59.800
 Yeah, sure.

00:42:00.860 --> 00:42:01.080
 Yeah.

00:42:01.200 --> 00:42:05.840
 So, I mean, again, going, going back to the, look, what we did is looking at the life of Christ.

00:42:05.960 --> 00:42:06.760
 What, what did he do?

00:42:06.820 --> 00:42:08.540
 How did he bless people?

00:42:09.140 --> 00:42:14.760
 And, you know, Matthew 10, Matthew 20, 28, Jesus said, the son of man did not come to be served, but to what?

00:42:15.740 --> 00:42:16.020
 Right.

00:42:16.080 --> 00:42:16.540
 To serve.

00:42:16.620 --> 00:42:27.300
 And so, you know, I think Jesus modeled this idea that if you'll begin with prayer, eat with people, you'll then discover how you can best serve them.

00:42:28.680 --> 00:42:35.540
 You know, praying and listening and eating together is like the laying the groundwork for the serving.

00:42:36.540 --> 00:42:42.440
 And it ensures, I think, that the serving is about the person being served and not the person doing the serving.

00:42:42.600 --> 00:42:46.000
 You know, I think a lot of times we'll, we'll serve and because we feel better.

00:42:46.420 --> 00:42:51.800
 Well, that's, that's not bad, but is the serving actually benefiting the person that you're serving?

00:42:54.800 --> 00:43:06.240
 A simple example, in a while back, our neighbor had surgery on her leg and we're not super close to our neighbors, but we're trying to get to know them, trying to bless them, you know, begin with prayer, listen, sharing some food from time to time.

00:43:06.680 --> 00:43:08.380
 But she had surgery on her leg.

00:43:08.440 --> 00:43:15.440
 And so my wife, you know, Lisa and I went to the store, put together a simple care package for her and gave it to her, you know, not a big deal.

00:43:15.580 --> 00:43:19.420
 But again, it was a way that we could, we could serve her.

00:43:21.140 --> 00:43:23.120
 And, you know, that's a person I have a relationship with.

00:43:24.040 --> 00:43:28.340
 Some of us, because they're our neighbors, you know, we live in an apartment building, so we're proximities close.

00:43:29.720 --> 00:43:32.340
 You know, a different example, like we've got these neighbors across the street.

00:43:32.400 --> 00:43:33.460
 I hardly know them at all.

00:43:34.060 --> 00:43:39.620
 But the other day, my wife said, hey, you know, that I just found out that he works for the Red Cross.

00:43:39.620 --> 00:43:43.440
 And this was, and I thought, that's kind of cool that he works for the Red Cross.

00:43:43.580 --> 00:43:51.340
 And I was at a bakery down the street, and there's this incredible bread that we buy.

00:43:51.420 --> 00:43:52.940
 It just tastes so stinking good.

00:43:53.520 --> 00:43:56.300
 And I go into the bakery, and I notice there's two loaves left.

00:43:56.360 --> 00:43:59.400
 And there's just something, because I try to keep bless in my mind.

00:43:59.520 --> 00:44:02.620
 But I felt like the Holy Spirit was prompting me, don't buy one loaf, buy two.

00:44:03.620 --> 00:44:11.520
 And drop one off to your, you know, new acquaintance across the street that work for the Red Cross and just thank him for his work.

00:44:11.640 --> 00:44:13.940
 And I'm like, no, I'm not going to do that, you know, initially.

00:44:14.400 --> 00:44:15.620
 But then I'm like, well, why not?

00:44:15.680 --> 00:44:18.560
 That's like a $4 way to bless somebody.

00:44:19.120 --> 00:44:23.680
 And if somebody did that for me, I'd think like that was like the coolest thing ever, you know?

00:44:24.240 --> 00:44:29.140
 And so I just grabbed that extra loaf, stopped by and said, you know, my wife just told me the other day you work for the Red Cross.

00:44:29.220 --> 00:44:29.940
 I think that's really cool.

00:44:30.060 --> 00:44:30.880
 I just want to say thanks.

00:44:30.980 --> 00:44:32.200
 And I love this bread.

00:44:32.580 --> 00:44:35.940
 If you like it, got it from the bakery down the street, you'll probably like it too.

00:44:36.460 --> 00:44:43.880
 I didn't, you know, like try to convert the guy or even mention, you know, anything about church or that I'm a Christian or whatever.

00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:49.380
 It's just, you know, looking for those small little opportunities to serve people in practical ways.

00:44:49.780 --> 00:44:52.020
 And I think it's just a powerful way to love them and bless them.

00:44:52.400 --> 00:44:52.500
 Yeah.

00:44:52.600 --> 00:44:53.660
 You got to listen, right?

00:44:53.740 --> 00:44:57.520
 To be able to know how to serve on the flip side.

00:44:58.440 --> 00:45:02.680
 You know, I mean, in my life, just recently I had COVID.

00:45:02.680 --> 00:45:12.440
 And one of my online friends who I've never met physically actually sent me, I forget what service it was.

00:45:12.620 --> 00:45:14.180
 Maybe it was Uber Eats or whatever.

00:45:14.600 --> 00:45:15.120
 DoorDash.

00:45:15.500 --> 00:45:15.940
 Yeah.

00:45:16.060 --> 00:45:17.080
 I think it was DoorDash.

00:45:17.160 --> 00:45:19.680
 He DoorDashed me my favorite candy.

00:45:20.600 --> 00:45:23.700
 I mean, literally a guy showed up with a grocery bag.

00:45:24.000 --> 00:45:25.180
 And here you go, sir.

00:45:25.200 --> 00:45:26.120
 I didn't order anything.

00:45:26.120 --> 00:45:28.500
 And the guy just walks away and I open it up.

00:45:28.500 --> 00:45:33.800
 And my friend, who I've never met physically, sent me DoorDash.

00:45:34.640 --> 00:45:35.600
 And so I texted him.

00:45:35.600 --> 00:45:39.280
 And he's like, yeah, you talked on social media about what your favorite candy was.

00:45:39.380 --> 00:45:40.040
 And here you go.

00:45:40.100 --> 00:45:42.020
 And I'm like, dude, thank you.

00:45:42.120 --> 00:45:48.420
 Like, I'm just blown away at the opportunity that he had had to do something.

00:45:48.600 --> 00:45:51.640
 Now, I mean, we had a great relationship even in digital space.

00:45:52.000 --> 00:45:57.580
 But it's that type of opportunity where, you know, maybe it's easy to look at John's story

00:45:57.580 --> 00:46:00.420
 and to say, yeah, but I'm in another city.

00:46:00.600 --> 00:46:01.660
 I'm in another state.

00:46:01.800 --> 00:46:04.460
 I don't know anything about these people.

00:46:04.620 --> 00:46:11.200
 I think the challenge is how can you listen well enough to people to know them at that point?

00:46:11.600 --> 00:46:16.260
 And then creatively, how can you serve them in such a way?

00:46:16.360 --> 00:46:16.500
 Yeah.

00:46:16.580 --> 00:46:18.800
 I mean, DoorDash is an option.

00:46:18.900 --> 00:46:20.320
 It maybe is an expensive option.

00:46:20.560 --> 00:46:22.680
 But there are other things you can do.

00:46:22.940 --> 00:46:23.940
 It's a great example.

00:46:24.060 --> 00:46:32.120
 It takes 10 seconds, right, to go to Starbucks.com and send somebody a $5 gift card.

00:46:33.340 --> 00:46:35.660
 And you can bless them that way, serve them that way.

00:46:35.920 --> 00:46:37.160
 I mean, I don't know.

00:46:37.220 --> 00:46:38.560
 I'm just, I'm blown away.

00:46:38.660 --> 00:46:42.140
 My daughter lives in New York and occasionally, and she's finishing college.

00:46:43.100 --> 00:46:48.880
 And, you know, occasionally in the past four years that she's been at school, she'll need a ride or something.

00:46:49.120 --> 00:47:02.600
 I can call up an Uber from Chicago and have her picked up, you know, in Manhattan, wherever she might be, and make sure she gets a ride home without, you know, even getting up off my chair.

00:47:02.600 --> 00:47:11.680
 So, the opportunities to bless now, I mean, serve people in, like, tangible ways.

00:47:11.880 --> 00:47:13.720
 Like, yeah, and I love your story.

00:47:13.880 --> 00:47:15.860
 It's getting the candy like that.

00:47:15.920 --> 00:47:17.260
 That's such a cool little surprise.

00:47:17.860 --> 00:47:18.000
 Yeah.

00:47:18.260 --> 00:47:23.280
 I mean, and the beauty is, as an individual, I wasn't expecting it.

00:47:23.380 --> 00:47:27.980
 You know, and I've told this story before, and I don't know that this is serve, but it's kind of weird.

00:47:28.100 --> 00:47:36.540
 Like, when you're looking at the wall behind me, I mean, there's maybe 100 Funko Pops literally on the backdrop behind me, if you're willing to count them.

00:47:36.800 --> 00:47:38.060
 I think I'm somewhere in the 80s.

00:47:38.420 --> 00:47:39.780
 A lot of those I didn't buy.

00:47:40.420 --> 00:47:46.660
 As a matter of fact, the first Funko Pops I ever bought or that I ever received, I have no idea where they came from.

00:47:46.660 --> 00:47:49.760
 To this day, someone sent me Funko Pops.

00:47:49.880 --> 00:47:53.260
 I don't know who it was, and it just became a thing.

00:47:53.440 --> 00:47:58.620
 And all of a sudden, like, people are giving me Funko Pops, and someone was showing up without names and IDs, and it's like, okay, cool.

00:47:59.080 --> 00:48:01.360
 I'll take the Funko Pops, and I'll make a display out of it.

00:48:01.500 --> 00:48:01.820
 That's awesome.

00:48:02.160 --> 00:48:13.720
 But it's this type of, man, if we really believe that digital is a community, and we're really taking advantage of praying and listening for people, serving is a natural step out of it.

00:48:13.720 --> 00:48:22.420
 And so engaging and serving people, I mean, if we really want them to listen to us, we have to serve them.

00:48:23.040 --> 00:48:26.580
 And that's going to build that trust that we want.

00:48:26.620 --> 00:48:30.800
 And what's interesting, just as an aside, this has nothing to do with serving in the building.

00:48:31.460 --> 00:48:35.480
 You know, this doesn't have anything to do with serving in guest services or worship.

00:48:35.840 --> 00:48:40.460
 Like, those things are important, and being part of something like that, a community like that, is good.

00:48:40.520 --> 00:48:42.300
 And there's ways to even serve in digital churches.

00:48:42.580 --> 00:48:50.820
 But when we're talking about serving here, it's serving individuals, which I think is so crucial as we're looking at digital missionaries.

00:48:51.180 --> 00:48:51.480
 Oh, yeah.

00:48:51.640 --> 00:48:51.760
 Yeah.

00:48:51.820 --> 00:48:58.360
 And, you know, if it involves food, like you said there, you've pretty much nailed three of the five practices.

00:48:58.520 --> 00:49:00.860
 You listen because you knew what food that person wanted.

00:49:01.320 --> 00:49:02.600
 You're delivering food.

00:49:02.640 --> 00:49:04.520
 And tell me that's not serving you, right?

00:49:04.620 --> 00:49:04.900
 I mean.

00:49:05.400 --> 00:49:05.780
 Oh, yeah.

00:49:06.220 --> 00:49:06.440
 All right.

00:49:06.440 --> 00:49:07.900
 Hey, well, let's wrap up here.

00:49:08.240 --> 00:49:10.380
 So we've got begin with prayer, listen, eat together.

00:49:10.380 --> 00:49:15.560
 We've got serve, and we've got number five is coming in share stories.

00:49:15.740 --> 00:49:17.240
 So unpack share stories for us.

00:49:17.460 --> 00:49:17.760
 Yeah, man.

00:49:17.860 --> 00:49:19.000
 Yeah, the S is for story.

00:49:19.360 --> 00:49:24.300
 And, again, you know, like you said, begin with prayer, listen, eat together, look for tangible ways to serve.

00:49:24.360 --> 00:49:28.540
 And then, finally, when people were ready to listen, Jesus would share his story.

00:49:28.640 --> 00:49:30.240
 He would share the gospel, and we can, too.

00:49:30.360 --> 00:49:36.320
 You know, I think of when Doubting Thomas came to Jesus and asked, how can we know the way?

00:49:36.900 --> 00:49:38.500
 And Jesus said, hey, I'm the way.

00:49:38.600 --> 00:49:39.220
 I'm the truth.

00:49:39.220 --> 00:49:39.800
 I'm the life.

00:49:39.900 --> 00:49:43.280
 No one comes to the Father except through a relationship with me.

00:49:43.980 --> 00:49:50.800
 And, you know, what we find is that when you befriend and bless people, there's a good chance they're going to want to know your story.

00:49:51.800 --> 00:49:58.760
 You know, they might ask you what makes you different or why do you do what you do, especially if they've seen a pattern of you blessing them.

00:49:58.980 --> 00:50:03.180
 And then you can tell them, you know, how the love of Jesus has changed your life.

00:50:03.180 --> 00:50:11.980
 And, you know, I think kind of walking through this idea of begin with prayer, listen, eat, serve, and then looking for opportunities to tell your story.

00:50:12.020 --> 00:50:14.760
 And I would say, too, story needs to kind of go both ways.

00:50:14.800 --> 00:50:19.000
 You want to hear their story, right, as well as have the chance to tell your story.

00:50:19.000 --> 00:50:35.700
 But I think if we do these sort of tangible, practical, friendly ways of sharing the love of Jesus, then we can move from like, as we say, a community from hoping people will find their way back to God to actually helping them find their way back to God.

00:50:35.700 --> 00:50:46.440
 Imagine all the work we've done, imagine the relationship we've built before we even get to the place of sharing Jesus.

00:50:47.000 --> 00:50:51.920
 Like this is not, you know, casting seed on thorny ground.

00:50:52.480 --> 00:51:05.080
 This is, I have prayed, I have a relationship where I've listened, I have a relationship where I've been intentionally asking questions and even sitting down to eat with them.

00:51:05.080 --> 00:51:07.440
 I have a relationship where I've served them.

00:51:07.440 --> 00:51:14.240
 And now once I've gone through this level, this is where I'm now, hey, can I tell you about Jesus?

00:51:15.080 --> 00:51:25.740
 Like this is not echo chamber screaming from the rooftops, nor is this posting some really cheesy meme that talks about why Jesus is important in our lives.

00:51:25.740 --> 00:51:37.940
 This is like, I am in community with this person and through the trust of that person into me and to the community that we have, I'm now sharing Jesus.

00:51:38.320 --> 00:51:41.540
 Like this is, this is a really, I think, important tip.

00:51:41.620 --> 00:51:49.280
 I'm assuming you guys, this may be the big word I didn't understand earlier, but like you were very intentional about having this being the last piece, right?

00:51:49.280 --> 00:51:54.020
 Like it wouldn't make sense to put, share your story up at, you know, above being with prayer, right?

00:51:54.380 --> 00:51:54.500
 Right.

00:51:54.620 --> 00:51:55.400
 And yeah.

00:51:55.420 --> 00:52:01.300
 And just through whatever reason it happened to work out that it spells this word bless.

00:52:01.580 --> 00:52:01.940
 Yeah.

00:52:02.480 --> 00:52:07.040
 And, but yeah, I mean, it's, you want the story to be the last one, quite honestly.

00:52:07.080 --> 00:52:12.240
 And it's not that you're not at times aren't going to have an opportunity maybe to tell your story earlier on.

00:52:12.380 --> 00:52:19.680
 But I think especially for a lot of us who grew up and it was all about the story and it was all about, you know, the verbal witness.

00:52:19.680 --> 00:52:33.200
 You got to like tell people, I think this kind of gives all of us, hey, relax, you know, build that relationship, you know, and prayer actually counts as part of your missionary activity, right?

00:52:34.660 --> 00:52:37.560
 Listen, share a meal, look for opportunities to serve.

00:52:37.660 --> 00:52:41.740
 And then when the opportunity comes, yeah, tell your story, ask them to share their story.

00:52:42.700 --> 00:52:45.020
 And it just, it's much, it's so much more natural.

00:52:45.020 --> 00:52:51.220
 And, you know, somebody said the other day, they said, you know, these bless practices are like a remedial course on how to be a good friend.

00:52:52.880 --> 00:52:55.060
 I'm like, yeah, you know, I think you're pretty much right.

00:52:55.380 --> 00:52:56.060
 Isn't that true?

00:52:56.100 --> 00:52:58.780
 It's like, you know, Jesus was known as a friend of sinners.

00:52:59.220 --> 00:53:00.540
 He befriended them by blessing them.

00:53:00.560 --> 00:53:02.340
 And that's, I think, what he wants us to do too.

00:53:02.480 --> 00:53:05.640
 So if we, yeah, I want to see more people doing that.

00:53:05.640 --> 00:53:13.500
 So I don't know if it's digital missionary framework or if it's just a digital friend framework or just friend in general.

00:53:13.720 --> 00:53:16.540
 But man, what a great lineup here.

00:53:16.660 --> 00:53:17.540
 Begin with prayer.

00:53:17.900 --> 00:53:18.720
 We want to listen.

00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:20.580
 We need to eat together.

00:53:20.700 --> 00:53:21.620
 We need to be intimate.

00:53:22.060 --> 00:53:25.740
 We need to serve, position ourselves in a place of serving.

00:53:26.280 --> 00:53:33.340
 And we need to share the story of Christ and share about who Jesus is with these people.

00:53:34.080 --> 00:53:34.620
 Man, I don't know.

00:53:34.720 --> 00:53:40.540
 I think bless may make a little sense here to be a digital missionary, a framework for this.

00:53:40.540 --> 00:53:53.020
 Jeff, as you continue to explore that and learn more about that, if you get stories, man, I'd love to hear what people are saying and what they think about how this can work in the metaverse.

00:53:53.420 --> 00:53:53.560
 Yeah.

00:53:53.680 --> 00:53:55.140
 So here's what we're doing.

00:53:55.240 --> 00:53:57.080
 I'll even transition right off of that.

00:53:57.200 --> 00:54:06.240
 We've got your brother, Dave Ferguson, is jumping in a roundtable in a conversation centered around blesses digital missionaries.

00:54:06.320 --> 00:54:10.180
 And that's happening Monday, May 23rd, 9 p.m. Eastern.

00:54:10.580 --> 00:54:12.840
 So we'll put links in the show notes towards that.

00:54:13.300 --> 00:54:16.660
 But we're unpacking that even at a deeper level.

00:54:17.440 --> 00:54:22.360
 And we're going to be also, you know, he'll be available for Q&As talking about it.

00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:25.020
 But I really, I believe this.

00:54:25.100 --> 00:54:29.820
 I think that we're going to build two different, you know, I'll give you some inside scoops.

00:54:29.920 --> 00:54:34.500
 Like if you've made it this long, if you made it to the end of the podcast, you're like the loyal people, right?

00:54:34.520 --> 00:54:37.000
 So I'll give you a tip right here.

00:54:37.440 --> 00:54:44.020
 We're going to be rolling out two different frameworks for digital missionaries here, probably closer to the fall through DCN.

00:54:44.480 --> 00:54:51.420
 One of them, I think, is we're going to adapt Tyler Sansom's approach towards more influencers for people that want to go big.

00:54:51.420 --> 00:54:56.440
 But to be honest, the average person doesn't need to understand how to read the algorithms of YouTube.

00:54:56.960 --> 00:55:00.220
 The average person needs to understand this right here, bless.

00:55:00.800 --> 00:55:10.700
 And so I'm excited to continue to work through this and to start to platform this idea and give opportunities for some of these digital planters that are out there,

00:55:10.780 --> 00:55:15.420
 some of these digital pastors that are looking for tangible ways to start to train their people.

00:55:15.960 --> 00:55:27.080
 Like what some great processes here with this and cannot wait to see what our DCN family really starts to do with some of these bless practices and ideas.

00:55:27.300 --> 00:55:29.080
 And so, John, thank you for this.

00:55:29.080 --> 00:55:37.660
 This is, to be honest, like I've been theorizing some of this in my head, but I was really looking forward to this conversation just to start to piece this together.

00:55:37.940 --> 00:55:39.600
 And this has been a great time.

00:55:39.660 --> 00:55:40.640
 So thank you for doing it.

00:55:40.900 --> 00:55:41.600
 Same here, Jeff.

00:55:42.500 --> 00:55:46.380
 Really fun talking to you about this and love your energy.

00:55:46.640 --> 00:55:51.360
 I mean, your enthusiasm and excitement is contagious.

00:55:51.600 --> 00:55:54.000
 So it's easy to talk to you about it.

00:55:54.000 --> 00:55:54.740
 So thanks so much.

00:55:55.220 --> 00:55:55.620
 It's great.

00:55:55.920 --> 00:55:56.200
 Awesome.

00:55:56.200 --> 00:55:58.820
 So, hey, as we're landing the plane here, man, any closing thoughts?

00:55:59.460 --> 00:56:07.800
 No, man, I would just say continue to, you know, when you're reading through the Gospels, as you do, just look for these practices.

00:56:08.040 --> 00:56:11.680
 I think anybody would be amazed by how they see them over and over again.

00:56:11.820 --> 00:56:17.060
 It's almost like, you know, when you buy a new vehicle, you know, you get like a Honda, whatever, CRV or Pilot.

00:56:17.140 --> 00:56:19.700
 And all of a sudden it seems like everybody has a CRV or a Pilot.

00:56:20.220 --> 00:56:28.580
 I think when you start looking at the Gospels through this lens, you'll be blown away by how frequently Jesus went about blessing people in these five ways.

00:56:28.580 --> 00:56:32.540
 It just kind of helps remind you that this is not only a good idea.

00:56:32.660 --> 00:56:35.280
 This is actually Jesus' idea.

00:56:36.180 --> 00:56:39.220
 Look for it in Scripture and you'll find it there.

00:56:39.300 --> 00:56:41.500
 By the way, everybody in Miami drives a Jeep Wrangler.

00:56:41.700 --> 00:56:44.980
 I can officially say that now that I do drive a Jeep Wrangler.

00:56:45.220 --> 00:56:47.280
 But, hey, we're going to land a plane on this.

00:56:48.260 --> 00:56:55.160
 John, next time I'm in Chicago, we've got to sit down and actually, like, have a meal, evidently, because that's what Bless says.

00:56:55.280 --> 00:56:55.900
 Let's do it.

00:56:56.280 --> 00:56:58.760
 We've got some of the best restaurants anywhere, as you know.

00:56:58.980 --> 00:57:00.020
 There are some good ones.

00:57:00.120 --> 00:57:01.500
 I can attest to that.

00:57:01.940 --> 00:57:02.900
 But we're going to wrap.

00:57:03.140 --> 00:57:06.140
 So for John, once again, John, thank you for being on.

00:57:06.140 --> 00:57:10.580
 For John, this is Jeff with the Church Digital, Digital Church Network, and a bunch of other fun stuff.

00:57:10.700 --> 00:57:12.540
 Thanks for jumping on the podcast.

00:57:12.820 --> 00:57:14.320
 Check out the show notes for all the references.

00:57:14.840 --> 00:57:17.600
 And we'll see you soon here on the Church Digital Podcast.

00:57:17.800 --> 00:57:18.280
 Y'all have a good day.