WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:06.480 Just get started. The reality is your first video is you're going to look back five years 00:00:06.480 --> 00:00:13.600 from now and say, oh my gosh, I can't believe we did that video. But you're only going to get 00:00:13.600 --> 00:00:19.800 better as you keep on doing it. Welcome to the Church Digital Podcast. Through this podcast, 00:00:20.060 --> 00:00:24.560 we'll talk about the technological innovations within the church. But more than tech for tech 00:00:24.560 --> 00:00:29.800 itself, we'll address deeper questions. Is disciple making possible digitally? How should 00:00:29.800 --> 00:00:33.780 we approach the digital mission field? Can a biblically grounded church operate in digital 00:00:33.780 --> 00:00:38.600 space? Oh, and where does the metaverse and artificial intelligence fit into all of this? 00:00:39.560 --> 00:00:44.660 Whether you're a big or small church, the Church Digital's goal is to help churches like yours 00:00:44.660 --> 00:00:50.300 learn to be a multiplying church digitally and physically. And now here's your host, Jeff Reed. 00:00:50.860 --> 00:00:59.120 All right, we got episode 298. 298 Church Digital Podcast. Jeff here doing this podcast recording. 00:00:59.600 --> 00:01:05.100 A live interview with Tom Pounder coming up more on that a little bit. By the way, I'm going to talk a 00:01:05.100 --> 00:01:10.080 little softer, but maybe a little more passionate here with the podcast because my children are literally 00:01:10.080 --> 00:01:17.640 asleep in the next room. It's summer here in Miami and they are all over the house. And evidently, 00:01:17.640 --> 00:01:24.080 they stayed up late last night. So they're going to sleep in during the day. And it's about 940 a.m. 00:01:24.080 --> 00:01:29.580 And I just want to jump in and wake them up and like, hey, get out of bed. But not quite. We'll do 00:01:29.580 --> 00:01:34.780 that in a way. Anyway, hey, all of the Church Digital Podcast is brought to you by Riverside. Excited 00:01:34.780 --> 00:01:39.220 about our partnership with Riverside. If you haven't checked it out, thechurch.digital.com slash 00:01:39.220 --> 00:01:45.420 Riverside. By the way, they have a new feature inside Riverside. They come out with new stuff all the 00:01:45.420 --> 00:01:50.620 time. Like every week when I talk about it, there's something new. And this is incredibly awesome and 00:01:50.620 --> 00:01:58.580 scary both at the same time, Riverside. I hope you're listening to this. But the feature is, well, 00:01:58.580 --> 00:02:04.340 so, you know, I've got, I don't know, hundreds of hours worth of my voice inside Riverside. And, 00:02:04.340 --> 00:02:12.400 and so there's now an AI bot that I can type anything inside Riverside and artificial intelligence 00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:19.300 will recreate my voice to say it. So, like I said, this is an incredibly cool feature and incredibly 00:02:19.300 --> 00:02:23.940 scary both at the same time. You want to get your pastor to say something you need, you need to, 00:02:23.940 --> 00:02:32.740 to edit a message or do a voiceover. Artificial intelligence can do that. The flip side is, 00:02:32.740 --> 00:02:39.760 wow, what could that be done for not good means? So it's interesting. It's a challenge. You know, 00:02:39.760 --> 00:02:44.600 we've talked about the ethics of artificial intelligence surrounding Sora. And, and I'm 00:02:44.600 --> 00:02:51.760 excited for the feature. I'll use it for good. But it'll be interesting to see what the future will 00:02:51.760 --> 00:02:59.600 hold and how this is used for good and for, let's just say, not good purposes moving forward. So, 00:02:59.600 --> 00:03:06.480 hey, check it out. Thechurch.digital/Riverside. Assume the best until you don't have the ability to. So, 00:03:06.480 --> 00:03:12.400 thechurch.digital/Riverside. If your church isn't using it, check it out. All sorts of features, 00:03:12.400 --> 00:03:20.240 remote access, remote interviews, shorts, artificial intelligence, summarizations, chapter listings, 00:03:20.240 --> 00:03:26.960 listings, like your church needs to be utilizing this for your weekend services and even beyond it. 00:03:26.960 --> 00:03:33.120 And so, cool. Hey, we've got episode 300, the church digital podcast, 300. I've had 300 of these 00:03:33.120 --> 00:03:38.160 conversations already. We've got 299. Actually, technically I've had 299 of these conversations 00:03:38.160 --> 00:03:43.440 already. Episode 300, I'm recording very soon. And, uh, so I'm not going to publicly announce here on the 00:03:43.440 --> 00:03:50.320 podcast who it's going to be, uh, because I've publicly leaked it on our discord. And so if you 00:03:50.320 --> 00:03:55.920 are not on the church digitals discord, well, what the garbage is wrong with you go swing over, 00:03:55.920 --> 00:04:01.120 open a web browser to discord.thechurch.digital. If you don't have a discord account, if you don't even 00:04:01.120 --> 00:04:07.120 know what discord is, uh, it's a check it out discord.thechurch.digital, that'll help you set 00:04:07.120 --> 00:04:13.360 up an account and we'll get you subscribed to our online community, jump in there, be part of it. 00:04:13.360 --> 00:04:18.720 Oh, we've got close to 250 people in there right now. And, uh, lots of engagement, lots of fun, 00:04:18.720 --> 00:04:25.600 lots of joking around. Megan Carter just went on a vacation and she just told us that 00:04:25.600 --> 00:04:31.760 guardians of the galaxy is the best ride at Disney world. And she's not necessarily wrong. Although 00:04:31.760 --> 00:04:39.120 I, I would value rise of the resistance more on my side and guardians. I think the guardian story 00:04:39.120 --> 00:04:43.120 is better, but ride is rise. It's like three rides in one and we can get into that. Megan and I will 00:04:43.120 --> 00:04:47.440 get into that fight at some point, uh, probably on a stream or something. We'll make it public. It'll be 00:04:47.440 --> 00:04:55.280 fun. But, um, anyway, all sorts of conversations that are happening, uh, and, uh, early sneak peeks 00:04:55.280 --> 00:05:02.560 and, uh, uh, community, uh, centered around digital discipleship, digital church, uh, digital ministry, 00:05:02.560 --> 00:05:07.920 uh, lots of crazy people hanging out in discord.thechurch.digital, jump in there, 00:05:07.920 --> 00:05:13.680 create an account and, uh, be part of the conversation. So here at 298, we're hanging out 00:05:13.680 --> 00:05:20.240 with Tom Pounder. Tom is a TCD sidekick. Tom has been a friend for years going all the way 00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:24.880 back to 2018, um, was, uh, probably honestly, one of the first 00:05:25.280 --> 00:05:31.680 pastors. I would say maybe top 10, first 10 first digital pastors I met, um, when I, when I quit 00:05:31.680 --> 00:05:37.920 Christ fellowship, my, my job that I had in 2018. And so, um, when I resigned and started the church 00:05:37.920 --> 00:05:43.840 digital, Tom was, was doing why I'm sidekick, uh, podcast and digital bootcamp and a number of other 00:05:43.840 --> 00:05:48.240 things. And just was kind of really excited, uh, to, to connect with me. And, and we just built a, 00:05:48.240 --> 00:05:53.840 a friendship that, that equated to, um, Hey Tom, why don't you come on board with the church digital 00:05:53.840 --> 00:06:00.240 and be TCD sidekick? And so Tom has, uh, come on with us and is doing a lot of work centered on it. 00:06:00.240 --> 00:06:04.720 We'll talk about it in the podcast, but, but more than that, between his blogs and his podcasts, 00:06:04.720 --> 00:06:11.840 he's currently a digital pastor at, um, new life church in the DC area and, uh, is doing some 00:06:11.840 --> 00:06:16.880 incredible work in YouTube. And so, you know, it's been a while since Tom and I have hung out here on the 00:06:16.880 --> 00:06:22.000 podcast. And so I wanted to have more of a casual conversation with my friend, kind of hanging out 00:06:22.000 --> 00:06:27.760 and talking a little bit about YouTube. And so here we go. We got Tom Pounder, uh, content director 00:06:27.760 --> 00:06:34.080 for the church, digital digital pastor for, uh, new life Christian and myself, Jeff with the church 00:06:34.080 --> 00:06:41.920 digital in a conversation, kind of calling your church hacking YouTube. And, uh, if Google hears that 00:06:41.920 --> 00:06:46.800 we're hacking YouTube, please don't send Google bots to, you know, spam me because I'm not 00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:51.920 literally saying we're going to hack YouTube. It's more of like a life hack. We're going to get 00:06:51.920 --> 00:06:57.440 stuff out of it, not, you know, take down the system. I love YouTube. I don't want to destroy it. 00:06:57.440 --> 00:07:02.720 I love Google. I don't want to destroy you. Although I'm not sure Google's, you know, do no harm, 00:07:03.680 --> 00:07:09.280 uh, mantra is still valid today. Like it maybe it was valid a couple of years ago, but I, I just, 00:07:10.320 --> 00:07:16.640 I don't know, man, AI is going to take over the world. That's another conversation. Got serious. 00:07:17.200 --> 00:07:21.600 Tom, Tom's going to teach us how to hack YouTube here on the church digital podcast. Here you all go. 00:07:23.600 --> 00:07:27.760 So we're, we're streaming this live on, on discord, of course, and having the conversation. We've got 00:07:27.760 --> 00:07:34.240 white beard and a flat cap in here. And, uh, so white beard DC is my hometown. And, uh, yeah, 00:07:34.240 --> 00:07:40.000 you mentioned that on the call today and I was like, oh yeah, Tom, Tom and Tom from, from the same 00:07:40.000 --> 00:07:46.320 language. Tom, you were Tom Pounder. You were originally from DC, Maryland. 00:07:47.360 --> 00:07:53.440 Yeah. Uh, just outside of DC in the Northern Virginia area, which if you look at Virginia, 00:07:54.080 --> 00:08:00.720 there's the Northern Virginia section, which is about four, maybe five counties. And then there's 00:08:00.720 --> 00:08:06.960 the rest of Virginia. And so Northern Virginia is so different from the rest of Virginia. It could 00:08:06.960 --> 00:08:13.920 probably be its own state there. It's that different. So what it's more urban versus rural. 00:08:14.640 --> 00:08:21.600 Well, it's more suburban. The rest of Virginia is more like rural area outside of like Richmond or 00:08:22.960 --> 00:08:29.280 Newport news Norfolk area. It's, there's a lot of ruralness in, well, Hey, uh, so we're doing a 00:08:29.280 --> 00:08:35.200 live stream here, a live recording of the TCD podcast. And, um, it's, uh, so I've got, 00:08:36.080 --> 00:08:43.040 I mean, honestly, Tom Pounder went, when I started the church digital in 2018, stepped out of the 00:08:43.040 --> 00:08:49.280 church job. I was, I was working Tom Pounder was probably the number two guy to reach out to me. 00:08:49.280 --> 00:08:56.400 Uh, you know, I probably Jay Cranda was number one. Um, but Tom was, was shortly and she, 00:08:56.400 --> 00:09:01.760 Jay and I were friends at the time, but I didn't know Tom from Adam and Tom's like, Hey, why don't we 00:09:01.760 --> 00:09:07.760 do a podcast and talk about it? And so jump, jumped on with him and, and he's like, you know, 00:09:07.760 --> 00:09:12.640 ask me questions about the church digital. And honestly, in 2018, I had no idea what I was doing 00:09:13.200 --> 00:09:18.640 with any of this stuff. And so like, it was a really, uh, start from scratch kind of approach. 00:09:18.640 --> 00:09:23.840 And, and, um, like we've just, we've kept that relationship over the years, which has been a lot of 00:09:23.840 --> 00:09:31.680 fun. And, uh, and Tom, you know, at the time was doing YM sidekick, which used to be youth ministry 00:09:31.680 --> 00:09:37.680 sidekick. And then when he went digital, it was your ministry sidekick. Um, and, uh, I, you know, 00:09:37.680 --> 00:09:42.000 I think a couple of years ago, I convinced them, Hey, why don't you come on board with the church 00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:47.800 digital and let's, uh, let's make it the TCD sidekick. And so that's, that's where we are today. 00:09:47.800 --> 00:09:53.740 TCD sidekick, Tom Pounder, you know, that would, there's the running joke that that would make me 00:09:53.740 --> 00:10:01.440 Batman and, and he would be Robin. I would be the Lone Ranger and he would be Toto. I would be 00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:08.400 Tonto. Um, Tonto, uh, you know, I'm currently singing. Yeah. Tonto white beard. Does the other 00:10:08.400 --> 00:10:13.240 Tom beat you to it? Uh, white beard corrected me of course. Uh, but I'm currently singing the Jeff 00:10:13.240 --> 00:10:17.780 Moore, the Ranger and Toto Laurel and Hardy, the Batman and Robin Snoopy and Charlie Snoopy 00:10:17.780 --> 00:10:22.420 and Charlie is, uh, you know, although the sidekick is really more of the, what's the bird's 00:10:22.420 --> 00:10:27.960 name of Woodstock? Woodstock. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know that you, Tom, you, you can appreciate 00:10:27.960 --> 00:10:34.460 a good Jeff Moore song from the, from the early 1990s, can't you? I think so. Maybe possibly, 00:10:34.460 --> 00:10:40.660 uh, you know, I, I, I love nineties. I'm all into the nineties, but do you not know Jeff 00:10:40.660 --> 00:10:47.620 Moore singing a friend like you? Yeah, I'm going to have to say no, I, I don't. 00:10:47.760 --> 00:10:54.940 Or I know the, the, the toy story song, you know, you've got a friend in me, but I don't 00:10:54.940 --> 00:11:01.300 know. Tom, get off the stage. We're done. This, this interview is officially over before 00:11:01.300 --> 00:11:10.940 it even got started. Google search Jeff Moore. Jeff Moore, G E O F F M O O R E. Jeff Moore 00:11:10.940 --> 00:11:18.580 singing a friend like you. Oh, I do know Jeff Moore. I do know Jeff. Yeah. Like a student 00:11:18.580 --> 00:11:24.680 ministry guy. You have, do not know this. I am just, we need to pray for the lost souls 00:11:24.680 --> 00:11:30.680 that have been under Tom's career in ministry and in the Washington area. Like this is a, 00:11:31.640 --> 00:11:37.000 I, I was one of those, I was one of those guys that didn't really go to a lot of the Christian 00:11:37.000 --> 00:11:41.580 concerts. Like there were a few that I would go to, but you know, we didn't really, I didn't 00:11:41.580 --> 00:11:45.920 really take my students to the Christian concerts. I will say this. One of the first concerts I 00:11:45.920 --> 00:11:53.440 ever remember going to, um, this is dating me is that my mom and her friends like took my 00:11:53.440 --> 00:12:01.240 brothers and I to go see Sandy Patty, uh, at one of the arenas. And we listened to Sandy Patty. 00:12:01.640 --> 00:12:06.480 I got, I got, I got no words. He's quoting Sandy Patty, but he's not referencing Jeff Moore. 00:12:06.840 --> 00:12:14.340 I don't even, I, I, um, I'm, I'm at a loss here today. So, um, well, Hey, we are my, my first 00:12:14.340 --> 00:12:20.140 concert was Skid Row. My first concert was Petra. Uh, so white beard saying, uh, Skid Row. Uh, my first 00:12:20.140 --> 00:12:29.280 concert was Petra, um, uh, was the, uh, beyond belief tour. They did a concert. Oh yeah. I love that. 00:12:29.280 --> 00:12:35.480 I'm actually, it was, yeah, yeah. They actually did a, uh, a VCR, a VCR release of that tour, 00:12:35.480 --> 00:12:43.460 uh, the VHS tape. And, uh, I'm on the, the concert. I'm, I'm on the VHS. You can, you can see me. 00:12:43.460 --> 00:12:48.360 They did like a shot of the audience and I was over like right near the bass player who was like 00:12:48.360 --> 00:12:53.360 jamming out. And so it's like, you know, I was like much thinner kid that I am now, much skinnier kid 00:12:53.360 --> 00:12:58.560 than I am now. Justin Smith and associations. I worked that tour. Okay. Very cool. Um, wait, 00:12:58.560 --> 00:13:04.860 you worked, uh, the, the beyond belief tour down in, in, so down in Miami. That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. 00:13:04.860 --> 00:13:12.640 So I was, I was in seventh grade maybe when that, when that concert was there, another conversation, 00:13:12.800 --> 00:13:17.120 white beard evidently was, was there white beard. And I have met like physically 40 times in life, 00:13:17.120 --> 00:13:21.980 just never actually talked to each other. The other, our paths have crossed so much. It's amazing. 00:13:22.680 --> 00:13:28.840 Um, and, uh, so my, my, my, my, Hey Calvary just walks in. Uh, so we'll have to get serious. Cause now 00:13:28.840 --> 00:13:34.620 we've got like real people coming into order to hear about, uh, YouTube hacking. But, um, I will say 00:13:34.620 --> 00:13:43.340 that my, my most recent, this is, this is how uncool I am these days. Um, my most recent concert 00:13:43.340 --> 00:13:55.680 is the spice girls. I have not been to a concert in 20 years. Easy. I went to the last spice girls 00:13:55.680 --> 00:14:02.820 us concert in, uh, in the year 2000. I w I was a radio DJ at the time. I got free tickets and ended 00:14:02.820 --> 00:14:09.540 up going with some friends. I was the oldest male that was not a father at the spice girls concert. 00:14:10.260 --> 00:14:16.060 There were dads who were taking their little daughters to go see scary spice and, and posh spice. 00:14:16.740 --> 00:14:22.180 And, uh, and then there was me. Uh, and yeah, I'll tell you what I really, really want. Believe me. 00:14:22.180 --> 00:14:26.740 I, I sing that song all the time to the kids and they, they're like, daddy, shut up. Uh, so I'm going 00:14:26.740 --> 00:14:32.960 to go see, I just got tickets to Chris Tomlin in the fall. So I won't be able to share my, my, my, uh, 00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:39.900 my spice girl story anymore. Ironically, uh, the person who came in that I was like, Hey, we've got 00:14:39.900 --> 00:14:43.880 to behave. We've got someone like watching, uh, as soon as I said, spice girls, they left. So I think 00:14:43.880 --> 00:14:50.600 that's scary. We do have a podcast. Yeah, I'm out there. They're talking about, about scary and sporty 00:14:50.600 --> 00:14:56.300 and posh and whatever the other one was. Who was the other one? Uh, uh, baby spice. I think there was 00:14:56.300 --> 00:15:05.260 baby spice baby. Yes. Scary, sporty, posh and baby. There you go. Tom Pounder knows his spice girls, 00:15:05.260 --> 00:15:11.260 but does not know Jeff more in the distance. Um, all right. So here's what I need us to do. Um, 00:15:11.480 --> 00:15:17.480 you know, TCD, we launched the discord channel and it's at discord. Uh, the church, digital.com. 00:15:17.480 --> 00:15:21.460 If you are not part of the discord channel, like I, I encourage you guys, anybody listening to this 00:15:21.460 --> 00:15:25.940 podcast, subscribe to the TCD discord channel, discord of web browser, 00:15:25.940 --> 00:15:30.600 go to web browser, discord.thechurch.digital. That'll walk you through creating the account. 00:15:30.700 --> 00:15:35.460 That'll get you in to subscribe to the TCD server. There's a channel in there called TCD podcast, 00:15:35.460 --> 00:15:40.460 where we're going to talk all about the podcast. So I want you to find the TCD podcast channel on 00:15:40.460 --> 00:15:46.740 discord. And I want you to publicly rip and humiliate Tom Pounder for not knowing who Jeff more in the 00:15:46.740 --> 00:15:54.360 distances. Like I just am, I'm, I'm, I'm at a loss here, right, right up front. Okay. That was a very 00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:59.520 long plea to get people to sign up for the discord. So we've got, we got, I mean, at the time of this 00:15:59.520 --> 00:16:07.680 recording, 240 in here, it's been really fun. The German, the German, um, church network just, 00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:11.780 just joined in here today. And so I started getting notification. I'm an admin. So anytime somebody 00:16:11.780 --> 00:16:18.240 says something, I get notified and, uh, I, I started getting all these pings and it's Simon Dirks, 00:16:18.320 --> 00:16:23.520 who's a German doing like posting in German, some of the stuff he's doing on, on the channels. It's 00:16:23.520 --> 00:16:27.180 like, ah, I don't recognize that language. And that's okay. It's like, we're just going to, 00:16:27.460 --> 00:16:31.860 we're going to move on with that, but it's man, it's going to be awesome in here, uh, with that. 00:16:31.860 --> 00:16:38.400 And so Tom, we're going to talk YouTube, right? Yeah. That's the plan. 00:16:39.600 --> 00:16:47.240 Listen, I'm, I'm all for it. All right. So we are, um, Tom is the, the, the community, 00:16:47.400 --> 00:16:52.960 the content director for the church digital, and obviously has been spending a lot of time 00:16:52.960 --> 00:17:00.120 growing and developing the church digitals, uh, subscriber base. I mean, Tom, I may be making 00:17:00.120 --> 00:17:06.860 up numbers, but you, you took it from like 300 to 800 man. Right. Like, uh, over, um, over the span 00:17:06.860 --> 00:17:11.800 of time when you were running that, like it was a significant jump. I know, I don't think it was 00:17:11.800 --> 00:17:17.980 quite 300. I think it was more than that, but we did have a big jump, you know, uh, during the summer 00:17:17.980 --> 00:17:24.580 months last year and into the fall. So yeah, we, we did jump a bunch. No, he's, he grew the TCD 00:17:24.580 --> 00:17:34.220 subscriber base by 5,000 users, maybe 8.7 million users, uh, overnight. Like it was incredible. 00:17:34.660 --> 00:17:40.720 Uh, the most popular video. Yeah. Yeah. Listen, I'm not going to lie. The most popular video on TCD's 00:17:40.720 --> 00:17:48.160 YouTube channel before Tom was involved was I posted a video of, uh, the CEO of Amazon talking about what 00:17:48.160 --> 00:17:54.740 Amazon was going to be back in like, I don't know, like the late nineties. And, uh, I wrote about it 00:17:54.740 --> 00:17:59.360 in a blog and for some reason that was, that just, it was like a 60 second video. It's not even a short. 00:17:59.460 --> 00:18:05.520 It was like that, just a video. You know, that still gets views, man. Every day. I mean, every week 00:18:05.520 --> 00:18:12.200 when we check the YouTube stats, that's still getting views. Well, it's amazing to me that it, um, 00:18:12.200 --> 00:18:17.660 first off that, that it's got that much legs. Um, secondly, that people were subscribing to the 00:18:17.660 --> 00:18:21.060 church digital. I mean, if you look at the subscriber rate based off of that video, you can see it's 00:18:21.060 --> 00:18:26.620 like, people are subscribing to the church digital based off of one 60 second. Like, do they have any 00:18:26.620 --> 00:18:32.060 idea what else we talk about on here? Like, just because you, you think that I'm a, whatever Jeff 00:18:32.060 --> 00:18:36.960 Bezos fan, uh, does not mean that you're going to like the other content. And so it's, it's, 00:18:36.960 --> 00:18:42.660 it's always interesting when that happens, but, but Tom, uh, you know, in addition, digital pastor 00:18:42.660 --> 00:18:48.420 at a new life community in Washington, DC. And so, you know, give us, give us a, an update a little 00:18:48.420 --> 00:18:53.640 bit specifically how you're using YouTube with, with the church. What, what, what are some lessons 00:18:53.640 --> 00:18:58.860 that you're learning? Yeah. So let me just give you a quick little history of, uh, with us with 00:18:58.860 --> 00:19:04.980 YouTube is that, you know, we were doing YouTube for a long time, well before COVID. And we were 00:19:04.980 --> 00:19:11.900 basically just putting up our sermons online. And, um, and that was fine. You know, it was a way to get 00:19:11.900 --> 00:19:16.420 some content on there. And then we'd make some funny videos and we posted on there, but we were 00:19:16.420 --> 00:19:24.600 never really intentional about our YouTube stuff until we hit COVID. And, and in Virginia, you know, 00:19:25.180 --> 00:19:34.100 our churches were shut down in Virginia probably for like maybe a month to two months. It was on the 00:19:34.100 --> 00:19:40.060 shorter end of the shutdowns. They weren't long gated shutdowns during COVID, but it was at that time 00:19:40.060 --> 00:19:45.580 where, since we weren't able to have regular connections with people at our church, our lead 00:19:45.580 --> 00:19:52.780 pastor said, we need to be getting God's word out to people every single day. And so he had the idea 00:19:52.780 --> 00:20:00.560 of that, um, him and the other ministers, myself included, we could do daily devotionals and that 00:20:00.560 --> 00:20:07.320 we would be able to post up on YouTube and then also send out on via email. And so that's what we did. 00:20:07.520 --> 00:20:16.340 And at that point, we probably had 500, 600 subscribers on YouTube. Um, but at that point, 00:20:16.340 --> 00:20:23.240 we started then growing significantly. People started watching our videos from our congregation, 00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:29.080 but then if you look at the stats, then you could see that more people that were not subscribers 00:20:29.080 --> 00:20:34.320 were discovering our videos and they were being encouraged in their faith during this time. 00:20:34.940 --> 00:20:39.360 And so we started doing that, continue to do that. And I would, I would mix it up a little bit and, 00:20:39.480 --> 00:20:45.920 and, um, share some worship videos. Or if we had other, other fun videos, we were kind of a, 00:20:46.080 --> 00:20:50.340 we like to have fun at our church. And so if there's ever anything fun that happens, 00:20:50.340 --> 00:20:56.160 I like to cut it and put it up on YouTube just as a way for people to, to get a taste of who we are 00:20:56.160 --> 00:21:05.000 as a church. But then about two years ago, maybe a little bit longer, we started, one of our initiatives 00:21:05.000 --> 00:21:11.240 at the church was that we wanted people reading the Bible every day. Um, and so we want to encourage 00:21:11.240 --> 00:21:16.120 them in their faith and say, Hey, listen, we're going to text you. And we use the text and church 00:21:16.120 --> 00:21:21.240 platform. We're going to text you a daily Bible verse or a passage, and we're going to encourage 00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:26.660 you, you in your faith. And so we started doing that. And then as we were going along with that, 00:21:27.200 --> 00:21:33.440 we realized, Hey, what if we just did a quick little YouTube short out of this? You know, 00:21:33.440 --> 00:21:40.220 a lot of people are watching YouTube shorts or they're watching TikToks or watching Instagram reels 00:21:40.220 --> 00:21:45.420 and they're laughing and they're having fun at just the different things, the silly stuff that goes on 00:21:45.420 --> 00:21:51.960 with these short videos. And we said, why don't we just, um, you know, give the hope of Christ 00:21:51.960 --> 00:21:57.300 into people and hopefully people will be encouraged in their faith. And again, at that point, YouTube 00:21:57.300 --> 00:22:04.440 was just getting into the YouTube shorts. And so we thought, let's do that. And, um, let's start 00:22:04.440 --> 00:22:08.800 doing daily YouTube shorts. They're only 60 seconds long. I mean, they're not going to be very 00:22:08.800 --> 00:22:13.120 difficult. You just take a passage, you share a thought about it and encourage them in Christ. 00:22:13.500 --> 00:22:21.220 And the remarkable thing about it was this one where we got, it wasn't just for the main ministers 00:22:21.220 --> 00:22:26.240 that were able to share these thoughts. We got volunteers to share these thoughts. We've got 00:22:26.240 --> 00:22:33.500 other staffers who were like not ministers share their thoughts. And we got a tremendous response out 00:22:33.500 --> 00:22:41.000 of this where, again, at first we were starting to get 50, 60 views. Then we started getting 100 to 200 00:22:41.000 --> 00:22:49.480 views. And now we're up to four or 500 views of, uh, um, a devotional that is shared. And what ended up 00:22:49.480 --> 00:22:54.900 happening was, again, we grew when we started doing these longer form devotionals. But then when we 00:22:54.900 --> 00:23:02.160 started doing YouTube shorts, we grew significantly, like we were like, so when we first started before COVID, 00:23:02.280 --> 00:23:10.940 we were at around 500 or so. We're at now up to 1800, almost 1900 subscribers. And we're adding to that 00:23:10.940 --> 00:23:17.300 number all the time. And it's in large part because of the devotionals that we're doing. And again, we're not 00:23:17.300 --> 00:23:21.760 doing anything spectacular here. We're just sharing the word of God with people. And people are being 00:23:21.760 --> 00:23:26.760 encouraged and they're subscribing to our channels. And then we feel like, gosh, we're reaching so many 00:23:26.760 --> 00:23:33.480 people. And again, our, our, our weekly reach, like we have at our church, we probably have like 700 00:23:33.480 --> 00:23:40.300 people that come to our church service every single Sunday. We're reaching three to four to 5,000 people 00:23:40.300 --> 00:23:47.380 a week on YouTube with the hope of Christ. And we're like, we're, we're tripling that what we normally get 00:23:47.380 --> 00:23:54.200 on Sundays and we get to encourage people every single day. So that we're using YouTube shorts as 00:23:54.200 --> 00:24:00.420 a way to really just share the love of Christ in a devotional format to not just encourage the people 00:24:00.420 --> 00:24:04.760 that go to our church, but also the people around our church and around the world. 00:24:06.260 --> 00:24:10.420 Yeah, that's, that's so good. While you were talking, Tom, I just, I just pulled up our, 00:24:10.460 --> 00:24:17.280 um, the, the church digitals analytics, trying to, to compliment what you're talking about. Um, you 00:24:17.280 --> 00:24:27.440 know, over the past 28 days, 75% of new viewers, new viewers to the church digital have been on 00:24:27.440 --> 00:24:35.740 shorts, uh, compared to, to 25% of, uh, of, of, of normal videos. Um, returning videos, 00:24:35.740 --> 00:24:44.020 most interestingly is probably 66% videos, uh, with shorts coming back around. And, and so like 00:24:44.020 --> 00:24:52.400 from a, uh, from an acquisition, um, yeah, so I'm just doing a quick math in my head. 70% 00:24:52.400 --> 00:24:59.840 of all subscribers within the last 28 days have been from shorts for the, for the church digital. And so 00:24:59.840 --> 00:25:06.460 as you're looking at, uh, acquiring new eyes and getting some ideas out, um, in, in front of new 00:25:06.460 --> 00:25:14.480 people, uh, like shorts is, um, is, uh, is not a, it's not a new concept, but, but to be honest, 00:25:14.480 --> 00:25:18.280 it's one that, you know, a lot of churches are not taken in physical churches as well as digital 00:25:18.280 --> 00:25:22.520 churches is one that we're not taking advantage of. And so it's, it's beautiful. 00:25:23.200 --> 00:25:29.620 Yeah, Jeff, I, I think, I think we overcomplicate it sometimes, you know, um, where I think all 00:25:29.620 --> 00:25:33.700 churches think they have to be a big church to be able to do something like this, or they have to 00:25:33.700 --> 00:25:40.120 be a well-produced video that have to do something like this. And the reality is what, what COVID taught 00:25:40.120 --> 00:25:47.620 us with TikTok and Instagram reels is that people were just sitting on their couch doing videos and 00:25:47.620 --> 00:25:52.880 people were like watching them and being encouraged by them. And so we don't have to overcomplicate it. 00:25:52.940 --> 00:25:58.240 We just have to share the word of God with them. You don't have to do anything trendy or funny. If 00:25:58.240 --> 00:26:03.340 you want to, great, you know, but by you sharing the word of God, people, people need to hear that 00:26:03.340 --> 00:26:09.460 hope. And so we just said, we're going to be about discipleship. We're going to be about taking people 00:26:09.460 --> 00:26:13.960 so that they can take a next step in their faith, no matter where they're at. And God has really 00:26:13.960 --> 00:26:21.340 blessed it. Yeah, that's, that's, that's so true. I know, um, you know, churches overcomplicate things 00:26:21.340 --> 00:26:28.980 like that's, that's a surprise, man. I don't know any church. That's, that's crazy. Um, but, uh, 00:26:28.980 --> 00:26:35.020 you know, quality is, you know, it's, it's always quality versus quantity. Right. And, um, you know, 00:26:35.020 --> 00:26:41.380 some, some communications directors pushing for more quantity, some, you know, some creative directors 00:26:41.380 --> 00:26:47.920 pushing for better quality. Um, it's, there's, there's always that tension between the two. Um, 00:26:48.100 --> 00:26:52.260 this is what, I mean, what I, as we were actually just having this conversation, I want to say 00:26:52.260 --> 00:26:57.640 yesterday on, on the church digital discord channel with, uh, with the increase of artificial 00:26:57.640 --> 00:27:04.760 intelligence and, and that's starting to get into, was it Sora and now AI being able to even create 00:27:04.760 --> 00:27:10.660 and edit video and, and piece together quality video that's artificially intelligent, uh, infused. 00:27:11.340 --> 00:27:17.800 Um, this is what I think is going to happen. I think you're going to see a massive shift back 00:27:17.800 --> 00:27:26.980 towards very simple and very authentic, um, video communication. Like, you know, when AI artificial 00:27:26.980 --> 00:27:33.420 intelligence can make anybody look like they're producing well-produced, well-thought-out, uh, 00:27:33.420 --> 00:27:39.600 pieces of, of content, to be honest, and, and hopefully this isn't like spoiling it for people, 00:27:39.600 --> 00:27:45.380 like content's going to end up being devalued when AI can do so much of it and anybody can, 00:27:45.520 --> 00:27:54.180 can sound, uh, um, intelligent. Um, it's not, it's not that method that's going to stand out. 00:27:54.400 --> 00:28:01.540 It's authenticity. It's, it's relationships, it's connections. It's, um, it like, that's, 00:28:01.540 --> 00:28:08.160 what's going to resonate well. And, and, and to Tom's point, you know, having a, um, a simple, 00:28:08.300 --> 00:28:13.280 you know, camera rig where you're able to turn around and produce stuff to connect with people 00:28:13.280 --> 00:28:19.380 versus prove your, how quality you are off of the editing and producing. Um, which once again, 00:28:19.380 --> 00:28:24.280 in digital ministry, like that opens up so many opportunities for, even for small and 00:28:24.280 --> 00:28:29.980 medium-sized churches to, to now start to engage better because the, you know, the benefit I 00:28:29.980 --> 00:28:34.860 remember, I'm not going to tell you the name of this church. I had a conversation with a digital 00:28:34.860 --> 00:28:42.500 pastor about this at a, um, let's call it a giga church. Let's call it one of the top five, uh, 00:28:42.500 --> 00:28:48.640 churches size wise in America. That's why I'm not going to out this church. Um, but the digital 00:28:48.640 --> 00:28:57.120 pastor was beside himself. He was stuck. He was frustrated because of the quality controls that 00:28:57.120 --> 00:29:05.220 were in place for him to even do a simple, uh, uh, selfie video to communicate with his people. 00:29:05.560 --> 00:29:09.140 He's like, Jeff, I've got literally Tom, you'll appreciate this. He's like, Jeff, I got to work 00:29:09.140 --> 00:29:15.520 three weeks in advance because by the time it gets through the brand group and, uh, the content group 00:29:15.520 --> 00:29:19.760 and the script, he's like, he's like, literally I got to write the script three weeks out and we're 00:29:19.760 --> 00:29:25.280 shooting stuff two weeks out. And by the time it gets through everything, it may be published, you 00:29:25.280 --> 00:29:29.940 know, 21 days from when, when I wrote the script. And I was like, you know, I was like, well, that's 00:29:29.940 --> 00:29:34.900 not very like authentic. And he's like, yeah, it's, it's really hard to be authentic when you're trying 00:29:34.900 --> 00:29:39.020 to figure out how you're going to be authentic, like four weeks later, um, how it's going to sit 00:29:39.020 --> 00:29:44.280 then. And that that's, that's some of the traps that were all kind of built up here within our 00:29:44.280 --> 00:29:49.340 church systems. Go ahead, Tom. Yeah. You're, you're hitting the nail right on the head, Jeff. 00:29:49.380 --> 00:29:54.520 And that's what we discovered here with our, our church as well. Our creative director, and I love 00:29:54.520 --> 00:30:00.760 him, you know, he's a great guy to work with. He was so concerned about the, the production of it. 00:30:00.960 --> 00:30:05.940 It didn't seem real. And what I finally had to tell him was like, we just have to get started. 00:30:06.100 --> 00:30:12.020 We have to go do this and let's just try it out. And because we saw the results of people just being 00:30:12.020 --> 00:30:18.100 authentic, people want authenticity. They don't want a production. And I think that's where we've 00:30:18.100 --> 00:30:24.060 kind of muddied the waters here is, and again, what COVID showed us was people just wanted real people 00:30:24.060 --> 00:30:29.940 doing real things, talking about real life issues. They don't need this high quality thing. I, I can, 00:30:30.100 --> 00:30:34.740 I can go and do a video and my hair be a little bit messy and that's okay because they're being 00:30:34.740 --> 00:30:39.940 encouraged in their faith. They're not looking to see, you know, my whole, if my whole face is 00:30:39.940 --> 00:30:45.300 zit proof, you know, whatever. Like I watch videos now, it's kind of back to what you say about AI. 00:30:45.560 --> 00:30:53.580 I watch videos now and I'm like, that person is too perfect looking. This has to be AI. And, and so I'm 00:30:53.580 --> 00:30:59.300 like doubting everything I'm watching because of what AI is doing. And I think people are going to get 00:30:59.300 --> 00:31:03.040 really sick and tired of it really quick. And they're going to come back to say, Hey, 00:31:03.640 --> 00:31:10.400 I need someone who's going to be real with me. I do like, I go on walks a lot at my, around my 00:31:10.400 --> 00:31:16.640 neighborhood. And I feel like God speaks to me during those walks. And I'll come back during, 00:31:17.020 --> 00:31:21.940 after one of those walks and I'll jot down some notes and I'll be, I'll get right in front of my 00:31:21.940 --> 00:31:26.160 camera right there and say, I'm going to do a quick little devotional. It's only five or six minutes. 00:31:26.160 --> 00:31:33.660 I'll do this devotional, but I'll cry sometimes. I'll stutter sometimes, but the reality is that 00:31:33.660 --> 00:31:39.360 people, it will connect with people because they can relate to that and they can understand that. 00:31:39.800 --> 00:31:42.780 And I feel like that's what they want. They want to be able to connect with you. 00:31:43.240 --> 00:31:44.720 They don't need your production, man. 00:31:45.000 --> 00:31:50.260 Yeah. That's, that's some great insight there. Um, you know, I, I feel the tension of, 00:31:50.260 --> 00:31:55.280 of quality versus quantity. I do. Um, you know, I, I'm, I'm wearing my yellow hat to represent the 00:31:55.280 --> 00:31:59.540 church digital. I could very easily, my resi hats literally right there. And so I can swap that out 00:31:59.540 --> 00:32:04.100 and, and quality is hugely important when you're broadcasting your online church services and like 00:32:04.100 --> 00:32:08.540 things like that, you know, it's, it's an important for me to, to wrap, but you know, I think you, 00:32:08.660 --> 00:32:13.260 but just like, you know, you swap hats, you just, I think there's, there's different times for, 00:32:13.260 --> 00:32:19.580 for different seasons. And if everything has to go through the rigmarole of, of, um, quality, 00:32:19.580 --> 00:32:24.680 then you're not, you're going to lose that authenticity piece. And so I, I think that's, 00:32:25.040 --> 00:32:28.180 that's, that's a wise takeaway from that. And so, you know, Tom, we're going to get into, 00:32:28.180 --> 00:32:33.380 um, you know, shorts. Uh, well, I mean, I'm going to, let's, you know, even just ask that up front. 00:32:33.380 --> 00:32:38.240 So if we're talking shorts, cause you're, you're on the front lines here and you've, you've grown 00:32:38.240 --> 00:32:46.460 your, your, your subscriber base significantly. Are you looking at, um, like shorts wise, is this 00:32:46.460 --> 00:32:53.480 original content that's shot by you shot by others? Are you taking like edits of the sermon? Like 00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:58.200 where are you getting your content from to make these shorts? Yeah. So it's a variety of different 00:32:58.200 --> 00:33:05.400 things. So most of its original content where if, if we're doing a devotional based, we give the 00:33:05.400 --> 00:33:11.360 people the scripture and we give them the freedom to say, Hey, pick a point out of this scripture that 00:33:11.360 --> 00:33:17.540 you want to talk about so that we can then send it. And then they send it to me. If it's over a 00:33:17.540 --> 00:33:22.580 minute, you know, with shorts, like it can't be over a minute. If it's one Oh one, it doesn't count 00:33:22.580 --> 00:33:29.120 as a short on YouTube. It has to be exactly one minute or under. And so, um, they send it to me. 00:33:29.240 --> 00:33:32.800 I'll sometimes edit it a little bit, maybe take out something if it's a little bit longer, 00:33:32.800 --> 00:33:40.500 but then I'll just post it on YouTube and share it. Um, uh, I like to share our devotionals at 00:33:40.500 --> 00:33:46.440 midnight of that day. So at 12 o'clock in the morning, so that by the time I wake up, 00:33:46.620 --> 00:33:51.200 people are already being encouraged in their faith and you can kind of see the view count. 00:33:51.760 --> 00:33:58.180 Um, but then other shorts that I like to do are, we will do some funny shorts every now and then. 00:33:58.180 --> 00:34:02.540 And if there's a, if there is a trend, I did say that we don't always do trends, but if there's a 00:34:02.540 --> 00:34:06.480 trend out there that people are like enjoying, sometimes I'll get some people together and we'll 00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:12.220 do it together. And I'll either have the videographer put it together in a short or I'll do it. 00:34:12.320 --> 00:34:19.740 But then the other one that we like to do is take our sermons and I take our sermons and 00:34:19.740 --> 00:34:25.660 I come up in the longer form kind of times, like two to three minutes, but then I'll also 00:34:25.660 --> 00:34:33.280 look for ones that I can do like one minute shorts and share those. And I tend to share those 00:34:33.280 --> 00:34:41.540 in the afternoon times as a way to kind of offset the morning devotional short that I send out. 00:34:41.740 --> 00:34:48.340 I'll send it these, um, these sermonettes and, uh, post it on there and encourage people to go 00:34:48.340 --> 00:34:54.860 watch the full video. Yeah. This is, this isn't interesting. Now what's the balance between 00:34:54.860 --> 00:35:03.620 a sermon? Um, like how many of the sermon cuts do you do versus how many of the, of the devotional 00:35:03.620 --> 00:35:08.680 thoughts? So we do a devotional thought every single day. I mean, we've been doing them 00:35:08.680 --> 00:35:15.300 every single day and we'll continue to push those out. The sermon ones we do probably about like two, 00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:22.100 maybe sometimes three a week. Um, and what I do is I'll listen to the sermon, take notes on it. 00:35:22.100 --> 00:35:27.920 And then after Sunday, Sunday afternoon, I'll start cutting it up and then kind of scheduling 00:35:27.920 --> 00:35:33.580 out times where I can share those, those sermon clips out and, you know, the shorts out as well. 00:35:34.420 --> 00:35:39.140 Yeah. I mean, I love this because you, you've already balanced through the, the, the tension 00:35:39.140 --> 00:35:45.740 of, uh, content outside of the weekend service, you know, so often, you know, there's so much 00:35:45.740 --> 00:35:50.260 energy that goes into the weekend service and let's figure out how to maximize that. And so you're 00:35:50.260 --> 00:35:56.960 wanting to, to use more and more of that. Um, but you've already looked at doing original content, 00:35:56.960 --> 00:36:05.620 um, for your online utilizing, um, the, uh, devotional thought. Like, was that a, was that 00:36:05.620 --> 00:36:12.640 a hard conversation? Um, do, do you run kind of administration on that? Trying to schedule people 00:36:12.640 --> 00:36:16.760 like what's, what's maybe the responsibility of that looks like? So you're working with volunteers 00:36:16.760 --> 00:36:20.960 now at this point, right? Like there's, there's going to be struggles I would imagine, uh, in 00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:26.880 addition to joys, like talk to me a little bit about that. Yeah. So what I ended up doing was 00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:34.740 I created a Google sheet and then I kind of mapped out the, the, um, the, the scriptures that I wanted 00:36:34.740 --> 00:36:40.300 people to use. And so some, some of these ones that we did, like right now we're in the midst of a Bible 00:36:40.300 --> 00:36:47.280 on a year plan. So I've mapped out all the scriptures for the whole entire year. Um, but then there have 00:36:47.280 --> 00:36:54.420 been other times when I do like a one month or two month series and I'll still map it out, put it in a 00:36:54.420 --> 00:37:02.700 Google sheet and then I'll talk about the scripture and I'll have people sign up. And the, at first I 00:37:02.700 --> 00:37:09.020 was a little bit more strict on who I wanted to sign up for it. And so I only asked a few people, 00:37:09.220 --> 00:37:15.300 but then as we got in a rhythm of doing it, I started asking those people, okay, who would 00:37:15.300 --> 00:37:21.760 we ask now? Who else could we ask? And what has been really kind of cool, Jeff, is that 00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:27.760 our lead pastor, we have a teaching team, but we're always looking to expand our teaching team on Sunday 00:37:27.760 --> 00:37:35.120 mornings. And so what our lead pastor has done is he's used these shorts and even these longer form 00:37:35.120 --> 00:37:42.380 devotionals that they can come up with and use it as a, almost like a primer for, okay, can these people 00:37:42.380 --> 00:37:49.900 do sermons on Sunday morning? Well, could they be a part of the teaching team? And so we've used it as 00:37:49.900 --> 00:37:56.620 almost like a testing ground for them as well to, for them to get to, you know, practice, uh, giving a 00:37:56.620 --> 00:38:02.040 message and collecting some thoughts together. And, and we'll use that as kind of a reference point of 00:38:02.040 --> 00:38:05.540 like, Hey, listen, is this person getting better with sharing the content? 00:38:07.000 --> 00:38:14.140 Very, very cool. So who's, um, so are people like, are you just saying out to the audience at church? 00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:20.440 Hey, like if you're interested, sign up, are you handpicking people? Uh, it sounds like handpicking 00:38:20.440 --> 00:38:24.080 people's part of it, but like as a general rule, how are you finding people? 00:38:25.000 --> 00:38:30.680 Yeah. Again, we do want to be like, again, where I think people appreciate authenticity and whatnot. 00:38:30.940 --> 00:38:36.800 We were, we're handpicking people more so than asking in general. So we're not making this a Sunday 00:38:36.800 --> 00:38:42.120 morning announcement or anything like that. But again, if, if it's someone that we feel like, Hey, 00:38:42.120 --> 00:38:47.780 this person's been growing in Christ, we'd like for them to share them. Then I'll ask them. And then I 00:38:47.780 --> 00:38:53.720 have a list, like a list of criteria. Hey, when you're recording a short, we want you to record 00:38:53.720 --> 00:38:59.100 it vertically. We need you to keep it 30 seconds long. We want to make sure that you have appropriate 00:38:59.100 --> 00:39:05.500 lighting. It could be daytime lighting, or it could be the, uh, um, a ring camera, ring camera light 00:39:05.500 --> 00:39:10.620 kind of deal. And so I give them a list of about five or six bullet points for them to consider. 00:39:10.880 --> 00:39:18.480 And then I'll have them submit it to me at least two days prior to when it's supposed to go live 00:39:18.480 --> 00:39:24.340 so that I can look over it and take it, take a look at it. And if I, if I'm like, ah, this one's not 00:39:24.340 --> 00:39:31.040 quite, you know, good, you know, we'd love for you to try it again. We'll ask them to resubmit it. 00:39:31.100 --> 00:39:40.060 Okay. Now, what, what I'm not hearing is what I'm hearing is YouTube. What I'm not hearing is 00:39:40.060 --> 00:39:45.500 YouTube. And then we post it on Instagram and we post it on Facebook and we post it on TikTok. 00:39:46.020 --> 00:39:52.840 Are you, uh, are you only isolating these shorts on YouTube? Are you omni-channel approach and 00:39:52.840 --> 00:39:56.800 putting it on other channels? Like what's your, what's your distribution strategy? 00:39:57.640 --> 00:40:04.420 Yeah, we're omni-channel where our, our, what we can, what we care most about is YouTube, 00:40:04.420 --> 00:40:10.780 but we also post it on Instagram reels and we do put it on TikTok. Occasionally we'll put it on 00:40:10.780 --> 00:40:16.440 Twitter just as a, Hey, here's a little quick encouragement for you. Occasionally we'll put 00:40:16.440 --> 00:40:23.320 it on Facebook, but again, it's primarily YouTube. Um, then we, we also share on TikTok and reels. 00:40:23.640 --> 00:40:31.680 What's engagement like on, I mean, Instagram is, uh, there's a ton of people on IG, uh, TikTok. I mean, 00:40:31.680 --> 00:40:35.160 obviously there's, there's a ton of people there. It may not be your typical audience, but they're 00:40:35.160 --> 00:40:41.640 there. Um, what's been receptivity on an engagement looks like on some of those other platforms compared 00:40:41.640 --> 00:40:46.820 to YouTube? Cause it sounds like you're favoring YouTube. I'm kind of curious why compared to some 00:40:46.820 --> 00:40:54.120 of the others. We we've seen the most significant growth and the most comments on YouTube on TikTok 00:40:54.120 --> 00:41:00.140 and Instagram, we get likes, but we don't get a lot of engagement. You know, we don't get people 00:41:00.140 --> 00:41:06.940 chatting or anything like that. Whereas on YouTube we'll get the trolls, you know, and we'll get, 00:41:06.940 --> 00:41:15.600 you know, that, but here's the other thing with YouTube that makes us what makes my focus most is 00:41:15.600 --> 00:41:22.740 that YouTube really is evergreen content. Whereas you can scroll through stuff on TikTok and reels, 00:41:22.880 --> 00:41:27.480 but you're not going to see something that was posted a year ago or two years ago. 00:41:27.640 --> 00:41:35.400 We have a video, uh, and this was one of our shorts on a random passage in Genesis that want, 00:41:35.580 --> 00:41:42.460 that our crew, our communications director did. She did it. We still get comments today. Like in fact, 00:41:42.520 --> 00:41:47.940 yesterday we got a comment on the video that she did two years ago. And that's the thing why I, 00:41:47.940 --> 00:41:54.580 I really value YouTube more is because the content is evergreen. We'll see stuff. I even see digital 00:41:54.580 --> 00:42:00.860 shorts that we've done on the church digital dating back from a few weeks ago. YouTube's going to give 00:42:00.860 --> 00:42:05.960 you what you're looking for. And they have so many videos that they can choose from that they can 00:42:05.960 --> 00:42:11.340 serve you. Whereas I feel like TikTok and reels, they don't do that. It's more TikTok and reels is more 00:42:11.340 --> 00:42:17.000 in the here and now. Yeah. I mean, that's true. I'm actually, I'm looking at that on TCD analytics, 00:42:17.000 --> 00:42:24.260 just even to quantify that, um, 60% of people come off the shorts feed. So that's giving you what's new. 00:42:24.580 --> 00:42:34.920 Um, 17, 18% is browser feature, um, which is, uh, people are looking for something. And so 17%, 00:42:34.920 --> 00:42:41.740 um, or, of views are off of that. Um, 7% are external. That would be like the embed codes on 00:42:41.740 --> 00:42:48.480 blogs and, and, uh, our podcast pages and stuff like that, which is significant. Uh, 5% on channel 00:42:48.480 --> 00:42:56.080 pages, um, and then 11% zero. So between, uh, channel pages and browser, you're looking at 23% 00:42:56.080 --> 00:43:03.900 of views are coming from methods that is the viewer looking for information as opposed to the system 00:43:03.900 --> 00:43:09.640 pushing it. Um, you know, and really, I mean, that's why systematically, I think YouTube is such a 00:43:09.640 --> 00:43:15.820 powerful channel, uh, powerful platform. It's, it's, I don't think it's old news, but you know, 00:43:15.820 --> 00:43:21.440 YouTube obviously is owned by Google, but if you Google right now is the largest search engine on 00:43:21.440 --> 00:43:27.100 the planet. But if you were to separate Google and YouTube, um, YouTube would be the second largest 00:43:27.100 --> 00:43:33.360 search engine on the planet. Like the number of searches that people do on YouTube to find something, 00:43:33.360 --> 00:43:40.980 to do something, um, is, uh, is, um, astronomical much more than whatever number three is like, 00:43:40.980 --> 00:43:46.200 and I don't even know if YouTube, YouTube, that's funny. If Yahoo is number three, I'm not sure who 00:43:46.200 --> 00:43:52.120 number three is in that equation, but because the, the one, two punch of YouTube and Google is just so 00:43:52.120 --> 00:44:01.480 high. Um, do you, as you look at, um, you know, just even talking about that, have you done any work 00:44:01.480 --> 00:44:09.080 and I'm genuinely asking this with like SEO or ads, um, the Google ad grant, like, have you tried to 00:44:09.080 --> 00:44:14.740 balance any of that towards YouTube or, or what, what has a new life been thinking or doing in that 00:44:14.740 --> 00:44:22.320 space? We, truthfully, we have not, uh, we've talked about YouTube ads for a while now. We just 00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:28.900 have not pulled the trigger on it, but again, we're, we're, we love it so much. I don't know why we 00:44:28.900 --> 00:44:33.380 haven't pulled the trigger. And partly it's my blame. I mean, we should be pulling the trigger on, 00:44:33.480 --> 00:44:37.060 on YouTube ads. Uh, it just, it just hasn't happened. 00:44:37.180 --> 00:44:41.820 No, I, I can feel that pain. Uh, and you know, a lot of times churches get, you know, neck deep in 00:44:41.820 --> 00:44:47.980 day to day and week to week, uh, towards that. I ask cause I've, I've recently started, um, a friend, 00:44:48.120 --> 00:44:52.680 a new friendship with, uh, some organizations that are in that space. And so to be honest, I'm looking 00:44:52.680 --> 00:44:57.520 for some Guinea pigs, uh, to work with. And so if you're interested, uh, if anybody's interested in 00:44:57.520 --> 00:45:04.580 that evidently Tom is, as he's pointing at himself on YouTube, um, feel free to, uh, to hit me up and 00:45:04.580 --> 00:45:08.080 we, we can have that conversation. My phone, my phone number, you can text me four, eight, four, 00:45:08.220 --> 00:45:19.000 three, two, four, eight, seven, two, four. Well, um, Tom, do you like, I know Tom, you're relatively new 00:45:19.000 --> 00:45:27.480 to, um, uh, what am I saying here to a Riverside to the platform? We, we, you know, we got you over 00:45:27.480 --> 00:45:31.940 here. You were, you were one of the holdouts within the podcast network and, and we're glad 00:45:31.940 --> 00:45:38.260 to get you officially on board, uh, with, with Riverside. But, um, have you toyed much with the 00:45:38.260 --> 00:45:44.520 AI on there in, in creating shorts with, uh, with the videos or, um, like what, what's been some 00:45:44.520 --> 00:45:48.480 experience falling back on AI to even create some of this, uh, short content for you? 00:45:49.000 --> 00:45:56.080 Yeah. So, I mean, the reality is that we have a podcast at our church and because of 00:45:56.080 --> 00:46:02.360 Riverside and because of Jeff, you pushing me to explore this more, we've gone all in on 00:46:02.360 --> 00:46:06.840 Riverside and we're recording the podcast on Riverside. And the beautiful thing about it 00:46:06.840 --> 00:46:13.120 is again, the, the, the, the clincher for me was the fact that it was able to create shorts 00:46:13.120 --> 00:46:18.480 just like that for me. And, you know, we, I get done with an interview with someone from 00:46:18.480 --> 00:46:24.640 our church, give it a few minutes. I hit the magic clip button and automatically they come 00:46:24.640 --> 00:46:30.240 up with like four or five clips for me to use that I can post on social media as a way to 00:46:30.240 --> 00:46:36.060 encourage people to check out this podcast episode that we're talking about. So, I mean, yes, 00:46:36.600 --> 00:46:45.140 it, it, the, having a platform that can help you create the shorts with using AI is invaluable. 00:46:45.140 --> 00:46:51.540 It really, truly is amazing. And the quality is great. So yeah, I highly recommend something like 00:46:51.540 --> 00:46:56.660 that. Yeah. It's Riverside has been a phenomenal and just even within the past 00:46:56.660 --> 00:47:03.280 six months, I mean, we, we've had a sponsorship with Riverside, uh, the church digital has going this 00:47:03.280 --> 00:47:11.520 year. And it's, it's incredible to me how much they've improved the software, how much, not that it 00:47:11.520 --> 00:47:17.780 was bad before, but, but like when we're talking, uh, feature upgrades and, and, and development roadmaps 00:47:17.780 --> 00:47:22.820 and like what they're, what they're doing to the platform is incredible. Um, and they just signed a 00:47:22.820 --> 00:47:30.720 deal with a Spotify podcast that, you know, now, yeah. So now Spotify is in anchor. Like you can't 00:47:30.720 --> 00:47:36.620 anchor used to have in Spotify used to have a podcast editing software built into their platform. 00:47:37.620 --> 00:47:43.660 And, um, I think effective June, um, they're shutting that down entirely. And instead they're 00:47:43.660 --> 00:47:48.780 driving everybody to Riverside. And so if you want to like edit your podcast now and you put in, you edit 00:47:48.780 --> 00:47:55.440 through, um, and you, you distribute through Spotify or anchor, like it's now, it's now all Riverside. 00:47:55.720 --> 00:48:00.120 And so like, I, you know, I don't know what venture capitalists has been funding or what money looks 00:48:00.120 --> 00:48:05.400 like for those guys, but they are, they're, they're going for it. And, uh, some of the AI additions, 00:48:05.940 --> 00:48:11.240 some of the, um, this is, this is, this is fun, Tom, but it's been really cool. Even on the shorts, 00:48:11.280 --> 00:48:15.660 it's been cool. But I don't know if you saw this feature yet, Tom. Um, you may not get it yet 00:48:15.660 --> 00:48:22.020 because I don't know what you've got the library built up, but I've got, you know, I've got 150, 00:48:22.180 --> 00:48:28.840 200 episodes worth of podcast material in Riverside. And so like, it, it knows me very well. Um, so much 00:48:28.840 --> 00:48:36.320 so that I have, uh, the ability now to have my voice in artificial intelligence. So I can now type 00:48:36.320 --> 00:48:45.320 whatever I want into Riverside and, um, artificial intelligence will make my voice say it back in, 00:48:45.320 --> 00:48:52.160 in a, in a audio file that can be placed on a podcast. Um, and I don't, I don't, I don't, 00:48:52.180 --> 00:48:57.560 I don't know that that's good or bad. I mean, as I saw that, I was like, I'm not sure how I feel 00:48:57.560 --> 00:49:03.960 about this, but, um, in the moment it's pretty cool. Uh, and so if, you know, if I wanted to get 00:49:03.960 --> 00:49:08.100 my Bart Simpson, Simpson voice on, or I don't know why Bart Simpson came to mind, I was going to say 00:49:08.100 --> 00:49:12.680 Superman, but, um, you know, which is DC. I don't know why that came to mind either. Forgive me. 00:49:13.220 --> 00:49:17.900 But, um, you know, the fact is, is that, you know, Riverside has been investing a lot. So if you're 00:49:17.900 --> 00:49:24.240 interested in more about, uh, Riverside, uh, check out the church.digital slash Riverside and that'll 00:49:24.240 --> 00:49:32.400 get you connected over to, uh, the nice people at Riverside. And so, well, Tom, um, as we're 00:49:32.400 --> 00:49:38.100 hacking up YouTube and trying to figure out how to get, uh, churches, uh, to utilize it better and 00:49:38.100 --> 00:49:44.360 improve, man, any other tips or tidbits or suggestions here? Yeah. I'm going to just say, 00:49:44.360 --> 00:49:50.980 just get started. The reality is your first video is you're going to look back five years 00:49:50.980 --> 00:49:58.100 from now and say, Oh my gosh, I can't believe we did that video. But it, you're only going to get 00:49:58.100 --> 00:50:04.320 better as you keep on doing it. The first videos I did, the first shorts I did, I look back and I'm 00:50:04.320 --> 00:50:10.640 cringe. I'm like, Oh, my hair was terrible. Like what was I doing with these baggy eyes? But the reality 00:50:10.640 --> 00:50:15.920 is that people are going to listen to those shorts or those devotionals or whatever you're producing 00:50:15.920 --> 00:50:21.780 and they're going to be encouraged in their faith. And again, as we're going out to seeking to make 00:50:21.780 --> 00:50:28.940 disciples of all nations, we can use YouTube that all people all over the world can hear the message 00:50:28.940 --> 00:50:34.860 and hope of Christ. The thing is we have to get out of our own way and just get started and just start 00:50:34.860 --> 00:50:38.700 experimenting with it, testing it out and seeing how God uses it. 00:50:39.900 --> 00:50:45.260 Yeah, it's, that's so true. It's, it's the version one is better than version none. You'll sit around 00:50:45.260 --> 00:50:52.120 and talk about how, um, you know, you want to be better. You need better assets and, um, but just, 00:50:52.240 --> 00:50:58.020 just get started. It's funny. I agree. Like, you know, we're on episode 298 of the podcast. Episode 300 00:50:58.020 --> 00:51:04.780 is a couple of weeks away. I'm actually filming it a week from yesterday. And, um, and, and so like 00:51:04.780 --> 00:51:11.840 super exciting, you know, landmark road mark ahead. Um, but the first, the first five podcast episodes 00:51:11.840 --> 00:51:18.260 we did were horrendous. Like, I mean, you can go back and listen to them. I don't even, I think they 00:51:18.260 --> 00:51:25.000 were so bad. I opted not to put the video on, on YouTube. Um, like it, it just was, was gross. And, 00:51:25.140 --> 00:51:28.920 uh, like, you know, and it just, it was, I mean, like one of the things was like the, the bookmark, 00:51:29.040 --> 00:51:34.160 the bookshelves behind me were empty. Like it just had crap. Like it just, it was just, you know, 00:51:34.200 --> 00:51:39.340 I, but it was, you know, uh, I tell the story all the time. Ray Diarmus was, was the voice in my 00:51:39.340 --> 00:51:43.420 head saying version one is better than version nine. Just, just do it, Jeff. Just do it, Jeff. Just do it. 00:51:43.420 --> 00:51:48.520 Just do it. Just do it. Just do it. And I finally was like, okay, that's fine. And so, 00:51:48.580 --> 00:51:54.480 yeah, we got better. Um, and version two is better than what version one was and version three is 00:51:54.480 --> 00:51:58.280 better. And we, you know, we've made, you know, slowly incremental changes over time instead of 00:51:58.280 --> 00:52:02.740 trying to get it perfection right out the door, you know, perfection out the door. It doesn't really 00:52:02.740 --> 00:52:09.380 exist digitally. Um, that's a, that's a physical limitation that a lot of us try to do. Hey, 00:52:09.380 --> 00:52:15.340 Cam, uh, Cam Huxford just walked in. You know, a lot of us try to do, uh, physical perfection. Um, 00:52:15.420 --> 00:52:21.580 but digitally it's much more about that connection rather than the perfection aspects of it. And so 00:52:21.580 --> 00:52:27.820 awesome. Well, Hey, Tom, as we're, uh, landing the plane here, maybe you want to talk about what 00:52:27.820 --> 00:52:31.960 you're doing with TCD sidekick and digital bootcamp and some of the other things that you're doing 00:52:31.960 --> 00:52:39.360 digitally. You know, with TCD sidekick, the podcast, I do episodes every other week. And what I like 00:52:39.360 --> 00:52:45.240 to do is just bring on people who have something that they're doing digitally, that they're really 00:52:45.240 --> 00:52:50.220 excited about and that God's doing, and really just talk about that. And so we usually send it around 00:52:50.220 --> 00:52:57.080 a topic of the, of the day, but, um, yeah, so we have that and those are short 30, 35 minute 00:52:57.080 --> 00:53:02.840 conversations where people can be encouraged in their digital ministry. Again, I feel like I'm the 00:53:02.840 --> 00:53:09.260 sidekick to this person who's sharing their, their story, how God's using that. Also with the church, 00:53:09.340 --> 00:53:15.040 digital blog. I mean, we've got some great blogs coming up and ways to encourage you in your digital 00:53:15.040 --> 00:53:19.700 ministry. I'm excited about different voices that are coming on, you know, Annie May shares, 00:53:20.020 --> 00:53:26.780 Jeff's got some stuff. Um, we've got other voices that are, are coming up where they're just sharing 00:53:26.780 --> 00:53:32.020 just practical things that you can do for your digital and online ministry, whether it's metaverse 00:53:32.020 --> 00:53:36.760 or online, you know, I'm excited about that kind of stuff. I'm excited about the learning communities 00:53:36.760 --> 00:53:42.200 that, that some of you guys are leading and those are like fantastic opportunities to grow. 00:53:42.920 --> 00:53:49.300 Again, the digital ministry community is so important because oftentimes we can feel so alone 00:53:49.300 --> 00:53:55.120 when you're part of a learning community, you, you realize, Hey, you're not alone. And there's other 00:53:55.120 --> 00:54:00.360 people experimenting and learning this stuff as well. So, you know, those are some of the things we, 00:54:00.560 --> 00:54:05.700 I get really passionate and excited about. Yeah. I love that. I, you know, I don't think I mentioned 00:54:05.700 --> 00:54:08.620 the learning community in this recording. So thank you for doing that. For more information 00:54:08.620 --> 00:54:15.120 on the learning community, check out, uh, the church.digital slash LC. We've got five different 00:54:15.120 --> 00:54:22.400 learning communities coming up. Um, I'm doing one on hybrid micro sites. Um, I know, uh, Andy Mage is 00:54:22.400 --> 00:54:28.280 doing one on asynchronous community. Barbara, uh, Carnero is doing one on digital communications. 00:54:28.620 --> 00:54:35.780 Megan Carter is doing one on, um, uh, mental health ministry and Stu, Stu Nami, Stuart McPherson's 00:54:35.780 --> 00:54:42.680 doing one on virtual reality, uh, ministry. And so all sorts of, um, opportunities to learn 00:54:42.680 --> 00:54:47.580 something different this summer and, uh, experiment, uh, with some people around you to help you 00:54:47.580 --> 00:54:53.840 guide you in those ways. So the church.digital slash LC, get more information on there. And Tom, 00:54:53.940 --> 00:54:59.900 the blog, the church.digital, the websites that, um, well, we're, we're, I think in the process of 00:54:59.900 --> 00:55:06.720 relaunching the blog this week, you know, we've, we've been, we launched a new website today. 00:55:06.720 --> 00:55:14.580 Okay. Today as a recording. So, um, you know, I know we're, we're moving to a, so many changes at 00:55:14.580 --> 00:55:18.700 the church digital, like in, in, in a normal organization, a normal bivocational organization, 00:55:18.820 --> 00:55:23.580 let's take it slow, but no, no, we're just, let's rip the bandaid off. We, we, we launched a, 00:55:23.680 --> 00:55:29.780 so we launched a new website, which made us launch into a new community. Um, we launched a new, um, 00:55:30.260 --> 00:55:34.900 which means we had to change our blogging system, uh, which means we had to, well, we didn't have to, 00:55:34.900 --> 00:55:39.800 but we also changed our CRM at the same time. And, uh, at the same time, our communications 00:55:39.800 --> 00:55:45.440 director decided to move to, uh, Portuguese, Portugal in Spain. And so she's on a different 00:55:45.440 --> 00:55:51.460 continent and, uh, yeah, it's just been, it's a little chaotic here, but, um, definitely some 00:55:51.460 --> 00:55:56.160 exciting things happening this summer. So check out Tom's blogs, uh, through the church digital 00:55:56.160 --> 00:56:03.960 at the church.digital. You can see all of them in their new website design glory there under the 00:56:03.960 --> 00:56:09.120 digital vault on the website. And so, well, dang, Tom, is there anything else I forgot to say? 00:56:09.440 --> 00:56:13.000 You're the best, Jeff. You're the best. That's all I have to say. 00:56:13.000 --> 00:56:18.420 Listen, I didn't, and I said this at the beginning and I'll say it at the end when, um, 00:56:19.000 --> 00:56:24.140 when I was trying to figure out who the crap I was after walking away from a church in 2018, 00:56:24.140 --> 00:56:31.540 you know, Tom was, um, one of several voices that reached out to me and said, Hey, you need to talk. 00:56:32.220 --> 00:56:37.500 And, uh, it was, uh, it was really meaningful. Um, you know, even, even back then, you know, 00:56:37.500 --> 00:56:42.940 before I met JMO, before I met Andy, before I met Barbara Layton, any of these guys, Tom was, 00:56:43.040 --> 00:56:49.220 um, um, like I said, one of the, the original voices. And, and to be honestly honest, he's probably 00:56:49.220 --> 00:56:53.640 been doing digital, at least church-based digital ministry a lot longer than I have. And so Tom, 00:56:53.720 --> 00:56:58.840 excited to have you part of the team and, uh, looking forward to what's next, but, uh, man, 00:56:58.840 --> 00:57:03.380 we're going to land the plane. So for Tom, this is Jeff with the church digital. Thanks for jumping 00:57:03.380 --> 00:57:05.740 up and on here. We'll see you next time on the show. Have a good one.