WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:10.520 all right hey we got episode 356 live recording here episode 356 of the church digital podcast 00:00:10.520 --> 00:00:15.680 jeff here excited i you know what i have been wanting to have this this conversation today 00:00:15.680 --> 00:00:22.640 i and if i were to say for months like that's not an exaggeration it just seems like every time i 00:00:22.640 --> 00:00:26.980 try to schedule a conversation and and the majority of time was my fault like i'm not 00:00:26.980 --> 00:00:33.720 i'm i'm not throwing uh jake under the under the bus here like just stuff always seemed to pop up 00:00:33.720 --> 00:00:40.260 and uh even today you know some stuff came up and i was like no i am not canceling on jake again we're 00:00:40.260 --> 00:00:45.740 gonna make this work and so i'm excited to bring jake carlson into the conversation from apologist 00:00:45.740 --> 00:00:51.640 project here in a minute but before i get there everybody quick heads up and this is not a quick 00:00:51.640 --> 00:00:55.960 heads up you may have heard of this small little thing we're doing uh called the digital missionary 00:00:55.960 --> 00:01:01.580 conference and so we did a conference back in april 1500 people from around the country around the 00:01:01.580 --> 00:01:07.360 world came in 85 countries registered to attend this thing was incredible 1100 people showed up day of 00:01:07.360 --> 00:01:13.640 we had so much so much success and so much interest and so much excitement in this thing uh we did it 00:01:13.640 --> 00:01:17.980 another time we're doing it coming up here in september and october as a matter of fact maybe we went a 00:01:17.980 --> 00:01:25.080 little crazy we're doing four conferences in four subsequent weeks yeah okay it is a little crazy but the good 00:01:25.080 --> 00:01:32.240 news is you get plenty of insight coming up in september october here's the deal we're doing four 00:01:32.240 --> 00:01:38.100 conferences the first one september 17th digital neighborhoods digital discipleship digital church 00:01:38.100 --> 00:01:44.640 planting digital cultures in these platforms this is what we're going to get talking about in the 00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:51.820 september 17th digital neighborhoods conference digital uh september 24th it's going to be uh control 00:01:51.820 --> 00:01:58.740 art recover what is uh what does recovery look like in digital and virtual spaces october 1st is all 00:01:58.740 --> 00:02:05.620 about our european friends the european digital missionary summit and then october 8th is going to be 00:02:05.620 --> 00:02:12.300 the gaming summit and so everything centered around church inside video games church and discord 00:02:12.300 --> 00:02:20.420 being missional in digital excuse me in gaming spaces and using gaming tools inside gaming culture 00:02:20.420 --> 00:02:27.480 some really fascinating opportunities coming up listen with the first conference conference we went really 00:02:27.480 --> 00:02:33.840 big and we tried to do something for everybody and here with uh with these conferences coming up with these 00:02:33.840 --> 00:02:42.280 summits we're making it much more niched much more nuanced to be very specific for individuals so if you're 00:02:42.280 --> 00:02:48.300 someone that's that's interested in understanding how to be a digital missionary that's the september 00:02:48.300 --> 00:02:55.580 17th one neighborhoods if you're curious um how recovery looks like and and how to do ministry 00:02:55.580 --> 00:03:01.720 with people that are struggling with addiction and digital spaces well that's control out recover if you're in on the 00:03:01.720 --> 00:03:08.800 24th if you're in europe and are curious what god is doing digitally in europe well you got to come to 00:03:08.800 --> 00:03:14.420 the october 1st one and then if you're interested at all in reaching people in gaming spaces come to the 00:03:14.420 --> 00:03:21.460 october 8th more information on all of this is going to be on the website missionary dot digital 00:03:21.460 --> 00:03:25.660 www dot missionary dot digital so if you haven't registered yet 00:03:25.660 --> 00:03:32.740 go register and then the next thing i need you to do real quick go to the website share 00:03:32.740 --> 00:03:39.820 s-h-a-r-e dot missionary dot digital we need your help to get the word out on these conferences and 00:03:39.820 --> 00:03:47.540 we would love you to grab some graphics uh post them on social media post them in the digital communities 00:03:47.540 --> 00:03:54.260 post them in the places where you hang out digitally and virtually and invite people to join you uh for 00:03:54.260 --> 00:03:59.040 these conferences what we're discovering more and more is that the the type of people that we're 00:03:59.040 --> 00:04:05.440 training to be digital missionaries are not seminary trained they're just normal people and so how many 00:04:05.440 --> 00:04:11.380 normal people do you know that might be interested in being a digital missionary and sharing jesus 00:04:11.380 --> 00:04:17.820 online what a great concept maybe you can invite someone to these conferences so that they can maybe 00:04:17.820 --> 00:04:23.860 discover a digital calling and and start to help you even doing ministry as as god has called you to 00:04:23.860 --> 00:04:32.560 as well so more information at the w website www dot missionary dot digital for the conferences and the media 00:04:32.560 --> 00:04:41.480 kits where you can share all the graphics at the website share s-h-a-r-e dot missionary dot digital 00:04:41.480 --> 00:04:48.580 well i you know what i always hate the uh the announcement part of this because i got to talk really fast get all the 00:04:48.580 --> 00:04:53.720 info in because i really don't want to like disrespect the guests and and uh what's coming up here in the 00:04:53.720 --> 00:05:01.620 conversation and so i'm excited here to push a button and bring on jake carlson who is the uh founder 00:05:01.620 --> 00:05:07.660 of of apologist project and so jake once again thank you for for jumping on the show 00:05:07.660 --> 00:05:13.480 yeah absolutely it's great to be here jeff i i gotta tell you just right off the bat i was always 00:05:13.480 --> 00:05:19.620 talking to to jake off air and seeing the drum kit right right behind him is is like that is just an 00:05:19.620 --> 00:05:26.640 awesome reveal it's an awesome backdrop uh my son last night he was playing his bass guitar through 00:05:26.640 --> 00:05:34.180 the bass amp it was kind of reverberating the the windows here and i was i was i was happy i i love me 00:05:34.180 --> 00:05:40.920 a subwoofer like that's that's my happy place i'm so happy my son chose on his own to play bass guitar 00:05:40.920 --> 00:05:46.760 because it's my favorite instrument by far but if he would have brought home a uh a drum kit and said 00:05:46.760 --> 00:05:53.500 daddy i want to play this i think he'd be sleeping somewhere else so is is that is this your drum kit 00:05:53.500 --> 00:05:58.920 or is this someone else's like what's the story yeah so this is my kit it's actually um uh not to get 00:05:58.920 --> 00:06:03.400 too geeky on it but it's it's basically uh it's an electronic kit but it's meant to look like an 00:06:03.400 --> 00:06:08.060 acoustic kit so it's got you know full volume you know uh drums and everything like that and the heads 00:06:08.060 --> 00:06:12.160 and all the rest but it's it's fully digital and i can i can play like rhythm games with it and stuff 00:06:12.160 --> 00:06:17.000 like that so it's actually awesome yeah i said now that i look i see the brain for the electric drum 00:06:17.000 --> 00:06:23.900 kit over you right over your shoulder right there so very cool i i it looks so um authentic i guess 00:06:23.900 --> 00:06:28.520 is the right word it didn't even occur to me it was a digital and and i i like i work with that stuff 00:06:28.520 --> 00:06:33.080 for like a living and so congratulations you faked me out there a little bit you know i do see some 00:06:33.080 --> 00:06:39.960 of the cables coming off like underneath the the um the yeah so okay all right you you you uh you pulled 00:06:39.960 --> 00:06:45.680 it over on me very cool well hey jake let's let's let's dig in here uh you know i we do want to get 00:06:45.680 --> 00:06:54.300 into apologist apologist ai is doing some uh incredible work sharing jesus online artificial intelligence 00:06:54.300 --> 00:06:58.340 like we're going to get into this here in a little bit but jake maybe back up a little bit 00:06:58.340 --> 00:07:04.200 apologist project like how did you get here founding this organization what's the calling 00:07:04.200 --> 00:07:09.960 what's the story like like give us some background yeah absolutely so um i actually grew up as a 00:07:09.960 --> 00:07:15.460 missionary kid in china um and so obviously saw my parents you know kind of witnessing there through 00:07:15.460 --> 00:07:20.820 you know english camps and various other means um and so i kind of got the bug early on for for 00:07:20.820 --> 00:07:25.320 evangelism um and growing up i went to actually a private christian school over over in china with 00:07:25.320 --> 00:07:31.400 american curriculum and um through that you know had you know worldview studies and so forth so got really 00:07:31.400 --> 00:07:37.000 interested in apologetics specifically and for uh anyone who's not aware what apologetics is sometimes i 00:07:37.000 --> 00:07:42.760 have to explain it but basically it's not apologizing for things but it's it's essentially having a reasoned 00:07:42.760 --> 00:07:48.280 kind of defense a rational defense for the christian faith right because i'm sure as uh most of your 00:07:48.280 --> 00:07:55.960 listeners are aware um we would say christianity is um is it doesn't conflict with reason right it actually 00:07:55.960 --> 00:08:01.400 um has a cohesive um revelation for that for a cohesive kind of worldview and everything like that 00:08:01.400 --> 00:08:07.080 so anyway so coming out of uh high school and early college was really interested in apologetics 00:08:07.080 --> 00:08:11.560 and way back then and you know kind of 2001 i'm kind of dating myself a little bit here but 00:08:11.560 --> 00:08:19.880 um uh nascent stages of the internet saw a lot of philosophical discourse but primarily the earlier 00:08:19.880 --> 00:08:25.000 adopters on the internet um with some exceptions were kind of more of a naturalistic philosophy and so 00:08:25.560 --> 00:08:31.640 i made myself a promise and also a promise to god during that time uh 20-25 years ago that i would 00:08:31.640 --> 00:08:38.120 one day raise on some kind of digital platform for apologetics um so way back then got apologist.com and 00:08:38.120 --> 00:08:45.160 kept it to this day you know and um fast forward a little bit i had a career um about 20-25 years 00:08:45.160 --> 00:08:49.560 in technology working for a bunch of startups and also some big tech companies like oracle and apple 00:08:50.280 --> 00:08:57.160 um and i've been waiting for a chance i shouldn't say waiting i should say uh i've been um a little 00:08:57.160 --> 00:09:05.160 derelict in my promise to the lord a little bit and um but back in 2023 i finally you know thought you 00:09:05.160 --> 00:09:11.720 know now's the time um i had just left my most recent startup at that point and uh chad gpt was taking 00:09:11.720 --> 00:09:17.800 over the world by storm with conversational ai and i thought to myself this is this is too big of a 00:09:17.800 --> 00:09:23.480 opportunity to ignore we have to use conversational ai to fulfill the great commission or at least help 00:09:23.480 --> 00:09:31.000 fulfill the great commission as a tool and so um in 2023 um started up the non-profit um we did a quick 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:37.000 prototype went to a hackathon that went pretty well um and since then you know we've um i'll get into 00:09:37.000 --> 00:09:40.680 kind of the more details of the product and stuff and everything like that a little bit later in the 00:09:40.680 --> 00:09:45.480 program but um suffice it to say you know we've been kind of growing and and partnering with various 00:09:45.480 --> 00:09:50.200 ministries and and trying to spread the kingdom any way we can by melding kind of my technology 00:09:50.200 --> 00:09:56.760 background with my you know desire to see the the great commission fulfilled yeah i i love the line 00:09:56.760 --> 00:10:02.920 of being derelict where it's like you were you you had the calling and then it got you know shuffled 00:10:02.920 --> 00:10:09.480 under the bed and priorities kind of kicked in i i'm i'm gonna be a little uh aggressive here do you mind 00:10:09.480 --> 00:10:16.200 telling this the story or or what that was like what was the wake-up call for you um you know i don't know 00:10:16.200 --> 00:10:20.920 there was a there was a moment in time per se that you know i got hit upside the head it was more like 00:10:20.920 --> 00:10:28.520 um that was during the the tech layoffs and so um i i think that that timing was uh god kind 00:10:28.520 --> 00:10:33.160 of giving me a kick in the butt saying like okay like yeah you're looking for a new job but you know 00:10:33.160 --> 00:10:37.400 there's this thing that you've you know i tried to like every decade i would like spin up like a 00:10:37.400 --> 00:10:40.920 new like project and like try to start it and stuff like that but something would get in the way 00:10:41.560 --> 00:10:46.760 and so i think that that exact timing you know god's timing is perfect and so i think i think 00:10:46.760 --> 00:10:53.240 that was his little nudge saying like okay what's your excuse now go do it i love that ran out of 00:10:53.240 --> 00:11:00.840 excuses well let's let's dig in here a little bit um talk to us about specifically what apologist 00:11:00.840 --> 00:11:07.800 project apologist ai what what are we looking at here yeah so essentially we build conversational 00:11:07.800 --> 00:11:14.120 ais for christian evangelism and discipleship um and what that looks like i kind of go through the 00:11:14.120 --> 00:11:19.320 history a little bit but but what it initially looked like is hey can we build a conversational ai 00:11:19.320 --> 00:11:24.520 that you know somebody could go to just like chat gpt to ask a question and get a response from a 00:11:24.520 --> 00:11:30.520 christian worldview rather than you know secular bias um so that's kind of how we started right and then 00:11:30.520 --> 00:11:35.160 there's been a bit of an evolution to the point where you know somewhere in 2024 kind of a year 00:11:35.160 --> 00:11:39.640 or year and a half into it um we kind of have an epiphany where it's like well you could have one 00:11:39.640 --> 00:11:45.320 chat bot and that that's great but that's not how that's not how best to contextualize the gospel you 00:11:45.320 --> 00:11:52.840 need you actually need several or you know dozens or whatever um purpose-built conversational ai's 00:11:52.840 --> 00:11:58.440 that minister to a particular demographic right so it is very different it's a very different thing to minister to 00:11:58.440 --> 00:12:05.640 a you know a western atheist than it is to you know a middle eastern muslim right that's a that's a 00:12:05.640 --> 00:12:10.280 completely different kettle of fish and so you know you you hearken back to things like you know paul 00:12:10.280 --> 00:12:14.360 at mars hill right like if you if you understand remember that story like in athens like he's he's 00:12:14.360 --> 00:12:19.320 talking to the greeks right and he's you know he's using kind of philosophical terms and saying and 00:12:19.320 --> 00:12:25.240 you and playing off of their situation and they're kind of um you know their their situation in terms of you 00:12:25.240 --> 00:12:31.480 know polytheism and so forth and so you know in the same way we're able to create kind of bespoke 00:12:32.040 --> 00:12:39.560 um uh agents that will be programmed in such a way that will minister to a particular people group 00:12:39.560 --> 00:12:44.760 and and kind of use language that they would be more familiar with not only when i say language i'm 00:12:44.760 --> 00:12:49.640 not just talking about like the spoken language but also the vocabulary itself right so for example 00:12:49.640 --> 00:12:54.920 for for a muslim seeker you know we use the word isa instead of jesus right because that's that's the 00:12:54.920 --> 00:13:00.360 the muslim term for the prophet jesus right and so um and then in a similar way we're able to kind of 00:13:00.360 --> 00:13:06.760 loop in quranic verses by by saying like hey like this is what the quran says about jesus hey check this 00:13:06.760 --> 00:13:10.520 out like that actually loops into what the bible says and here's you know here's a comparison or 00:13:10.520 --> 00:13:16.520 contrast or whatever and so that epiphany kind of in mid 2024 kind of set us on a course where we're no 00:13:19.640 --> 00:13:25.320 people can go to but we're actually a platform whereby missional organizations can create their 00:13:25.320 --> 00:13:30.680 own um their own bespoke conversational ai's administered to the people that they that they 00:13:30.680 --> 00:13:37.160 want to um and so we can kind of plug in to their their um you know media to movement uh kind of 00:13:37.160 --> 00:13:41.720 workflows or or any kind of situation that they want to plug into their their digital strategy we 00:13:41.720 --> 00:13:46.920 can kind of plug in with integrations and so forth as well yeah there's i mean there's so much 00:13:47.720 --> 00:13:53.160 in what you said right there but let's uh let's back up and and chew chew away at some of it so 00:13:54.040 --> 00:14:01.960 you are you've created an ai a specific multiple ai agents that adapt to different global cultures 00:14:01.960 --> 00:14:08.600 you know you're talking about the the muslims speaking isa instead of uh in jesus and and using 00:14:08.600 --> 00:14:17.560 more language that is more not necessarily um you know dictionary correct but more comfortable in in 00:14:17.560 --> 00:14:26.440 the modern cultures of that like um how how was that trying to get the ai to adapt to uh different 00:14:26.440 --> 00:14:31.400 cultures shaping away from just you know a lot of times when i work with ai it's it's mostly 00:14:32.040 --> 00:14:36.520 general think like from a from a religious standpoint from a practical standpoint from a 00:14:36.520 --> 00:14:42.280 language standpoint like you know i know you can can tailor to an individual but you're talking all 00:14:42.280 --> 00:14:47.320 all these different cultures and everything and what was that experience like to try to get ai to stay 00:14:47.880 --> 00:14:56.600 focused on on a a specific people group culture yeah absolutely so i'll take i'll take our first 00:14:56.600 --> 00:15:02.200 example that that you know when in mid 2024 we kind of had that realization our first stab at things 00:15:02.200 --> 00:15:08.600 was in fact that that muslim serving uh chatbot and so um what we did essentially was we partnered with 00:15:08.600 --> 00:15:13.640 several different ministries that already had content that ministered to the muslim population 00:15:13.640 --> 00:15:19.320 and then we um and then we coupled that with a partnership with um several individuals who were 00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:23.640 more familiar than i was about ministering to that people group right because i grew up in you know 00:15:23.640 --> 00:15:28.120 east coast of china not a whole lot of muslim activity there right so so that's not my area of 00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:32.360 expertise but what we'll do is we'll bring in other ministries or even you know just you know people 00:15:32.360 --> 00:15:37.800 who are familiar with it to help us frame the prompt engineering for those of you who aren't aware prompt 00:15:37.800 --> 00:15:44.600 engineering is basically the instruct like crafting the instructions for a a chat bot so that it will 00:15:44.600 --> 00:15:48.920 you know kind of respond the way you want it to and so there's there's two things two key things that 00:15:48.920 --> 00:15:55.640 i kind of mentioned there one is what we call the corpus which is a knowledge base of information by which 00:15:55.640 --> 00:16:01.800 the the chatbot can draw on that information and the second part is the prompt engineering and that's the instruction set 00:16:01.800 --> 00:16:06.120 how do you use that information how do you respond what vocabulary do you use that kind of thing 00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:13.720 and so what we have now is is kind of a really broad ranging corpus um that that's backing our 00:16:13.720 --> 00:16:19.160 our agents and our agents can then refer to that to that content the way i explain it a lot is you know 00:16:19.880 --> 00:16:24.680 nowadays most folks have at least dabbled with you know some form of chat gpt and if you haven't you 00:16:24.680 --> 00:16:30.520 should definitely try right but um they're very comfortable with giving say a chat gpt a bunch of 00:16:30.520 --> 00:16:34.680 information and just saying summarize this for me i'm too lazy i don't want to read the whole thing right 00:16:34.680 --> 00:16:41.640 and and um even though you know these commercial models like open ai's chat gpt or or you know 00:16:41.640 --> 00:16:48.040 anthropicus cloud or whatever um they're they're trained to be kind of uh religiously pluralistic 00:16:48.040 --> 00:16:52.520 right so they don't want to you know anybody's you know religion or anything like that even though 00:16:52.520 --> 00:16:56.840 that's the case they don't really inject their world view when they're just doing a straightforward 00:16:56.840 --> 00:17:04.840 task like summarizing text right and so what the the corpus allows us to do is we have that text for it 00:17:04.840 --> 00:17:09.640 to summarize somebody asked a question like who is jesus right well we're not just going to go and say 00:17:09.640 --> 00:17:14.440 you know a religiously pluralistic answer which is like oh he's one among many you know gods or whatever 00:17:14.440 --> 00:17:20.200 right we're gonna completely grab the corpus some really good content from apologetics and evangelistic 00:17:20.200 --> 00:17:25.720 you know organizations and we're gonna we're gonna essentially tell the ai hey don't we don't care 00:17:25.720 --> 00:17:30.040 what you think right just tell us what summarize this content that we already have right and so 00:17:30.040 --> 00:17:35.320 that's how we're able to ground the models in biblical truth is because we're curating these sources and 00:17:35.320 --> 00:17:40.680 giving the context to these models and simply giving them a straightforward task just synthesize 00:17:40.680 --> 00:17:46.040 and summarize this content that we already have for you and that's where the some of the organization 00:17:46.040 --> 00:17:51.240 partnerships which we're talking about with platforms where now you're allowing other organizations to 00:17:51.240 --> 00:17:59.480 contribute to the um to the source material to refine and and better align in different contexts right 00:18:00.840 --> 00:18:04.680 yeah exactly and so in the in the case that i mentioned with the muslim serving chat bot you know we 00:18:04.680 --> 00:18:09.640 partnered with you know some of the authors of answering islam.org in case in case the audience 00:18:09.640 --> 00:18:14.360 is familiar with that there's a really good uh ministry out of columbia university actually called 00:18:14.360 --> 00:18:19.480 the zwemmer center uh samuel zwemmer was kind of like the the father of um you know mid mid-eastern 00:18:19.480 --> 00:18:24.520 muslim missions kind of thing so there's an organization for that and then um a couple other organizations 00:18:24.520 --> 00:18:29.320 that kind of had um some some great content online we kind of um got their permission and by the 00:18:29.320 --> 00:18:34.200 way just a really sidebar on that like we know that there's it's kind of a hot topic um with regards 00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:38.200 to kind of like copyright law and everything like that we get permission from the authors for 00:18:38.200 --> 00:18:43.960 everything we use in the corpus um it's it's an ethically kind of gray area um in the in the courts 00:18:43.960 --> 00:18:49.320 right now you know anthropics had some pretty good um victories recently but nonetheless we want to 00:18:49.320 --> 00:18:54.360 especially given you know the the the manner in which we're trying to promote this ministry we're 00:18:54.360 --> 00:18:58.680 trying to be ethically absolutely above board and so we never put anything we don't have permission 00:18:58.680 --> 00:19:05.080 to use into the corpus no i i appreciate that and we've we've had conversations about some of legality 00:19:05.080 --> 00:19:11.480 and stuff and in previous episodes but that that's good so you're you're you're pulling material from 00:19:11.480 --> 00:19:18.520 other places and and getting it into the uh into the ai as source material that it can then regurgitate 00:19:18.520 --> 00:19:24.520 and feedback in in a be a conversation prompts and things with with people in different different 00:19:24.520 --> 00:19:31.400 contexts by the way how many like i mean we're talking about muslim a lot which is fine but like 00:19:31.400 --> 00:19:39.240 how many different contexts are we looking at globally yeah so um during you know that that pivotal 00:19:39.240 --> 00:19:44.680 point in 2024 we you know the initial plan was like hey as a first party vendor let's let's actually 00:19:44.680 --> 00:19:49.000 create all these worldview specific chat bots ourselves right and so that that was kind of 00:19:49.000 --> 00:19:52.680 pivot point where we're like you know what we're not the experts in all this what we really need to 00:19:52.680 --> 00:19:58.680 do is come alongside other ministries that have these use cases and use their expertise and content to 00:19:58.680 --> 00:20:04.040 produce these chat bots right so now at this point like we have one for uh muslim seekers we have one for 00:20:04.680 --> 00:20:10.120 um for kind of uh naturalist uh scientists we have lots of material from like the discovery institute 00:20:10.120 --> 00:20:15.480 reasons to believe those kinds of those kinds of folks um and we have um you know ones that are more 00:20:15.480 --> 00:20:19.400 using a more like socratic method you know it's actually pretty interesting because there's a lot 00:20:19.400 --> 00:20:24.440 of opinions um out there about like what's okay and what's not okay we might get into that later but 00:20:24.440 --> 00:20:29.640 um but but the socratic one is more like ask questions nudge don't don't just give an answer 00:20:29.640 --> 00:20:36.440 right whereas um some of our smaller ones just kind of give you an answer so we have you know um to date on 00:20:36.440 --> 00:20:42.200 our platform i think the count is up to like 120 or so different agents and that's some of them are 00:20:42.200 --> 00:20:46.120 our demos but but a lot of them are other ministries either playing around with it or in production 00:20:46.760 --> 00:20:54.600 even things like implementing a socratic method that's more um the the tone of the conversation 00:20:54.600 --> 00:21:01.720 and the posture of the ai even even adjust based on on the agent that's i didn't realize that uh that's 00:21:01.720 --> 00:21:06.440 that's that's interesting so and i'm going to show some ignorance but like you know i know some 00:21:06.440 --> 00:21:11.720 languages are right to left versus left to right and in some of that like you're you're adapting for 00:21:11.720 --> 00:21:19.960 that how how do you i'm curious how do you like for a a jewish uh someone that's maybe a jew that's 00:21:19.960 --> 00:21:28.200 asking some questions uh how how do how would the ai handle something like that yeah absolutely so um so we 00:21:28.200 --> 00:21:34.680 actually support um right now 192 languages and and that's that's basically like the base models 00:21:35.240 --> 00:21:40.600 um the frontier newest frontier base models like chat gpt5 for example just got released um support 00:21:40.600 --> 00:21:46.360 anywhere in the neighborhood of like 50 to 80 languages natively but then on top of that right we also 00:21:46.360 --> 00:21:51.320 have a real-time translation module and so that opens up you know some of those less spoken languages 00:21:51.320 --> 00:21:56.360 right and i can i can show a demo of that a little bit later um and so um hebrew is one of the 00:21:56.360 --> 00:22:01.800 languages that actually is more well supported by by a lot of these and so the native capabilities um 00:22:01.800 --> 00:22:06.760 handle it pretty well uh we actually have um a partner ministry i'll give a shout out since he gave 00:22:06.760 --> 00:22:12.040 a shout out to me on on a separate podcast humble burger ministries uh where this this guy with you 00:22:12.040 --> 00:22:19.000 know a jewish guy or messianic jew i should say um is is currently actively engaged in ministry to to 00:22:19.000 --> 00:22:25.160 the jewish people um with with his chat bot he's using our platform to do so as well interesting so 00:22:25.800 --> 00:22:31.640 is this are you finding that people i do want to get into the demo here in a little bit are you finding 00:22:31.640 --> 00:22:38.520 that people are open to the idea of ai speaking that they're terrified of this idea that they're angry 00:22:38.520 --> 00:22:43.480 of at this idea i'm sure you're all over the gamut what what what are you kind of seeing here 00:22:44.360 --> 00:22:50.360 exactly yeah all of the above right so um so you know attitudes have changed quite a bit just in the 00:22:50.360 --> 00:22:55.560 last you know two years that we've been doing this um you know at the beginning of it i was kind of 00:22:55.560 --> 00:23:01.640 scared to bring it up i i kind of use you know different verbiage to to kind of like ease into the ai 00:23:01.640 --> 00:23:06.040 conversation with folks because i know there is a lot more opposition especially in christian circles 00:23:06.040 --> 00:23:11.640 right and it's a it's a very kind of theological theologically heavy topic um but in the last you 00:23:11.640 --> 00:23:17.320 know i'd say year or so it's it's really the exception to the rule now where somebody says oh 00:23:17.320 --> 00:23:22.120 like you're doing ai i want to have nothing to do with you in general i think ministries are starting 00:23:22.120 --> 00:23:27.720 to kind of wake up to the opportunity and realize and realize starting to realize at least that that 00:23:27.720 --> 00:23:32.680 you know this is just another technology with its own unique characteristics but still 00:23:32.680 --> 00:23:37.880 a technology it didn't surprise god he knew exactly what was going to happen um and he's sovereign 00:23:37.880 --> 00:23:44.040 over it and we can use it to help fulfill the great commission well i i tell you even at a personal 00:23:44.040 --> 00:23:53.720 level i i can remember using chat gpt early on and and doing the you know is uh which god of all the 00:23:53.720 --> 00:24:00.120 religions which god is real and having an answer the you know a pluralistic or or a general or a pc 00:24:00.760 --> 00:24:08.520 politically correct answer and um you know and that was always the the hesitancy for me and not that 00:24:08.520 --> 00:24:15.080 i'm i'm not by far i'm not an ai expert but it was always the the difficulty of really utilizing this 00:24:15.080 --> 00:24:21.000 because i didn't know how to to to get it down and to aim it but it sounds like you've you've really 00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:29.640 developed an incredible method uh to keep it focused um in in such a way to be useful do you mind maybe 00:24:29.640 --> 00:24:35.480 taking a minute here and maybe showing us a little bit how it works yeah absolutely love to so um what 00:24:35.480 --> 00:24:41.480 i'm going to show you first is um this is kind of our flagship so everything everything that we produce 00:24:41.480 --> 00:24:46.200 you know first party we kind of consider more of like a demo now there are quite a few people using 00:24:46.200 --> 00:24:51.800 this just to be fair right and also to be fair a lot of them are in north america but i'll but i'll but 00:24:51.800 --> 00:24:57.080 given our language capabilities and so forth we actually have pretty high usage uh in other parts 00:24:57.080 --> 00:25:02.200 of the world but anyway so this is uh this is at apologist.ai and so if you want to just give it a 00:25:02.200 --> 00:25:08.200 try um you're welcome to come here and kind of hit it um recently we passed the threshold where um 00:25:08.920 --> 00:25:15.880 one person is using one of our ai agents every minute of the day for every day every day wow so 00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:21.480 that's that's thousands yeah thousands of people using it every single day and so we're we're really 00:25:21.480 --> 00:25:26.120 excited about kind of the growth there so you'll see you know in this case this this particular demo 00:25:26.120 --> 00:25:31.560 has been instructed to give kind of like a one-page essay kind of style so it's a little bit longer 00:25:31.560 --> 00:25:35.400 than than say you would want like on a phone or something like that but that's kind of the use case 00:25:35.400 --> 00:25:39.640 in this in this one but it kind of goes through an argument i'm not going to kind of belabor it 00:25:39.640 --> 00:25:45.080 and then also it'll show some some media so we in addition to our text content we also have 00:25:45.080 --> 00:25:49.640 content partners that have you know youtube videos and all kinds of different media podcasts you know 00:25:49.640 --> 00:25:54.600 all that all that kind of stuff and then we can expose related media to the to the prompt right so 00:25:54.600 --> 00:25:59.400 that's actually what's happening here is prompt gets asked and then behind the scenes our ai 00:25:59.400 --> 00:26:05.800 is our our um our platform is going out and getting that related content and then mingling that content 00:26:05.800 --> 00:26:10.840 as as a reference point for the ai to answer the question then at the same time it's also searching 00:26:10.840 --> 00:26:15.720 our corpus for media related media to that question and kind of exposing that down there and then you can 00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:21.480 kind of look here and and and kind of get some more media as well um importantly as well we cite all of 00:26:21.480 --> 00:26:26.040 our sources right so not only are we trying to stay ethically above board but actually there's something in it 00:26:26.040 --> 00:26:31.240 for in addition to the general you know um good of the kingdom and so forth there's there's actually 00:26:31.240 --> 00:26:35.240 something in it for these ministries that give us content as well as they get some exposure right so 00:26:35.240 --> 00:26:40.360 we've got all about god and god questions and something from ligonier here right so um so they 00:26:40.360 --> 00:26:45.880 and then that link can link off to their you know uh place to either either you know url to read the full 00:26:45.880 --> 00:26:51.960 article or or you know purchase a book or what have you right um so that's kind of how it works in a general 00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:56.840 sense again this one is is true is is programmed specifically to give kind of one of those lengthier 00:26:56.840 --> 00:27:03.960 answers but that's not you know always what we do um we also have let me go over to actually let's see 00:27:04.840 --> 00:27:09.160 yeah so i'm going to show you um an example in arabic i'm just going to highlight another 00:27:09.160 --> 00:27:13.800 kind of feature that we have so um while this is going so i don't speak arabic by the way so 00:27:13.800 --> 00:27:21.480 um i've been told that it does well i'll leave it at that this one is actually we actually support uh 00:27:21.480 --> 00:27:26.840 several different models under the hood um this one actually is using the the deep seek model right 00:27:26.840 --> 00:27:31.960 so a reasoning model um and it that one happens to kind of perform a little better better in arabic 00:27:31.960 --> 00:27:36.200 but you mentioned kind of the right to left jeff sure so that's an example of that going on right 00:27:36.200 --> 00:27:40.840 here and the other thing i wanted to highlight here as well is you know it's one thing to get 00:27:40.840 --> 00:27:44.920 uh somebody who's curious about you know christianity or just has like a faith-based 00:27:44.920 --> 00:27:49.640 question to engage with the chat bot but most of the time what we would say is we really want them 00:27:49.640 --> 00:27:54.680 to get in conversation with with a with um a human being right so that's where the digital missionaries 00:27:54.680 --> 00:28:00.680 come in right and so and so yes ai can be used to kind of start the conversation knock out some really 00:28:00.680 --> 00:28:05.240 good you know answers to questions and stuff like that but the handoff to a human being is very 00:28:05.240 --> 00:28:10.760 important to us right and it's very important to our partner ministries and so we have is a capability 00:28:10.760 --> 00:28:15.800 of not only letting the ai answer but then also an area kind of below the answer um that we call the 00:28:15.800 --> 00:28:20.840 kind of a call to action right so so this can be pretty much anything it's for anybody technical it's 00:28:20.840 --> 00:28:26.120 arbitrary html basically so it can be you know a full bleed banner like this is an example of you know 00:28:26.120 --> 00:28:32.600 um a banner ad to to send people over to to watch the chosen tv program in arabic it could just as well be 00:28:32.600 --> 00:28:38.360 just about anything right so that's that's completely customizable and actually uh recently we released 00:28:38.360 --> 00:28:42.520 a change so that you can have multiple different calls to action that kind of spring up at different 00:28:42.520 --> 00:28:49.160 points in the user's conversation how many of the people that are using this or the organizations that 00:28:49.160 --> 00:28:54.360 are using this are implementing physical where you're it's traffic hopping to some sort of a physical 00:28:55.000 --> 00:29:01.160 person or a call center do you have any idea on that um i don't have numbers for you offhand but i 00:29:01.160 --> 00:29:07.880 will say that um just this past week we're we're pretty deep in discussions with um with an organization 00:29:08.440 --> 00:29:12.520 um i don't know if i should for the sake of the organization reveal who they are but but a major 00:29:12.520 --> 00:29:18.920 organization operating in east asia and southeast asia okay what they're doing is they're they're using 00:29:18.920 --> 00:29:24.520 these calls calls to action to um we have like a share link here so if you want to so if you click on 00:29:24.520 --> 00:29:30.280 this this icon here it'll share the the essentially this um output and then you can send it to somebody 00:29:30.280 --> 00:29:36.280 so we're piping that share link through that uh call to action in the link and then it's going off to 00:29:36.280 --> 00:29:43.800 facebook messenger where a human chat operator can then um have that link and know what the ai was you 00:29:43.800 --> 00:29:47.960 know what the conversation was up to that point and then carry it start to carry on the conversation from 00:29:47.960 --> 00:29:55.480 there right so we're we're really focused right now on partnering with ministries to facilitate 00:29:55.480 --> 00:30:01.480 those kinds of integrations and interactions where we can you know allow them to to hand off to it to 00:30:01.480 --> 00:30:06.520 another human being or sometimes you know especially in more sensitive areas sometimes it's not you know 00:30:06.520 --> 00:30:11.240 directly handing off to a human being but maybe it's like scan this qr code or you know contact this 00:30:11.240 --> 00:30:15.000 person you know something like that so it's it's really pretty wide open and we've seen a lot of 00:30:15.000 --> 00:30:22.200 use cases interesting what is um that that's that's cool uh talk to me a little bit more about the 00:30:22.200 --> 00:30:29.800 software what what else are we looking at here sure so um so uh maybe i'll just show another this is i 00:30:29.800 --> 00:30:33.640 don't want to geek out too much but i know you know at least part of your audience we're a bunch of geeks 00:30:33.640 --> 00:30:38.600 here you can feel free to geek it's okay i give you permission so i'm gonna i'm gonna give a shout 00:30:38.600 --> 00:30:42.920 out for our language uh translation capabilities so like i mentioned you know the the base models 00:30:42.920 --> 00:30:47.320 depending on which one you pick and we do support you know i think about uh two or three dozen now 00:30:47.320 --> 00:30:53.560 but all the latest models we have chat gpt 50 or sorry excuse me chat gpt5 um and and the kind of 00:30:53.560 --> 00:30:58.680 the recent ones from claude and a lot of open source ones as well but when we layer real-time 00:30:58.680 --> 00:31:04.440 translation on top of that that widens it out to almost 200 languages and so this is an example of 00:31:04.440 --> 00:31:09.560 amharic which is the national language of ethiopia so one of the less you know internationally spoken 00:31:09.560 --> 00:31:15.240 languages um and so i'll just give an example and i do have um somebody who checked this and said 00:31:15.240 --> 00:31:19.480 it's actually pretty good but what's actually happening here it's going pretty fast considering the 00:31:19.480 --> 00:31:24.680 fact that basically we're doing that whole you know reference to the corpus coming back and then and 00:31:24.680 --> 00:31:31.720 then um generating a response but then we layer on top of that um this real-time translation so so we have this prop this 00:31:31.720 --> 00:31:37.880 technical problem where like you know the the ai is outputting content in english right but then we 00:31:37.880 --> 00:31:43.720 have to while it's streaming we're chunking it up and paragraph by paragraph sending it out to a 00:31:43.720 --> 00:31:48.520 translation service to get back and so that's all happening kind of transparently and so you you saw 00:31:48.520 --> 00:31:52.520 it's a little bit slower than maybe english but it's still pretty fast you're seeing it kind of come 00:31:52.520 --> 00:31:56.920 down paragraph by paragraph so the user doesn't have to wait for the whole thing before it gets translated 00:31:56.920 --> 00:32:05.480 yeah what what is the the global um usage of this compared to the u.s you know i i know u.s is 00:32:05.480 --> 00:32:11.720 somewhat more technologically advanced uh but smartphones are all over the place globally and it seems 00:32:11.720 --> 00:32:17.400 like a lot of your organizations are more globally based i'm just curious what uh what's uh what's 00:32:17.400 --> 00:32:22.840 happening yeah absolutely um and do you mind i'm gonna i'm gonna switch the share to another tab 00:32:22.840 --> 00:32:29.080 here are you seeing this okay yeah i'm seeing that country's reached yeah perfect yeah so this is um 00:32:29.080 --> 00:32:33.720 this is kind of um and i can show some statistics here but basically this is purposely excluding kind 00:32:33.720 --> 00:32:39.160 of the u.s and canada because the truth is right now most of our usage is in in north america to be 00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:45.480 fair um but probably um i haven't looked at it recently but probably like at least 25 percent is is 00:32:45.480 --> 00:32:50.120 international as well and the more interesting thing about that though is where is happening in the world 00:32:50.120 --> 00:32:56.040 relative to other spots you'll see indonesia here so that's that's actually a heavy usage area for us 00:32:56.040 --> 00:33:03.000 right now and especially singapore in fact singapore is just absolutely blowing up um and that makes 00:33:03.000 --> 00:33:08.680 sense too because if you look at the languages other than english that are that are in use almost almost 00:33:08.680 --> 00:33:14.200 half of the non-english usage is in chinese and so of course in singapore you got basically mandarin chinese 00:33:14.200 --> 00:33:20.120 and english right kind of the two main languages there um and so you know overall um we're pretty 00:33:20.120 --> 00:33:25.000 pleased with that but you know we definitely have a lot of growth to do kind of about in like last six 00:33:25.000 --> 00:33:29.480 months or so up until six months we've been more focused on generating the corpus and you know product 00:33:29.480 --> 00:33:34.200 development stuff like that and about six months ago we finally said like okay like this is this is 00:33:34.200 --> 00:33:39.720 we're good enough we need to we need to focus pivot a little bit and focus on partnering with ministries 00:33:39.720 --> 00:33:45.400 getting it out into the field and so we're hoping that you know growth will will definitely um increase 00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:52.600 um abroad as well is there any like talking about china um mandarin chinese is there any security 00:33:52.600 --> 00:34:00.440 concerns like can they access this um safely or do they have to go through any back channels like what 00:34:00.440 --> 00:34:06.680 does that look like yeah you know it's interesting uh last fall um because of my you know having grown up 00:34:06.680 --> 00:34:11.080 in china i was invited to like a you know a china missions kind of conference and there was a lot 00:34:11.080 --> 00:34:15.320 of discussion about that obviously you know the great you know the great firewall of china they call 00:34:15.320 --> 00:34:24.520 it right um and so um there's a lot of ways you can mitigate that through using vpns in some cases 00:34:24.520 --> 00:34:31.480 but the most foolproof way um and is is to just smuggle you know offline devices basically and so we're 00:34:31.480 --> 00:34:35.720 kind of exploring that a little bit as well because if you think about it like you know the stats show 00:34:35.720 --> 00:34:40.840 that like you know probably about 75 percent probably about three quarters of the of the world has is 00:34:40.840 --> 00:34:46.040 is connected online through some mechanism but that still leaves a lot of people in you know regions 00:34:46.040 --> 00:34:51.880 where there just you know isn't isn't access or to your point jeff like you know closed countries 00:34:51.880 --> 00:34:56.520 not only china or north korea but also you know middle east where um there's not as much religious 00:34:56.520 --> 00:35:02.280 tolerance as well and so the idea i've been kind of you know experimenting with a little bit and and um 00:35:03.000 --> 00:35:07.880 talking with a few folks about is can we train a small language model which is just you know basically 00:35:07.880 --> 00:35:15.960 an ai a language um ai um but that's smaller right in a footprint and can we then embed that onto a 00:35:15.960 --> 00:35:22.520 device and then just smuggle it in on the device and um to do that you know we would probably use some 00:35:22.520 --> 00:35:28.440 sort of like higher powered reasoning model to fine-tune a smaller language model and then find a way to kind of 00:35:28.440 --> 00:35:33.240 package at least portions of the corpus that could be representative and then allow the ai to function 00:35:33.240 --> 00:35:39.640 in an offline capacity that is fascinating i i did not even know you could do that but uh it's it's 00:35:39.640 --> 00:35:44.680 that's that's that's crazy even like you know it's it's you know i hear like the ai wearables and some 00:35:44.680 --> 00:35:52.200 of that and so it's almost a precursor to that with the gospel like how do you get um you know a smaller 00:35:52.200 --> 00:35:59.640 version of the ai uh that you can you can smuggle across i can remember my uh my parents actually uh my 00:35:59.640 --> 00:36:05.400 mom was like smuggling bibles into like you know romania and things like this back in the day and 00:36:05.400 --> 00:36:11.640 the church i was a part of was was smuggling bibles into russia and and so now it's hey let's let's 00:36:11.640 --> 00:36:17.880 smuggle artificial intelligence like what what is is what i'm just i don't want to get lost in this 00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:23.080 because i will but what what is what is a small device that will have artificial intelligence on it 00:36:23.080 --> 00:36:30.200 are we talking like a a smartphone uh um like what yeah in fact i've already um in fact a couple weeks 00:36:30.200 --> 00:36:36.280 ago i talked to a guy who who has a non-profit who's building um uh android based phones and we 00:36:36.280 --> 00:36:41.880 we talked about a potential partnership for that for this exact use case again i don't know anybody 00:36:43.480 --> 00:36:48.440 yeah just generally speaking um but there's there's a lot of thought around you know been put around 00:36:48.440 --> 00:36:53.240 this as like how do you how do you reach you know unreached countries or or or at least countries that 00:36:53.240 --> 00:36:59.320 are closed up and and get get kind of these materials into them yeah you know i know a lot of our people 00:36:59.320 --> 00:37:07.400 are um you know obviously in china we chat's a a popular platform but we chat is run by communist 00:37:07.400 --> 00:37:14.440 china and so probably not a good idea to uh to you know embed this in in we chat but you know a lot 00:37:14.440 --> 00:37:21.080 of our people globally utilize whatsapp a lot here in america are utilizing discord as well for some 00:37:21.080 --> 00:37:27.800 asynchronous uh have you guys looked at embedding or creating bots or tools or somehow integrating this 00:37:27.800 --> 00:37:34.760 into some of those platforms yeah absolutely so we have uh we have a working whatsapp um integration 00:37:34.760 --> 00:37:39.800 right now and actually um one of the volunteers on our team just finished up the uh telegram integration 00:37:39.800 --> 00:37:47.320 as well and um most importantly with regards to that is we have kind of the i don't get too technical 00:37:47.320 --> 00:37:51.800 but we have kind of like the framework to quickly spin these these kind of integrations up in fact the 00:37:51.800 --> 00:37:59.480 individual who um finished up the telegram one spent you know um i i wrote 99 of the code of what you see 00:37:59.480 --> 00:38:04.680 right and so another person came in and within a week was able to spin up a whole integration with 00:38:04.680 --> 00:38:11.240 telegram um and so we're we're pretty hopeful that you know as you know we meet ministries with 00:38:11.240 --> 00:38:16.520 particular use cases we can spin up different integrations in the future very rapidly yeah i'm i'm 00:38:16.520 --> 00:38:22.440 curious just as you're talking about this how many people are on your team what what's dev at least 00:38:22.440 --> 00:38:27.480 dev wise like how many devs do you have working on this um so it's an interesting question so we're 00:38:27.480 --> 00:38:31.800 all volunteer right now right so we're actively fundraising and trying to get you know full time 00:38:31.800 --> 00:38:39.480 onto it and so um i do most of the programming but then we also have kind of um a kind of uh misfit 00:38:39.480 --> 00:38:43.800 a band of of other volunteers who are kind of helping out and you know people will come and go 00:38:43.800 --> 00:38:48.120 as they have time and everything like that but probably on the engineering side you know at any 00:38:48.120 --> 00:38:53.800 given point in time we probably have like three or four uh ish um and then you know of course it's 00:38:53.800 --> 00:38:58.040 not all just product development it's also marketing everything like that so i we do have a leadership 00:38:58.040 --> 00:39:03.640 team again all volunteer um of about uh seven people right now and um who help with kind of 00:39:03.640 --> 00:39:08.200 marketing and positioning and business development all that kind of stuff it's incredible product you're 00:39:08.200 --> 00:39:15.560 looking at with uh that's 100 100 volunteer based or majority volunteer based that's that's that's 00:39:15.560 --> 00:39:23.000 great what's your what's your day job um so i lead a product team for a social media management company 00:39:23.000 --> 00:39:29.720 uh okay out of boulder so yeah i'm i'm you know still in the startup world and uh and you know have 00:39:29.720 --> 00:39:35.320 that and i bring that ethos to you know the the non-profit so it's kind of a weird thing to treat 00:39:35.320 --> 00:39:40.040 a non-profit like a startup but that's pretty much how we operate yeah i mean we are right there with 00:39:40.040 --> 00:39:48.920 you 100 and so it's uh it's uh it's a fun road working with volunteers and and remote and and uh 00:39:48.920 --> 00:39:55.080 startup like all that all that put together it's challenging but it is it is certainly is fun um 00:39:56.280 --> 00:40:03.320 so let's let me ask this question with with the ai oftentimes you'll get into a situation when 00:40:03.320 --> 00:40:08.120 you're having a conversation with someone and it's like okay let's just agree to disagree 00:40:09.000 --> 00:40:15.160 um like you know i i can no longer have this conversation without shouting at you and and i 00:40:15.160 --> 00:40:22.200 feel that you're about to do the same thing with me um how do you handle that in a in an artificial 00:40:22.200 --> 00:40:28.680 intelligence situation does does the ai just keep going or like what's what's the deal it depends on 00:40:28.680 --> 00:40:34.280 the prompt engineering but one thing i will say is that you know and i didn't really cover this before 00:40:34.280 --> 00:40:39.640 but one of one of the advantages to ai is that it doesn't get mad right like so so there's not like 00:40:39.640 --> 00:40:45.000 this dynamic where we're like you're gonna feel judged like talking to it and so what we found and 00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:51.000 you know frankly all of our usage is anonymous since we don't know who's using it right but we know what 00:40:51.000 --> 00:40:55.560 they're saying right and we're logging all of that and so we have all kinds of you know interesting 00:40:55.560 --> 00:41:02.840 conversations come across um where people are you know being vulnerable with the ai about things that 00:41:02.840 --> 00:41:07.960 they would never talk to another human being about or certainly not a christian right or somebody that 00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:14.760 just is an acquaintance and so actually the the anonymous aspect of ai interaction actually lets people 00:41:14.760 --> 00:41:19.800 become you know more vulnerable and get kind of into some weighty topics you know for example we have a 00:41:19.800 --> 00:41:26.360 you know a really interesting conversation that we saw from from a female in saudi arabia you know 00:41:26.360 --> 00:41:31.000 questioning her sexuality and stuff like that like how do you like who would she have talked to in 00:41:31.000 --> 00:41:35.800 the middle of saudi arabia right you know what i mean and so and so having those kinds of conversations 00:41:35.800 --> 00:41:42.360 without any fear of you know um of you know having judgment late on her or anything like that is is 00:41:42.360 --> 00:41:47.080 pretty big factor um but going back to your question you know it really just depends on the prompt 00:41:47.080 --> 00:41:51.240 engineering like uh the use case that you just mentioned like you know when when should the ai end 00:41:51.240 --> 00:41:55.480 the conversation it's frankly something we haven't really heavily considered but there's no reason why 00:41:55.480 --> 00:42:00.120 we couldn't do that you know just in the same way that you can instruct it to you know use a more 00:42:00.120 --> 00:42:04.040 socratic method you can easily say like hey if the conversation has gone all along and the person seems 00:42:04.040 --> 00:42:09.720 angry just disengaged you know you could you could definitely program that in no problem so but uh the 00:42:09.720 --> 00:42:15.560 default right now is you know the ai is just going to keep ai in until the until the person hangs up 00:42:16.200 --> 00:42:24.680 that's right that's fascinating what is there if someone does have a conversion if someone does 00:42:24.680 --> 00:42:29.800 you know want to take a next step then that's based on the organization that's running the agent at 00:42:29.800 --> 00:42:35.080 that at that point they it gets connected to the ministry whatever that looks like okay yeah so for 00:42:35.080 --> 00:42:40.440 example you know one of our one of our big partners is uh got questions.org um and then also all about 00:42:40.440 --> 00:42:44.360 god.com and i'll actually use all about god.com because i think this is still the case but both of those 00:42:44.360 --> 00:42:49.240 organizations have at the end of every one of it's basically question and answer format right on their 00:42:49.240 --> 00:42:54.200 web pages and at the bottom it's like hey here's a couple buttons you know you want to find out more 00:42:54.200 --> 00:42:58.920 do you want to contact us yes i've accepted jesus you know that kind of thing and so we could use um 00:42:58.920 --> 00:43:02.680 what we did actually for all about god is we implemented their exact call to action that they 00:43:02.680 --> 00:43:07.800 have on their website um in the planner and so and then they go to the same places so so you know 00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:11.880 someone clicks on yes i've accepted jesus they go to the same intake form as they do on the website 00:43:11.880 --> 00:43:18.600 that's great do you have any idea uh on on your side what conversion rate meaning marketing not 00:43:18.600 --> 00:43:23.560 salvation but maybe i do mean salvation what's the conversion rate of of this stuff yeah it's a 00:43:23.560 --> 00:43:27.400 you know it's a funny topic right because like we have all these ministries who are kind of you know 00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:32.360 indicated um uh what is it called indicated conversion or whatever is is kind of the term 00:43:32.360 --> 00:43:37.480 right or indicated choice or whatever it's right so only god knows people's hearts right so we all know 00:43:37.480 --> 00:43:43.960 that but um but yes we are tracking um one of the nice things about our platform is irrespective of 00:43:43.960 --> 00:43:48.520 um you know where you send the user in your call to action you can do all the tracking you want on 00:43:48.520 --> 00:43:52.760 your site but we're also tracking it as well so we know every time somebody clicks on any part of your 00:43:52.760 --> 00:43:58.760 call to action we are tracking that and we will know kind of you know what uh chat conversation they 00:43:58.760 --> 00:44:02.840 had that led up to that all that kind of good stuff and then we're going to allow the ministries to 00:44:02.840 --> 00:44:09.320 download those conversations and and you know hook them into whatever systems they want so if if somebody 00:44:09.320 --> 00:44:16.520 wanted to like get involved or utilize this product like what what are the different ways somebody could 00:44:16.520 --> 00:44:23.160 like take a take a step in and and get involved with apologist project yeah great question thanks for 00:44:23.160 --> 00:44:27.960 that um so um you know we all we are always looking for more people to volunteer so if you're interested in 00:44:27.960 --> 00:44:32.600 helping us in any capacity and again we need help in all kinds of areas not just technical like we'd love 00:44:32.600 --> 00:44:37.160 somebody to help with our social media etc if you're a ministry or involved with the ministry or want 00:44:37.160 --> 00:44:41.960 to recommend us to a ministry the first next step is just go ahead and book a demo on our website so 00:44:41.960 --> 00:44:46.520 there's that you'll see that button kind of plaster all over the place because we like to we like to 00:44:46.520 --> 00:44:50.600 get into a conversation with the ministry and really understand their use case and that's also kind of 00:44:50.600 --> 00:44:56.360 a mechanism to make sure that you know they're doing it for the right reasons or aligned reasons for us as 00:44:56.360 --> 00:45:03.560 well and then what we do is we spin up a uh you know a demo uh conversational ai that they can then just 00:45:03.560 --> 00:45:08.520 go and play around with for free um and then you know once the usage starts going or once they once 00:45:08.520 --> 00:45:13.720 they you know go into production with it then only then would they start having any kind of fees yeah 00:45:13.720 --> 00:45:18.440 and what what are if you don't mind me asking here on air like what what are loose fees for something like 00:45:18.440 --> 00:45:26.040 this yeah so really low usage we do have a free tier so um the we have like a credit based system 00:45:26.040 --> 00:45:33.480 essentially to kind of abstract the whole token um economy right so um so we basically say um one 00:45:33.480 --> 00:45:41.160 credit in our system is one half of one us dollar cent um and so something like a model like chat gpt 4o 00:45:41.160 --> 00:45:47.720 costs five credits so that equates to 2.5 cents so a response every response from chat gpt 4o model 00:45:47.720 --> 00:45:53.320 would cost 2.5 cents and so we charge uh basically like a platform fee that that you know is determined 00:45:53.320 --> 00:45:58.120 by the functionality you you have so if it's like fully white label then you might be on a higher tier 00:45:58.120 --> 00:46:02.440 and then we have usage based pricing on top of that um if anybody's interested in learning more 00:46:02.440 --> 00:46:07.640 about that you can go to uh apologist project dot org slash pricing and see like all the different 00:46:08.280 --> 00:46:13.000 costs and so forth and i'm guessing somehow they can grab a meeting with you and maybe get that 00:46:13.000 --> 00:46:19.080 translated into english i followed most of it but at some point i was like i i hope it reads easier than 00:46:19.080 --> 00:46:25.320 what i just heard so i might uh i might have to use an ai to help explain it but yes very good i'm sure 00:46:25.320 --> 00:46:31.320 you can figure that part out um so and then that that would be embedding on the website or 00:46:31.400 --> 00:46:36.760 you're partnering with you at some level to create an agent like if somebody didn't want to go through 00:46:36.760 --> 00:46:43.000 the the level of creating an agent but just wanted to get your ai out there as as a chat bot somehow 00:46:43.000 --> 00:46:49.480 what would that look like yeah so um you know you know we do support embedding on websites and you 00:46:49.480 --> 00:46:54.280 know there are two common ways we do that um people are far familiar with kind of like the customer support 00:46:54.280 --> 00:46:59.320 little chat bubble so we do support a mechanism like that where it's like a little chat bubble and you click on 00:46:59.320 --> 00:47:04.520 it and opens up a little you know a little uh tiny little you know uh thing in the corner where they 00:47:04.520 --> 00:47:09.240 can kind of chat with it right there or a lot of our ministries opt to embed it straight onto their 00:47:09.240 --> 00:47:14.280 page for example um we recently did an implementation for apologetics canada where they embedded it kind 00:47:14.280 --> 00:47:19.960 of on their page so it looks like integrated with their website more um and then we also do have an api 00:47:19.960 --> 00:47:24.760 by the way which i probably should have mentioned before um which means you know if you're a you know if 00:47:24.760 --> 00:47:29.560 you're a larger organization that has a an app you know several developers have kind of contacted us 00:47:29.560 --> 00:47:34.280 and some major organizations i probably shouldn't mention have contacted us um about just using our 00:47:34.280 --> 00:47:37.640 api because they already have the interface they don't want our interface they just want our answers 00:47:37.640 --> 00:47:45.320 right or our agent the brain yeah yeah that's incredible like i i didn't i hadn't even gotten to 00:47:45.320 --> 00:47:50.760 the place of api and integrating this into a platform or an app or something that's already existing 00:47:50.760 --> 00:47:55.800 that's beautiful but i guess if you're if you're doing the work to get it into like whatsapp and 00:47:55.800 --> 00:48:02.200 telegram then you're already having some level of an api level uh able for that so that's really cool 00:48:02.760 --> 00:48:11.000 show me i'd love to maybe show one or two more uh samples or examples on the ai of some conversations 00:48:11.000 --> 00:48:16.680 do you maybe have one or two things you could show in that space sure yeah i'll pull up um i'll pull 00:48:16.680 --> 00:48:22.360 up the integration with gotquestions.org um because again like their their corpus like if for those of 00:48:22.360 --> 00:48:26.760 you who aren't aren't familiar their their whole website is essentially question and answer format so 00:48:26.760 --> 00:48:32.280 it's like match made in heaven right for training in ai right so it's exactly kind of what you want so 00:48:32.280 --> 00:48:37.800 don't forget to share the right tab you're on the uh the languages use tab right now thank you for 00:48:37.800 --> 00:48:45.240 yeah so this is one uh got questions dot chat right so this is again this is kind of a similar thing to 00:48:45.240 --> 00:48:48.680 apologetics canada what they did so they kind of embedded on there so they have their own kind of 00:48:48.680 --> 00:48:52.200 website frame and they have you know their little about thing that says you know all that kind of 00:48:52.200 --> 00:49:02.440 stuff right so i don't know let's say um uh you know how can a good god allow so much evil in the world 00:49:02.440 --> 00:49:08.920 right that's the odyssey stuff um so that that's how it works right and so you can see all this the 00:49:08.920 --> 00:49:13.960 entirety of this is completely white labeled they've got you know their own custom footer um they didn't 00:49:13.960 --> 00:49:18.440 put a call to action down here but they could they've got their logo up here they got custom information 00:49:18.440 --> 00:49:24.360 about their their logo or about their organization and then obviously you know for any language that 00:49:24.360 --> 00:49:29.640 that the chatbot supports you can also have all of that information um we have a you know translation 00:49:29.640 --> 00:49:36.280 module on our in kind of our back end where you can get all of the you know english uh copy your custom 00:49:36.280 --> 00:49:42.520 copy to be translated into all the languages that you support as well um and then i should mention 00:49:42.520 --> 00:49:47.800 as well kind of just coming up um we're we're kind of you know you know i already mentioned we're 00:49:47.800 --> 00:49:52.760 exploring kind of small language models offline models we're also getting into voice recently as well 00:49:53.400 --> 00:49:58.120 um because if you think about it not only you know not only is it convenient to kind of be able to 00:49:58.840 --> 00:50:03.080 you know just kind of converse with with an ai back and forth right if you don't you know hands-free 00:50:03.080 --> 00:50:10.600 operation but also you know i was reminded recently from from um a brother um who i met about there 00:50:10.600 --> 00:50:16.040 there are quite a few languages that don't actually have a written you know a written form right so 00:50:16.040 --> 00:50:22.440 they're they're they're oral only and so the idea it kind of fascinates me of of like how can we use 00:50:22.440 --> 00:50:29.240 you know um how can we use just oral transmission like right with with with explaining these things 00:50:29.240 --> 00:50:34.680 these theological in those languages so that's kind of an area that i'd like to expand in as well so 00:50:34.680 --> 00:50:39.720 we're kind of you know we're we're kind of going where god leads but also where the ministry our 00:50:39.720 --> 00:50:45.800 ministry partners lead as well so you know we're very open to kind of novel use cases for using ai and 00:50:45.800 --> 00:50:51.800 and and kind of spreading spreading the gospel and in um kind of innovative ways very cool i've got a 00:50:51.800 --> 00:50:57.720 question here from methos um are you concerned are you at all concerned about people especially new 00:50:57.720 --> 00:51:04.280 people getting confused and making mistaking ai for the voice of god that's a great question um so 00:51:04.280 --> 00:51:10.840 there's a lot of theology there to unpack right and so um one one thing i'll just uh make a plug for we 00:51:10.840 --> 00:51:17.480 have uh we wrote a white paper kind of about about kind of that the theology um aspect of all this um 00:51:17.480 --> 00:51:21.720 it's on our website if you go to apologistproject.org um it should be like at a banner at the top and you 00:51:21.720 --> 00:51:26.920 kind of click through it but it's it's an extremely important question right so there's there are lines 00:51:26.920 --> 00:51:33.320 which we do not cross right we will not cross the line of having the ai pretend like it's a person 00:51:33.320 --> 00:51:39.640 right so that means we will not have the ai pray for you right we will give you information through 00:51:39.640 --> 00:51:45.800 the ai right but we will not have it pray for you or in any way hopefully kind of you know imply that 00:51:45.800 --> 00:51:52.360 it's a human being right and so um now that being said you know you know that's that's our kind of 00:51:52.360 --> 00:51:57.880 theology right but we we are very ecumenical in a sense we do let you know other you know any pretty 00:51:57.880 --> 00:52:04.520 much any lowercase orthodox um christian denomination uh to to use the chatbot and we'll 00:52:04.520 --> 00:52:09.320 facilitate that we go back to the nicene creed for that right so all the three branches of christendom 00:52:09.320 --> 00:52:15.400 support that um and so we are you know in spite of my own theology which if you're wondering is protestant 00:52:15.400 --> 00:52:21.560 um evangelical but um but but that doesn't mean we we will disallow you know catholic or eastern 00:52:21.560 --> 00:52:27.160 orthodox folks from using the chatbot and so forth and so my caveat there is like i have very specific 00:52:27.880 --> 00:52:34.200 cross personally for my theology but we leave it open to you know the denominational preferences of 00:52:34.200 --> 00:52:38.920 of the folks who are kind of uh using it but i think most people would agree like we don't want 00:52:38.920 --> 00:52:43.640 an ai jesus right we probably don't want an ai mary we probably don't want anything that could be 00:52:44.200 --> 00:52:50.680 construed as i you know an idol or or some kind of you know uh representation of a deity or anything like 00:52:50.680 --> 00:52:56.840 that we really want to we may you know we may have personas right but we're not gonna but those personas 00:52:56.840 --> 00:53:03.240 would be more like a helpful teacher not like yeah representation of of uh you know a deity or anything 00:53:03.240 --> 00:53:09.000 like that um and in fact this has come up recently because like you know i have to guard myself against 00:53:09.000 --> 00:53:15.880 this you know quite quite a bit because the the you know the rate of um innovation in ai is is staggering 00:53:15.880 --> 00:53:20.760 right now so like recently for example um since we do have an api and it's actually compatible with 00:53:20.760 --> 00:53:25.800 the open ai spec we can now integrate with anywhere that open ai can integrate right and so one of those 00:53:25.800 --> 00:53:30.360 places was like you know there's a company that had like uh you know a video avatar right and you could 00:53:30.360 --> 00:53:36.200 hook up our llm to that avatar and so and then and so like i did a i did like a prototype of like you 00:53:36.200 --> 00:53:40.200 know somebody asking a question we hooked it up to our muslim serving chatbot somebody asking a question 00:53:40.200 --> 00:53:45.480 about you know is isa really a god or is he a prophet right and you had this very you know middle 00:53:45.480 --> 00:53:52.360 eastern looking man like on video speaking our our the output of our ai right and it's like at that 00:53:52.360 --> 00:53:58.840 point it's like okay is that taking it a step too far right because that's that's like representing a 00:53:58.840 --> 00:54:03.880 real human being yeah and so kind of pull it back and be like you know what that's that might be a 00:54:03.880 --> 00:54:07.720 little bit too far than we're willing to go you know never say never but but that's that that seemed 00:54:07.720 --> 00:54:13.240 a little off to me uh whereas like voice you can see that like it's it yes it's kind of in the same 00:54:13.240 --> 00:54:17.560 vein but you're not you're not trying to represent some kind of image or anything like that that's 00:54:17.560 --> 00:54:22.520 just more of a convenience factor right and so there's a lot of theology to unpack but the short 00:54:22.520 --> 00:54:29.160 answer is we try to put guardrails in place that satisfy our conscience about you know this representing 00:54:29.160 --> 00:54:34.120 our ai as either human being or some kind of deity and try to prevent it wherever we can yeah i mean 00:54:34.120 --> 00:54:41.400 it's it's it's you're keep opening up uh issues and challenges and things that we weren't even talking 00:54:41.400 --> 00:54:49.560 about five years ago um at a large scale we we tried some like hey jin stuff where it's like you know 00:54:49.560 --> 00:54:57.400 video translation and there's actual videos of me uh speaking in mandarin chinese and and i i speak 00:54:57.400 --> 00:55:03.240 really good mandarin chinese like i i've i have a friend that's that speaks mandarin chinese and she 00:55:03.240 --> 00:55:08.200 was mad at me because she couldn't believe ai did it that because she thought i learned mandarin chinese 00:55:08.200 --> 00:55:14.120 and didn't tell her um but uh you know it's just some some ethical like is this right is this the right 00:55:14.120 --> 00:55:21.400 thing yeah and so i think it's good to to question on that you know it's it's i don't know it's the 00:55:21.400 --> 00:55:27.080 right answer but i'll often i feel like culturally that may change over time as there's more cultural 00:55:27.080 --> 00:55:37.000 acceptance of um what ai is and isn't and what you know fake video or or ai agents video is and is not 00:55:37.000 --> 00:55:42.040 what's what's accepted and not accepted you know i don't i don't i don't know that jesus has an 00:55:42.040 --> 00:55:47.240 opinion whether or not it's right but there's like a cult and you can at me if i'm wrong but i i just 00:55:47.240 --> 00:55:52.760 i think it's more of a cultural acceptance like are we okay using that method or or not but asking 00:55:52.760 --> 00:55:59.160 questions and pausing to to evaluate is good i i i would say and it's interesting methods the guy 00:55:59.160 --> 00:56:05.160 who asked the question actually says good answer so you you got his you got him happy um but you know 00:56:05.720 --> 00:56:12.440 for me it was the hey does this actually feed into like a conversation at some point and you know your 00:56:12.440 --> 00:56:22.120 platform putting onus on the um on the uh on the organizations with the call to actions and feed 00:56:22.120 --> 00:56:27.240 into their process like i i don't know that i would expect your organization to actually be responsible 00:56:27.240 --> 00:56:32.440 for as much as making sure there's opportunities for the organizations that to do what they're doing 00:56:32.440 --> 00:56:38.920 and you're just the the gateway to get them uh more connectivity uh methods goes on to say they 00:56:38.920 --> 00:56:45.000 will undoubtedly be ai cults soon if there aren't already yeah i don't i don't know that i want to 00:56:45.000 --> 00:56:50.280 get pulled into that conversation today but you're you're you're probably not right um you know we it 00:56:50.280 --> 00:56:56.600 was funny we uh we just rolled out a couple days ago as a part of our town hall we rolled out our our 00:56:56.600 --> 00:57:03.400 ai agent uh through some we've done some stuff with chat gpt uh and then we uh we're working with an 00:57:03.400 --> 00:57:11.640 organization called topos that basically encoded all like a thousand blogs 800 blogs almost a thousand 00:57:11.640 --> 00:57:16.760 hours of video like just encoded it all on this thing and so we're we're experimenting with them 00:57:16.760 --> 00:57:22.520 on it but um jokingly we're calling it lex now i know you said you're not going to put a name on it 00:57:22.520 --> 00:57:28.040 we put a name on it um well just to be fair i don't i don't think it's wrong to have a persona right i 00:57:28.040 --> 00:57:33.960 just think that if if asked right like an ai should admit that it's an ai kind of thing yeah no that that 00:57:33.960 --> 00:57:41.240 that i do agree with but we um we we named it lex uh because after lex luther because at the end of 00:57:41.240 --> 00:57:45.400 the world this ai thing is going to try to take over the world somebody's going to try to do something 00:57:45.400 --> 00:57:52.440 with it uh but let's let's have fun and use it while we can that's that's all i'm saying and and so um 00:57:52.440 --> 00:57:57.080 you know the the conversations about weaponizing and who does what let the ethics and legality 00:57:57.080 --> 00:58:04.520 whatever i i that's in my my i am always more uh bull in that situation than bear let's uh let's 00:58:04.520 --> 00:58:10.520 let's be aggressive and do whatever we can for the kingdom until we can't do it for the kingdom anymore 00:58:10.520 --> 00:58:17.880 and so i i do agree sorry to interrupt go no no please go yeah i want to i want to uh pull on that 00:58:17.880 --> 00:58:25.880 thread a little bit because i think there is like this um you know risk aversion right over the top 00:58:25.880 --> 00:58:30.920 risk aversion in ministry and i just want to call out you know that i i agree with you on this jeff 00:58:30.920 --> 00:58:38.120 like you know the the the early church was not conservative in their you know risk assessment like 00:58:38.120 --> 00:58:44.280 they you know martyrs right like they were dying for what you know and i'm and i'm not saying that 00:58:44.280 --> 00:58:50.200 we ought to be you know um cavalier or anything like that but it's also i think the opposite extreme 00:58:50.200 --> 00:58:56.840 is extremely harmful right like we you know jesus does not call us to be you know risk averse like 00:58:56.840 --> 00:59:01.400 the uh the the parable of the talents comes to mind right like the the the servant who buries his 00:59:01.400 --> 00:59:05.640 treasure right on the ground like that that was not rewarded by christ right it was it was or the 00:59:05.640 --> 00:59:09.960 master in that in that parable right like what was rewarded was like somebody take a measured you 00:59:09.960 --> 00:59:15.000 know investment and in in you know in that case financial but but also like i want to encourage 00:59:15.000 --> 00:59:20.760 everyone like like take risks for the gospel right like that's that's how the kingdom grows right not 00:59:20.760 --> 00:59:25.880 just by keeping it you know to ourselves or or or you know always being so risk averse but but i think 00:59:25.880 --> 00:59:31.640 we do need to to within reason take take risks for spreading the gospel i think that's that's how the kingdom grows 00:59:31.640 --> 00:59:37.480 yeah and that that surprises me a little bit like if i can just poke that bear a little bit it surprises 00:59:37.480 --> 00:59:46.200 me that you have uh more success in the u.s maybe it's based on your exposure than you do globally i i at 00:59:46.200 --> 00:59:54.440 a personal level i have found the global audience far more aggressive um than the u.s audience mostly 00:59:54.440 --> 01:00:00.120 based because globally we're working with more missionaries and global missions organizations and 01:00:00.760 --> 01:00:06.680 and in the u.s we're working with more churches and as near as i can tell uh missiology is far 01:00:06.680 --> 01:00:12.040 more aggressive than ecclesiology uh and and as a result of that like the missions organizations 01:00:12.040 --> 01:00:20.200 globally are like let's go let's go let's go u.s or u.s churches are like much more um cautious is the 01:00:20.200 --> 01:00:26.920 safe word to use there but anyway for what it's worth my uh my uh opinions from the side and once 01:00:26.920 --> 01:00:32.280 again if you have hate mail on that you can at andy at the church digital andy would love to hear from 01:00:32.280 --> 01:00:41.320 you on that um hey this has been a blast man uh jake i am so glad we got to do that and i was wanting 01:00:41.320 --> 01:00:47.080 to crack a joke at the beginning where i would call you jake from state farm and i'm proud that i made it 01:00:47.080 --> 01:00:53.080 all the way to the end without making that that inappropriate joke and so not wearing khakis just 01:00:53.080 --> 01:01:00.200 in case you're wondering no khakis was it a red shirt that he always wears whatever and so that's 01:01:00.200 --> 01:01:06.600 funny awesome well hey this has been a blast um as we're landing the plane here jake any uh any closing 01:01:06.600 --> 01:01:11.560 thoughts yeah i just uh i just want to encourage you all i think you know that the the work that 01:01:11.560 --> 01:01:17.800 jeff's doing at the church digital is just fabulous right so i think i think you know um you know if i 01:01:17.800 --> 01:01:23.160 could leave you with anything um it's kind of our our motto which is meet them where they are and you 01:01:23.160 --> 01:01:27.480 know meeting them where they are you know traditionally would mean you know where they are on their spiritual 01:01:27.480 --> 01:01:30.920 journey and then sometimes it's taken to mean you know kind of where they are geographically but let's 01:01:30.920 --> 01:01:38.760 not forget um i think the the the primary frontier right now is digital and um you know we're working 01:01:38.760 --> 01:01:44.440 hard to meet them where they are through wherever they hang out you know in the digital space so i just 01:01:44.440 --> 01:01:50.200 want to encourage all of you to to to continue to think through that and and find innovative ways to 01:01:50.840 --> 01:01:57.640 minister to folks in digital spaces oh i i love that thank you for that uh jake you can find uh 01:01:57.640 --> 01:02:07.080 apologistproject.org and uh apologist.ai to interact directly with the artificial intelligence 01:02:07.080 --> 01:02:13.880 jake carlson founder of uh apologist.org jake thanks for coming on man this has been a blast but 01:02:13.880 --> 01:02:17.480 uh we're gonna land the plane for jake this is jeff with the church digital thanks for hanging 01:02:17.480 --> 01:02:20.760 out with us today on the show we'll see you next time on the stream have a good one 01:02:20.840 --> 01:02:22.840 time on the stream have a good one and i'll see you next time on the stream have a good one and i'll see you next time on the stream.