WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:08.000 all right hey everybody welcome to the church digital podcast uh i you know oh my gosh i don't 00:00:08.000 --> 00:00:16.560 even know what i can never keep track of is this episode 373 363 999 i literally cannot remember 00:00:16.560 --> 00:00:24.380 what number i am except what the calendar tells me 362 this is episode 362 uh we're coming up on 00:00:24.380 --> 00:00:29.580 a full year of podcast episodes right around the corner god bless you if you could listen to me one 00:00:29.580 --> 00:00:35.020 hour a day for a full year i don't know that you would be any smarter but that may be a conversation 00:00:35.020 --> 00:00:43.460 for a different day all right hey listen today this episode we are celebrating control alt recover uh 00:00:43.460 --> 00:00:50.180 our second uh digital missionary summit that we did here in the fall we're excited about what's 00:00:50.180 --> 00:00:57.080 happening we've got europe coming up next week but right here today i want to bring on uh stacy hey 00:00:57.080 --> 00:01:05.360 stacy how are you doing great thank you thank you stacy is uh is our uh care director of care a 00:01:05.360 --> 00:01:10.240 chaplain uh for the for the church digital and and really just played a crucial role in putting 00:01:10.240 --> 00:01:18.220 together the uh control alt recover our our digital christ-centered recovery conference uh that we 00:01:18.220 --> 00:01:25.300 hosted uh yesterday uh and so we've we've got uh we've got conrad cooper session they'll be coming up 00:01:25.300 --> 00:01:30.580 here in a little bit but want to take a minute or two maybe celebrate some some wins get some initial 00:01:30.580 --> 00:01:36.420 opinions on the conference and thoughts and uh recollections from from yesterday and so stacy 00:01:36.420 --> 00:01:42.880 first off welcome back to the show thank you so much great to be here oh i always love our 00:01:42.880 --> 00:01:49.060 conversations good totally 100 and if you're watching currently live in the audience uh we're 00:01:49.060 --> 00:01:57.240 gonna ignore you because we are doing this pre-recorded 100 psych it's on you no no in all seriousness i've 00:01:57.240 --> 00:02:04.420 never done i don't like doing this but scheduling's just didn't it did not work anywhere and i really 00:02:04.420 --> 00:02:10.640 wanted stacy to be a part of this and so i literally rolled out of bed uh threw on a shirt and was like 00:02:10.640 --> 00:02:16.460 okay let's actually do the recording uh which considering um east coast and and stacy's you 00:02:16.460 --> 00:02:21.680 know oh dark 30 where she's at thank you stacy for for coming on this show and being with us 00:02:21.680 --> 00:02:29.920 so good to do this so stacy yeah tell us like initial uh thoughts opinions like what'd you think of 00:02:29.920 --> 00:02:38.460 the conference yesterday what went well i would see there was i think uh mind's blown you know some 00:02:38.460 --> 00:02:46.260 people are saying how much that it impacted them um sepi's story of transformation um and i think 00:02:46.260 --> 00:02:55.680 what really was compelling was her honesty and and transparency and um which for those of us who are 00:02:55.680 --> 00:03:03.320 ministering anywhere in a digital space or anywhere else is caught hard it's a challenge to be that 00:03:03.320 --> 00:03:07.280 transparent and honest i mean who can you talk to you're not going to talk to the people you serve 00:03:07.280 --> 00:03:13.340 i mean you want to be honest but not with the deep hard traumatic things that have happened in your life 00:03:13.340 --> 00:03:21.020 so um but we do need that and so that's what i'm really excited about us tcd providing that 00:03:21.020 --> 00:03:31.300 space care a culture of uh of recovery uh and so yeah that that was a big big i think moment for 00:03:31.300 --> 00:03:38.220 a number of people like in the chat were saying yeah like we need honesty we need this we need this 00:03:38.220 --> 00:03:46.380 transparency sepi's story was um it was it was funny we weren't planning on opening the conference with 00:03:46.380 --> 00:03:52.460 with that story we had some technical issues the internet broke on us uh literal internet broke on 00:03:52.460 --> 00:04:00.980 us in that situation um i just had to to adapt and so we we moved sepi's story early and uh just an 00:04:00.980 --> 00:04:09.220 incredible story of um of of brokenness and then you know it's it's it's maybe sounds like cliche but 00:04:09.220 --> 00:04:16.820 like the restoration after the brokenness and then gal god is is using you and using her and amplified her 00:04:16.820 --> 00:04:23.120 through that through that restoration like the the brokenness was was not the end of the journey the 00:04:23.120 --> 00:04:30.700 brokenness was really the beginning of of her journey and how god uh rebuilt her restored her and then 00:04:30.700 --> 00:04:36.500 amplified her her ministry after the fact amplified's a good word amplified's a good word you know she 00:04:36.500 --> 00:04:44.100 shared with me how she's just seeing in her obedience to the lord that she's she knows she needs to share 00:04:44.100 --> 00:04:48.580 her story she didn't know what that was going to look like but here she is on a global scale 00:04:49.540 --> 00:04:55.380 you know she was i think she mentioned she was working or yeah with focus on the family in africa 00:04:56.020 --> 00:05:05.380 and then it went there her story was shared there and then um and then here we are on tcd global you know 00:05:05.380 --> 00:05:12.020 and i was getting feedback from some people from tcd that are in southern california and just even at 00:05:12.020 --> 00:05:20.420 the very end i got a message of uh at the end of sepi's testimony someone sent me a message to say how 00:05:21.140 --> 00:05:26.740 compelling it was and she's so thankful that she attended you know at least just to hear 00:05:27.460 --> 00:05:33.300 sepi's story you know that really set a tone though right it it sets it set a tone though it was not 00:05:33.300 --> 00:05:40.580 planned for her to go first but that set a tone for the rest of the conference to say no this is what 00:05:40.580 --> 00:05:48.100 we're this is this is not just another story you know this is part of this is gonna be part of our 00:05:48.100 --> 00:05:59.220 story for tcd story of our culture and what we're going to nurture um within tcd yeah brokenness 00:05:59.220 --> 00:06:06.820 vulnerability transparency um you know first off i've i've biblically and i've actually have done some 00:06:06.820 --> 00:06:14.100 look into this god never breaks things and and rebuilds it exactly the same way like in in biblically 00:06:14.100 --> 00:06:20.180 we never see that story we see where things are broken and then they're rebuilt in in a different 00:06:20.180 --> 00:06:28.660 way to be utilized better by god and so the uh to be broken in some of these situations like like 00:06:28.660 --> 00:06:35.220 sepi and sepi's story and and and you know even in in my restoration story of of and being being 00:06:35.220 --> 00:06:43.780 broken and being remolded being reshaped being uh refiners fire burning out the the impurities 00:06:43.780 --> 00:06:50.820 uh like these things are are are crucial to be used by god in in physical space yes but even even 00:06:50.820 --> 00:06:59.380 even digitally and oh by the way being uh vulnerable in in digital environment makes uh makes you so much 00:06:59.380 --> 00:07:05.860 more endearing as digital missionary yeah makes you yeah so much more open uh which allows for 00:07:06.420 --> 00:07:13.460 heartfelt conversations i understand the the the pain that that you're feeling i understand this because i've 00:07:13.460 --> 00:07:19.700 i've struggled with it too like there's there's such an a connection point relationally to be able to 00:07:19.700 --> 00:07:26.980 engage with people as digital missionaries um understanding this and being able to uh to deal with that 00:07:26.980 --> 00:07:34.420 have you experienced anything like that or know of people who have oh yeah absolutely i i um gosh my 00:07:34.420 --> 00:07:44.660 first 12 steps experience i think was 2009 maybe maybe 2011 that that time and i didn't know i didn't know 00:07:44.660 --> 00:07:51.220 what it was about it's just that someone at the church um said oh we have we have a recovery ministry 00:07:51.220 --> 00:08:00.020 here and what was really like a really um powerful moment for me was that the pastor senior pastor lead 00:08:00.020 --> 00:08:06.020 pastor would join us but he wouldn't join us for the group you know because he's but he'd join us for 00:08:06.020 --> 00:08:13.380 the meal that we'd have before our group and he'd talk about cr and um that the you know with cr celebrate 00:08:13.380 --> 00:08:20.260 recovery but the the uh for him though at that time there wasn't a 12 steps community for leaders senior 00:08:20.260 --> 00:08:28.660 leaders and so um but the fact that he wanted to be so connected with us even though he couldn't join us 00:08:29.380 --> 00:08:33.860 that that said something like i took took note of that i observed that and i thought 00:08:34.420 --> 00:08:42.420 hmm when a leader senior leader wants to be transparent and open and honest um 00:08:43.940 --> 00:08:50.100 that that was yeah that was a big observation for me and said okay i think i need to 00:08:50.100 --> 00:08:59.140 check this out you know and and then um yes and i my eyes were so open i got even 00:08:59.140 --> 00:09:05.300 the going through the 12 steps the first time around that was just scratching the surface right and um 00:09:05.300 --> 00:09:13.860 i discovered my my identity was found in how much i served and how much i needed to or or kind of um 00:09:14.500 --> 00:09:23.140 making like a tally you know of opportunities of when i served so i never said no i did not know 00:09:23.140 --> 00:09:28.900 the word no i said yes to whatever anyone said hey sure okay why not 00:09:28.900 --> 00:09:33.860 yeah i yeah i yeah and that time was single and i have kids you know i didn't don't have kids so 00:09:33.860 --> 00:09:41.540 i um i believed that it's just distorted thinking that because i'm i don't have those responsibilities 00:09:41.540 --> 00:09:54.180 that um then i i i have to say yes it was um you know it's uh putting my my need to serve an affirmation 00:09:55.380 --> 00:10:02.820 um in the place of god himself like that that was my affection right my affection was 00:10:03.940 --> 00:10:13.380 it was not just saying yes but people happy that i said yes yeah man replacing god itself we're going 00:10:13.380 --> 00:10:18.980 in some heady topics really really quickly or we're cutting yeah well you know and and that's that was 00:10:18.980 --> 00:10:23.700 the beginning of my journey where i said that those are two different things serving and then my 00:10:23.700 --> 00:10:32.420 affection for jesus two different things and um it's out of overflow right we serve but also i didn't know 00:10:32.420 --> 00:10:40.340 the work you know i didn't know about being responsible for uh my time my energy being a good steward 00:10:41.380 --> 00:10:46.980 of my body all those things i just didn't understand until i started the recovery journey 00:10:46.980 --> 00:10:57.220 um yeah it it's i i'd say i worshiped um i worshiped the act of service 00:10:59.300 --> 00:11:07.140 and um you know there's all the underlying issues you know of why that is why that happened why that was 00:11:07.140 --> 00:11:15.860 such a um just a really deep part of me that i thought i was supposed to be good i believed i believe the 00:11:15.860 --> 00:11:26.980 church culture was about just serving and it's it's not it's abide in me like jesus says abide in me 00:11:26.980 --> 00:11:34.180 then you'll bear much fruit but i was just the appearance perception of bearing fruit is what i 00:11:34.180 --> 00:11:39.780 was doing that's that's interesting yeah there was a it was one of the best lines from the conference 00:11:39.780 --> 00:11:46.420 um yesterday for me uh was conrad cooper we're going to show his section here in in a little bit but 00:11:46.420 --> 00:11:54.580 when he said um you know the the the church you know itself has has a recovery problem it's it's not 00:11:54.580 --> 00:12:02.100 individuals it's it's the the you know the big c church may be here in in 2025 and and actually it 00:12:02.100 --> 00:12:10.340 was funny i i actually saw you know he he talked about how six of seven pastors had um had uh either 00:12:10.340 --> 00:12:15.620 a current issue with pornography or a previous issue of pornography and it was funny like you know 00:12:15.620 --> 00:12:21.700 that's 83 of pastors if my math is correct and and in my lifetime a guy that spent 30 plus years 00:12:21.700 --> 00:12:26.900 working closely with pastors i i can barely think of five pastors in my life who have even 00:12:26.900 --> 00:12:32.260 had a conversation or i've heard say the word pornography like yeah it is literally that the 00:12:32.260 --> 00:12:38.900 the church is best kept secret unfortunately in in this situation and it was actually it was in my life 00:12:38.900 --> 00:12:47.220 i saw this yesterday um conrad conrad was on stage and i was was off stage and i got a text from a 00:12:47.220 --> 00:12:54.340 a couple pastors i'm working with currently and uh and one of them texted uh hey you know at a physical 00:12:54.340 --> 00:12:59.140 church pastor that physical church here in my oh yeah and a couple of them texted uh you just checking 00:12:59.140 --> 00:13:05.620 in how the conference is going and in a kind of quipped back via text oh just some south african 00:13:05.620 --> 00:13:13.780 guy on stage right now talking about porn addiction and um literally one of the pastors is like wow you 00:13:13.780 --> 00:13:18.900 don't hear that every day and it's just because it's it's it's like it's it's been the uh you're not 00:13:18.900 --> 00:13:24.260 allowed to talk about it you're not not allowed to uh to to recognize that and it's a church culture 00:13:24.260 --> 00:13:31.620 like i i shared yesterday in my own life where um you know early on in in my ministry career i i was i was 00:13:31.620 --> 00:13:37.860 told hey if if you're if you're struggling with addictive behaviors uh quit your job and leave 00:13:37.860 --> 00:13:44.980 the church because we don't want you to mess up what god is doing here and and while that 00:13:46.820 --> 00:13:54.740 you know that's an unfortunate reality that that many uh pastors are are are under uh that's a many 00:13:54.740 --> 00:14:00.340 it's a really a struggle of of where the church is and you know maybe the church does need to 00:14:00.980 --> 00:14:08.820 have a session of recovery a season to recover from some some of these these bad ideologies it 00:14:08.820 --> 00:14:14.980 was there as a barna stat that just came out like 65 75 percent of pastors think about quitting every 00:14:14.980 --> 00:14:21.540 year well with uh the pressure and the onus of perfection and and not actually allowed to be 00:14:21.540 --> 00:14:27.540 human and not having anyone around them that they can trust to have hard conversations like this 00:14:27.540 --> 00:14:31.460 is there any wonder they they're thinking about quitting at such a high level every year 00:14:32.020 --> 00:14:40.420 uh and so yeah it's it's just it's amazing to me um how much uh the the church has kind of painted 00:14:40.420 --> 00:14:48.340 itself into a corner not ready to embrace some of these these realities of today and heaven forbid that we 00:14:48.340 --> 00:15:00.100 actually rest as ministers that we actually honor sabbath yeah but i mean we're not good at that 00:15:00.100 --> 00:15:07.300 yeah i actually i had a i know it's it's true a good friend of mine a pastor at a church um he had 00:15:07.300 --> 00:15:14.340 earned a sabbatical which was i think in his context six to eight weeks off and he worked an additional 00:15:14.340 --> 00:15:21.060 three years before he took that sabbatical time he because according to him there was never a good 00:15:21.060 --> 00:15:28.580 time to take it honest to god true story right hand up uh he he had not told his wife he had earned the 00:15:28.580 --> 00:15:34.420 sabbatical had not communicated like that was that was an issue uh that he had earned earned the sabbatical 00:15:34.420 --> 00:15:40.100 and his wife had no idea uh and and it was it went when when crap came out it was it was a it was a 00:15:40.100 --> 00:15:45.700 difficult season but i mean that's that's just somewhat that's this that's that's like the the 00:15:45.700 --> 00:15:52.100 the the wall over the the what's the saying there it's it's like the you're being blinded to it hey 00:15:52.100 --> 00:15:58.020 you know i'm doing everything i can for for god i'm working for the the the penultimate reason 00:15:58.020 --> 00:16:02.580 everything for the kingdom everything short of sin like we we've even said that here here on the stream 00:16:02.580 --> 00:16:07.060 you know let's go um you know it's better to burn out than rust out you know some some of that 00:16:07.060 --> 00:16:14.500 ideology uh but what happens as as a result of that is uh you know you you experience it we heard about 00:16:14.500 --> 00:16:21.860 this from laura howe yesterday in the conference a lot of that uh compassion fatigue uh burnout uh 00:16:21.860 --> 00:16:29.060 exhaustion um you know shoot i had a conference yesterday and and i'm i'm exhausted and and i've got 00:16:29.060 --> 00:16:34.820 bronchitis i'm coughing up phlegm and and and like my body just took a toll on on one day sorry for that 00:16:34.820 --> 00:16:43.620 that was gross but to be able to to do this over like years and years and just being beat down um and 00:16:43.620 --> 00:16:50.820 yes jesus is there and and and we have that that connection but sometimes a physical connection or we need 00:16:50.820 --> 00:16:57.140 people around us to speak the truth of jesus in our lives but we don't we don't trust the people around 00:16:57.140 --> 00:17:02.980 us enough to be vulnerable to to share with them what's really going on in our lives yeah when we 00:17:02.980 --> 00:17:10.340 talk about nurturing that culture you know it does it starts from the top it starts with us as ministers 00:17:10.340 --> 00:17:17.540 and then and i i think that's and it's not about pointing the finger at the church right i growing 00:17:17.540 --> 00:17:23.780 growing up that's that's what it was you know i'm thinking about 80s the 80s and 90s how we're because 00:17:23.780 --> 00:17:32.660 we're it it's output it's it's getting things out there it's uh but it's not but we keep things hidden 00:17:32.660 --> 00:17:42.580 hidden but pain the pain the sorrow uh the trauma we've experienced you know um you know where we have 00:17:42.580 --> 00:17:53.860 not nurtured that environment to the transparency and care and talk through things and um hey let's let 00:17:53.860 --> 00:18:02.500 let's have a care groups but hey if you need to seek out a therapist counselor you know by all means 00:18:02.500 --> 00:18:09.540 let's let's let's get you let's get help when when i put together the conference and when we put together 00:18:09.540 --> 00:18:17.060 the conference the speakers like it for me it was i thought we would be talking more about creating a 00:18:17.060 --> 00:18:23.620 culture of recovery and how to address it at an organizational level what and even like some of 00:18:23.620 --> 00:18:31.860 the questions of the people that were talking and coming in it was it was not um it really wasn't as 00:18:31.860 --> 00:18:39.620 much culture as much as it was individuals like that was kind of that was a huh i didn't anticipate that 00:18:39.620 --> 00:18:46.580 where it was it was not uh like how to get your organization and saying recovery it's hey i'm struggling with this 00:18:46.580 --> 00:18:54.980 one of the questions yesterday was at what point is it an addiction uh versus just a um a a regular 00:18:55.540 --> 00:19:01.860 sin or or like just a mistake like at what point how many times do you have to sin to have the sin 00:19:01.860 --> 00:19:07.940 become an addiction as opposed to you know not and i was like does it was does it matter like you know 00:19:07.940 --> 00:19:13.460 even if it's once you're addicted to something like acknowledge that and embrace like say it and and 00:19:13.460 --> 00:19:20.340 allow god to work through the acknowledgement of it stop trying to justify i'm not as bad as i think i 00:19:20.340 --> 00:19:26.020 am um it's it's really not that bad it's just like i'm i'm trying to think like it's so it's just in 00:19:26.020 --> 00:19:32.180 this moment you know david's up up on the on the roof with basheba oh i can look i can look once i just 00:19:32.180 --> 00:19:37.140 like it needs to be a really long look i can't look oh i looked a second time okay all right no a 00:19:37.140 --> 00:19:42.420 third time that's where it's oh i should reach out no no no no no you know it's it's like you got a 00:19:42.420 --> 00:19:47.060 problem and it's okay to have a problem by admitting you have the problem you work through the problem 00:19:48.420 --> 00:19:54.420 sorry right yeah no that's how it's no but it was but that's what it is it's like well you got to ask 00:19:54.420 --> 00:20:01.780 if you have to ask you know it's like you know you know and it's okay that's the thing i wanted to say 00:20:01.780 --> 00:20:08.980 to that person like good for you though i mean like you know here you are asking the question at least 00:20:08.980 --> 00:20:17.060 that you know while the while here some of us are just holding it inside and we'll hold it for years 00:20:17.060 --> 00:20:27.700 till the day we die you know so or or it's it implodes right it implodes yeah it's for those that 00:20:27.700 --> 00:20:34.340 that have the courage to rebuild without crashing like you know there was a graphic we shared maybe it's 00:20:34.340 --> 00:20:40.340 time to reboot without the crash like if you cannot have your if you can correct the issue without 00:20:40.340 --> 00:20:47.060 self-destructing that's that's a that's a that's a great place to be have the courage to acknowledge 00:20:47.060 --> 00:20:52.980 some of these things in your life bring the people around you you know i lived in fear of i i didn't 00:20:52.980 --> 00:21:00.020 want the people around me to know this um well when the crash came the people around me found out and 00:21:00.660 --> 00:21:09.300 much better it's much better to deal with it in in like hey i have the courage i i have the strength 00:21:09.300 --> 00:21:16.100 to manage this on my own through god uh we're gonna tackle this this together rather than saying and my 00:21:16.100 --> 00:21:24.180 life is now over i i am i am totally at rock bottom here so so have the have the strength uh to do some 00:21:24.180 --> 00:21:29.540 of that at least that would be my my prayer and encouragement for you but what all this told us at 00:21:29.540 --> 00:21:38.500 the individual level is that tcd the path that we're on for care uh for recovery um for you know even 00:21:38.500 --> 00:21:44.020 you know we've been talking about the word thriving like creating a thriving uh digital missionary and 00:21:44.020 --> 00:21:50.340 helping provide training and coaching for that and in peer-to-peer support and in beyond like we're on 00:21:50.340 --> 00:21:59.460 the right path as as we're trying to to help people um take these next steps in in once again i said 00:21:59.460 --> 00:22:04.180 earlier yesterday in in the conference if we're going to shine the light in the digital darkness 00:22:04.180 --> 00:22:09.860 we've got to be aware that that light's going to be shining on us and to be vulnerable and transparent 00:22:09.860 --> 00:22:17.860 to address where we are so that we can help others that are in a similar position uh that is that's a 00:22:17.860 --> 00:22:23.540 place that that are the church digital missionaries that once connected with us they need to they need 00:22:23.540 --> 00:22:29.700 to see they need to represent they need to to know and so that would be my challenge for you 00:22:30.660 --> 00:22:36.660 out there watching this is is to maybe listen to some as we're transitioning over comrade cooper in 00:22:36.660 --> 00:22:43.060 a second he's doing his keynote talk um as we're recognizing some of the issues and struggles right 00:22:43.060 --> 00:22:50.340 now and with the big uh you know big c church the u.s church wherever comrade cooper's in south africa 00:22:50.340 --> 00:22:54.580 so he's not even talking about the u.s church he's just talking about the church as we're talking about 00:22:54.580 --> 00:23:00.260 the church in general today and some of the stigmas that that they're wrestling with um you know maybe 00:23:00.260 --> 00:23:06.980 there's there's a a challenge for you at the individual level to to start to recognize who 00:23:06.980 --> 00:23:16.420 can you influence uh for the kingdom and are you in a position where you can influence them or do you 00:23:16.420 --> 00:23:23.220 need to address some of the issues that you have in in your life in such a way know that we the church 00:23:23.220 --> 00:23:30.820 digital we we care for you we want to be there for you we are rolling out a recovery program where 00:23:30.820 --> 00:23:37.380 our leadership's going through it right now in in 25 we're going to start some betas in 26 stacy's uh 00:23:37.380 --> 00:23:44.180 and and her team are championing that the church.digital recovery you can check out that webpage the church.digital 00:23:44.180 --> 00:23:51.300 slash recovery uh and that that some more information is is there on that you know stacy i know we got to 00:23:51.300 --> 00:23:57.300 cut this session short but as as we're wrapping up here on your side any closing thoughts yeah the 00:23:57.300 --> 00:24:04.660 invitation the invitation is and i totally wholeheartedly believe this is from this is jesus jesus's invitation to 00:24:04.660 --> 00:24:14.420 you is to consider to consider um you know the investment of time and effort doing doing the inner 00:24:14.420 --> 00:24:24.020 work in recovery um so that we bear much fruit this is part of to me abiding abiding in him um that we 00:24:24.020 --> 00:24:34.340 will always put him first our affection to him solely is first one and only not the fruit and so please 00:24:35.700 --> 00:24:43.540 consider the this invitation to join us beautiful so with that i'm going to hand it over to conrad cooper 00:24:43.540 --> 00:24:52.580 from the conference yesterday uh conrad cooper is uh founder and executive director of project exodus one of 00:24:52.580 --> 00:24:57.220 the organizations that we're partnering very closely with and so we're going to open up with a three 00:24:57.220 --> 00:25:06.420 minute video on project exodus and then that'll transition into uh conrad cooper's talk uh titled 00:25:06.420 --> 00:25:13.700 uh recovery rewired so let me go hand it over to uh to the video and thanks y'all see you next time 00:25:16.260 --> 00:25:20.420 addiction and mental health challenges don't stop at destroying individual lives 00:25:20.980 --> 00:25:27.860 the effect spreads to families and whole communities and yet most people suffer in silence 00:25:28.500 --> 00:25:33.620 nearly two-thirds of youth and young adults report watching pornography on a weekly basis 00:25:34.180 --> 00:25:41.780 over the past decade global drug usage has surged by 23 percent and yet 90 of those who need help never 00:25:41.780 --> 00:25:50.580 receive it despite this grim reality change is possible recovery is possible but it requires support 00:25:50.580 --> 00:25:58.980 no one should do it alone solution can be found in the church with its reach infrastructure and heart 00:25:58.980 --> 00:26:05.540 the church is uniquely positioned to make a profound and lasting difference as the body of christ we're 00:26:05.540 --> 00:26:11.700 called to take action we've been commissioned to bring hope to the hopeless healing to the broken and 00:26:11.700 --> 00:26:18.420 freedom to the captives but many churches and organizations can feel overwhelmed and ill-equipped 00:26:19.140 --> 00:26:24.260 unsure where to start or how to sustain recovery efforts until now 00:26:31.220 --> 00:26:38.260 built on the foundation of god's word project exodus is a non-profit recovery ministry empowering your 00:26:38.260 --> 00:26:46.820 church with effective and innovative recovery strategies our recovery tools are biblically based and life-giving 00:26:46.820 --> 00:26:53.700 bringing real and lasting change through our web platform bridge and our online academy 00:26:53.700 --> 00:27:00.740 you'll gain access to all the resources training and support needed to lead life-saving recovery groups 00:27:00.740 --> 00:27:08.340 and programs whether addressing addiction and supporter recovery mental health recovery or pornography 00:27:08.340 --> 00:27:16.420 recovery our solutions are accessible scalable and sustainable designed to meet people where they are and 00:27:16.420 --> 00:27:23.620 guide them forward if you have the heart to help our step-by-step process will empower you previous 00:27:23.620 --> 00:27:35.700 experience is not required simply sign up get certified and launch your group this isn't just theory decades of 00:27:35.700 --> 00:27:43.540 experience inform our evidence-based strategies empowering churches to build cultures of recovery that transform homes 00:27:43.540 --> 00:27:49.860 their communities and their communities and their communities and communities you see the need is urgent and the solution 00:27:49.860 --> 00:27:57.700 starts with you with the right tools and support you can take action and make a difference together we can grow 00:27:57.700 --> 00:28:08.900 and control a culture of recovery one person one church and one community at a time 00:28:08.900 --> 00:28:10.900 so 00:28:10.900 --> 00:28:32.820 hi guys a good day all from south africa a good evening to you um from our perspective here 00:28:32.820 --> 00:28:49.540 it's now sitting at 18 30 pm i'm speaking from a small town down in the south coast i'm called george and 00:28:49.540 --> 00:28:56.020 our team is also based in durban and around the country as well as in some places internationally but 00:28:56.020 --> 00:29:01.220 uh first i just want to give you greetings from south africa um no it's not as bad as it's made out to 00:29:01.220 --> 00:29:07.700 be in the states um and absolutely amazing and and beautiful countryside and we are determined to embrace 00:29:07.700 --> 00:29:14.660 change uh and to do the things that need to be done uh to seize the kingdom so yeah just a shout out to 00:29:14.660 --> 00:29:21.860 to to to jeff um and church digital amazing to work with you guys uh we spent some good time together not nearly enough 00:29:21.860 --> 00:29:27.060 um at times we wish to be in person just so one can give you a good hug and a pat on the 00:29:27.060 --> 00:29:29.620 back for the work and the initiatives that you're grabbing onto 00:29:29.620 --> 00:29:35.380 so uh well done thank you for the honor and privilege of being here so yeah i'm excited to 00:29:35.380 --> 00:29:44.660 move along so excuse me uh by god's grace um i've been in recovery 25 and a half years going on 26 years 00:29:44.660 --> 00:29:50.340 and um yeah it's it's uh it's been a journey it indeed has been a journey it started off on 00:29:50.340 --> 00:29:55.540 the 2nd of january 2000 after many years caught up in addiction and we've all got our war stories and 00:29:55.540 --> 00:30:01.380 uh there's no need to reiterate what those are and uh i think for each of us um it's our it's the 00:30:01.380 --> 00:30:07.620 own our own cross and our own process and each one that carries the pain um carries it uh without 00:30:07.620 --> 00:30:13.620 comparison to another but yeah my journey ended up in hillbrown getting shot and i'm eventually sitting 00:30:13.620 --> 00:30:18.420 in a in a crack house in a rather dangerous part of johannesburg on the 2nd of january 2000 00:30:18.420 --> 00:30:24.660 uh and i woke up desperate uh just like i couldn't anymore i've been trying for for for years to get 00:30:24.660 --> 00:30:30.260 this thing right in and out of rehab um and really just couldn't manage to get myself out and um yeah 00:30:30.260 --> 00:30:36.500 i cried out to god and ended up in an amazing church ramer church that's a sunday morning 2nd of january 00:30:36.500 --> 00:30:42.900 2000 i gave my uh life to the lord and ended up going straight back to yeah the dodgiest part of 00:30:42.900 --> 00:30:48.980 johannesburg that you can ever think of um however for the next 18 days he just slammed door shut and 00:30:49.460 --> 00:30:56.180 blocked my way and i found myself checking into a really hardcore christian rehabilitation center i 00:30:56.180 --> 00:31:02.740 thought well that that we get too easily we esteem too lightly um so i picked the hard way to get things 00:31:02.740 --> 00:31:10.260 done and um god did what he does best he just moved and shifted my life around um and um you are the journey 00:31:10.260 --> 00:31:17.060 of restoration and the journey of healing um started that day um that i i left there and as i left the 00:31:17.060 --> 00:31:22.740 treatment center um there i will never forget that there was a picture of a man of of the sun coming 00:31:22.740 --> 00:31:27.540 up from from behind the mountain not actually a picture the real thing um and god spoke to me clearly 00:31:27.540 --> 00:31:33.620 and he said uh i'm needing to open a rehabilitation center and i i debated with him like like who is this 00:31:33.620 --> 00:31:38.980 speaking to me i had no experience of that at that point in time and uh yeah i'd been in the motor 00:31:38.980 --> 00:31:43.460 industry and done a while at time but had no experience in recovery at yet at that stage 00:31:43.940 --> 00:31:50.180 um so yeah i ended up a a short while later um yeah being obedient and opening up a treatment center 00:31:50.180 --> 00:31:55.300 that went on to become a flagship treatment sentence the african internationally uh which i ran for some 00:31:55.300 --> 00:32:02.660 uh with with some amazing people and family for 18 years and uh we we yeah we we really changed the way 00:32:02.660 --> 00:32:08.180 we wanted to do recovery and the way that we believe recovery should be done um you know he shouted out 00:32:08.180 --> 00:32:14.100 like you know who can i send you know um and when we put our hands up to say here i am it's quite hard 00:32:14.100 --> 00:32:18.820 to pull them back down but uh more importantly he also goes on to say behold i'm doing a new thing 00:32:18.820 --> 00:32:23.780 can you not feel it can you not see it can you not perceive it um and i see that's what's happening 00:32:23.780 --> 00:32:30.660 here to today um on control alt delete um to see this church digital recovery initiative really taking 00:32:30.660 --> 00:32:36.980 um taking taking ground and and really seizing the territory so yeah south coast went on to become 00:32:36.980 --> 00:32:42.580 an amazing an amazing facility that uh really taught us how to do things in a in a different manner 00:32:42.580 --> 00:32:49.140 uh i mean it really brought home um it really brought home a situation that are averse that 00:32:49.140 --> 00:32:56.180 i really wanted i just um draw attention to that um 2 corinthians 12 7 and when it says that that 00:32:56.180 --> 00:33:01.300 in our weakness and his strength is perfected it really goes on further to say that the power 00:33:01.300 --> 00:33:07.540 and the authority of the grace of the creator of the universe rests upon us i mean in our weakness 00:33:07.540 --> 00:33:13.620 his strength is perfected and i just felt um really strongly today that um we we are very definitely 00:33:13.620 --> 00:33:19.220 those that are called to more and called into that space of really getting the work done and not just 00:33:19.220 --> 00:33:24.260 being mere spectators but really understanding that there's a whole lot of work that needs to be done 00:33:24.260 --> 00:33:31.860 um and best that we do it ourselves and with immediacy cool um corin can just jump me back onto the slides there you 00:33:31.860 --> 00:33:37.540 know so today we we're going to be speaking about dismantling and helpful narratives i'm trying to 00:33:37.540 --> 00:33:43.460 challenge the outdated strategies as he laid out my heart some 20 years ago 25 years ago that we're 00:33:43.460 --> 00:33:48.580 needing to do a new thing and create a new way that the success rates that were being demonstrated in 00:33:48.580 --> 00:33:54.500 treatment centers um internationally not only in south africa but um you know from systems that had been 00:33:54.500 --> 00:33:59.700 developed many many years ago that really we needed to push into the word and to create something fresh and 00:33:59.700 --> 00:34:07.060 new um and absolutely to you know deliberate to to what he's doing so um with uh the that process we 00:34:07.060 --> 00:34:13.780 um also looking just how the church can change um and understand that actually um addiction is out there 00:34:13.780 --> 00:34:24.580 not in here so when we say that is not in here um sorry just one second if i may please um great sorry 00:34:24.580 --> 00:34:29.860 my feed just jumped there a second um with it with the understanding the addiction's not out there it's 00:34:29.860 --> 00:34:37.700 right in here it's with us it's online with us um being online in itself um is a really present um process 00:34:37.700 --> 00:34:43.620 that we all experience to the point of asking ourselves that you know should we um take our devices or 00:34:43.620 --> 00:34:48.820 our connectivity away what kind of withdrawal symptoms would we experience have you in need 00:34:48.820 --> 00:34:54.900 of digital detox so really asking those hardcore questions that in fact one in every four people 00:34:54.900 --> 00:34:59.860 are battling depression and i think those are those are conservatives sorry one every six people i 00:34:59.860 --> 00:35:04.500 think those are conservative numbers i don't feel that that is accurate we know certainly in south 00:35:04.500 --> 00:35:12.020 africa that the collective trauma is way greater than that and that addiction is related into all of these 00:35:12.020 --> 00:35:17.860 final processes so yeah i do feel that when we look at it and we're starting to understand that it goes 00:35:17.860 --> 00:35:26.020 further than substance abuse and further than alcohol that in fact 79 of men and 76 of women watch 00:35:26.020 --> 00:35:31.540 pornography regularly obviously that's a particular sector and we're quoting barna um as a lot of us are 00:35:31.540 --> 00:35:39.140 familiar with is that really um the situation that we with um is the situation that we're facing is um really 00:35:39.140 --> 00:35:44.820 challenging with that amount of people being able to do it uh be stuck into pornography it's quite 00:35:44.820 --> 00:35:49.860 horrifying um i think probably one of the more challenging one is in terms of the pastors and 00:35:49.860 --> 00:35:56.180 the church and as we sit in that space and we try to think of you know with pastors and with the church 00:35:56.740 --> 00:36:03.380 digital and digital and otherwise is there a safe space is there a space to go for leaders in the church 00:36:03.940 --> 00:36:14.340 youth leaders youth pastors worship leaders executive pastors pastors wives um and in that kind of space 00:36:14.340 --> 00:36:22.100 we we really feel that the work that we've been able to be exposed to um is significant there's a desperate need uh uh oh 00:36:24.260 --> 00:36:29.380 sorry excuse me a desperate need of like how do we provide help you know is it an anonymous and we'll 00:36:29.380 --> 00:36:34.100 touch on that a little bit later um is it best to bring it out onto the platform is it best to be 00:36:34.100 --> 00:36:39.460 able to create a testimony out of it how do we actually work in a space that is going to protect 00:36:40.100 --> 00:36:45.540 the church when we talk about pastors and leadership and i know there's many um out there um on the 00:36:45.540 --> 00:36:51.860 platform today um it's a really important kind of process of what we're needing to wrestle with how we bring it 00:36:51.860 --> 00:36:57.860 into the open and understanding that the pornography is one area and one aspect of it but the reality is 00:36:57.860 --> 00:37:03.700 that um it's everywhere it's a in the church it's in the people that we sit next to it's in the people 00:37:03.700 --> 00:37:09.860 that we work with um and it's certainly very definitely in the church i've got a great friend 00:37:09.860 --> 00:37:16.100 of mine derek he's quite a hooligan um and he's like this is the leprosy that the that the current 00:37:16.100 --> 00:37:21.460 church that the nowadays church is facing inside of the church and if we don't take ownership and take 00:37:22.100 --> 00:37:26.580 development in that we are really going to get ourselves caught into a process that is not 00:37:27.300 --> 00:37:33.220 helpful at all talking about processes we also need to understand the process addiction that myth that 00:37:33.220 --> 00:37:39.220 it's not so bad a little bit of porn never hurt anybody um it's it's you know you know we work online 00:37:39.220 --> 00:37:44.260 so like why should that become a problem but if we really dig it deep and i'm sure all of you are also 00:37:44.260 --> 00:37:49.540 familiar with this and if not i would encourage you to really dive into like researching data and see 00:37:49.540 --> 00:37:53.860 what the trends are because we want to go upstream we don't want to be the guys that are trying to 00:37:53.860 --> 00:37:58.820 catch people in the dam at the bottom but to really go upstream and be part of the solution 00:38:00.260 --> 00:38:07.380 and we understand that those kind of symptoms are very similar when we are talking about coming off of a 00:38:07.380 --> 00:38:13.380 heroin addiction or if we are coming off of fentanyl or if we're coming off of a pharmaceutical 00:38:14.100 --> 00:38:19.460 or a sex addiction or working out the relationship between a sex addiction and and in a marriage 00:38:20.180 --> 00:38:25.540 and working in the space of eating disorders and how to manage that the symptoms are all crossing over 00:38:25.540 --> 00:38:31.540 and the biological effects are also very very very closely tied into it the neurological impact we know 00:38:31.540 --> 00:38:37.140 and understand now um is is one that can be restored but it takes time um and we do need to create those 00:38:37.140 --> 00:38:43.380 new neurological pathways and to be able to foster healthy workable neurological pathways whilst also 00:38:43.380 --> 00:38:50.740 taking a change within the ability to understand the underlying principles in fact if you um i'm sure 00:38:50.740 --> 00:38:55.300 you've seen this one i've said that a couple of times today but but this particular slide really just 00:38:55.300 --> 00:39:00.420 stands out for me um we use it a lot in our training and when we go into the churches and we've trained 00:39:00.420 --> 00:39:06.820 into several thousand churches so far in our uh career in project exodus or changing the way that 00:39:06.820 --> 00:39:12.180 recovery is being delivered and we see that the normal brain on the left hand side um looks healthy 00:39:12.980 --> 00:39:17.540 we've been driving through an amazing part of the country um over the last two days and it often looks 00:39:17.540 --> 00:39:22.980 like the brown and barren but yet there's green and shrubs and growth but if we look at a heroin user and we 00:39:22.980 --> 00:39:30.260 compare that to somebody that's using pornography the damage is significant and the similarities are also 00:39:30.260 --> 00:39:37.540 significant a challenge that the church and our environment faces that often when addiction is the 00:39:37.540 --> 00:39:41.700 the discussion or we are working with people that are coming out of addiction or fighting to find their 00:39:41.700 --> 00:39:48.660 way into freedom and remembering that freedom is is not just a a one-to-off kind of position i know for me 00:39:48.660 --> 00:39:53.780 personally that the the healing and the and the immediate kind of miracle that took place with 00:39:53.780 --> 00:39:59.620 me besides my salvation is that my ability to have a freedom of choice was restored so my freedom of 00:39:59.620 --> 00:40:06.180 choice was restored it remains my responsibility to maintain that freedom but the families go 00:40:08.020 --> 00:40:13.540 yeah the families get impacted significantly and we have to ask ourselves are we doing enough for the 00:40:13.540 --> 00:40:18.900 families are the families are the families being given a voice are they along going along their own recovery 00:40:18.900 --> 00:40:25.060 journey are they getting the ability to understand what has happened to them or what the kind of trauma 00:40:25.060 --> 00:40:31.700 that sits within that kind of space because 71 percent um of spouses experience post-traumatic stress 00:40:31.700 --> 00:40:39.540 support of symptoms in fact the intimate partner violence and the regular pornography use um is just an 00:40:39.540 --> 00:40:47.140 escalating uh pandemic the divorce rates are more than double um i believe and it is actually critical 00:40:47.140 --> 00:40:53.060 that we address recovery from a holistic perspective not just from the guys that are in recovery or 00:40:53.060 --> 00:41:00.660 battling to get in recovery or using and the truth of the matter is that the process addiction is often 00:41:00.660 --> 00:41:05.700 more than just the same and just as damaging but far far greater 00:41:08.500 --> 00:41:12.660 often we we hear the guys saying well i can't afford to go to rehab or if i get to rehab that's 00:41:12.660 --> 00:41:18.820 going to solve the problem and when my loved one or employee or our church member gets back or our 00:41:18.820 --> 00:41:25.540 leadership gets back then the rehab's done the job and we know that these days that is simply not the case 00:41:26.100 --> 00:41:32.180 in fact 90 percent of people who need treatment never receive it we are fortunate in south africa that 00:41:32.180 --> 00:41:37.860 we have a have a an ability to really try and reach far and wide through a national drug master plan but 00:41:37.860 --> 00:41:44.340 the resources to be able to deliver that is really really stretched and unfortunately we know on an 00:41:44.340 --> 00:41:50.500 international level according to the world health organization and the unodc is that treatment challenges 00:41:50.500 --> 00:41:56.900 that we have to be able to remain significant affordability is a significant process around it 00:41:56.900 --> 00:42:04.340 availability to developmental resolution by center program is limited often treatment rehabs are 00:42:07.460 --> 00:42:14.580 the time to be spent investing in our recovery in this worship disorder that we've aligned lives against 00:42:14.580 --> 00:42:22.420 careers against families businesses and ministries against that one month or two months or three months is 00:42:22.420 --> 00:42:31.220 not insufficient in terms of duration and has data debatable efficacy what is the particular challenge is 00:42:31.220 --> 00:42:38.740 that the continuum of care that needs to be maintained in treatment is often flawed and that break in 00:42:38.740 --> 00:42:43.460 communication the break in the continuity of treatment means that short-term treatment simply lacks 00:42:43.460 --> 00:42:51.460 efficacy in its sustainability so from our perspective if we look at time within recovery there's that old saying 00:42:51.460 --> 00:42:56.580 i'm sure everybody knows that time takes time we have an amazing fruit here in south africa called the purple 00:42:57.140 --> 00:43:02.020 which takes time to get ripe and if you grab this beautiful succulent fruit and you try and squeeze 00:43:02.020 --> 00:43:08.580 it right we know that it doesn't feature into a way of any kind of duration so that 28 days is not going to 00:43:08.580 --> 00:43:14.500 do very much in terms of more but but assisting in the transition of stopping and perhaps getting a level of 00:43:14.500 --> 00:43:20.500 stabilization long-term treatment takes time and the healing and the restoration is a critical 00:43:20.500 --> 00:43:25.540 component that goes with that we found it really helpful when working with the churches and to be 00:43:25.540 --> 00:43:31.220 able to spread a good understanding of what addiction is and perhaps even what it's not but more importantly 00:43:31.220 --> 00:43:39.060 what it is is to really be able to understand it from an iceberg principle it shows a lot of clarity in terms 00:43:39.060 --> 00:43:47.300 of folk who are not understanding what the addiction criteria are and who debate it and who wonder from 00:43:47.300 --> 00:43:52.660 a medical perspective whether that is covering it well but we do know the symptoms of what it looks 00:43:52.660 --> 00:43:59.620 like with isolation denial trauma dual diagnosis deregulation shame culture spiritual of course 00:43:59.620 --> 00:44:04.820 spiritual disconnection our emotional intelligence etc i mean it really makes a significant impact if they 00:44:04.820 --> 00:44:10.660 have an understanding especially from a church perspective that there's a complex and a substantial 00:44:10.660 --> 00:44:16.260 amount of work that needs to be done in that ongoing development and restoration as far as the east is 00:44:16.260 --> 00:44:23.860 from the west and in fact when we look at recovery we see truth community mental health 00:44:23.860 --> 00:44:31.620 being restored new mindsets healthy beliefs self-worth spiritual connection authenticity optimal brain 00:44:31.620 --> 00:44:37.300 functioning relationships being restored coping skills being established and so on and we really see the 00:44:37.300 --> 00:44:46.420 fruits of a culture of recovery and the reality sits and remains that the truth is that effective 00:44:46.420 --> 00:44:54.580 strategy is accessible access need to be ongoing it's not a one-off thing it's not a quick fix it's 00:44:54.580 --> 00:45:01.220 a process as we do the paradigm shift as far as the east is from the west we are pushing off of a point and 00:45:01.220 --> 00:45:07.140 driving towards the east and in that space of pushing away we're needing to build momentum 00:45:07.140 --> 00:45:14.420 build culture build sustainability and we understand critically that in the next myth that the church 00:45:14.420 --> 00:45:20.980 is not a hospital and it's not able to do the things that need to be done actually there's a whole lot that 00:45:20.980 --> 00:45:27.780 the church can done can do that hasn't been done i should add the church has a pivotal role to play 00:45:29.620 --> 00:45:37.380 to divide continuum of care to provide support non-judgment to understand that it's not them and us 00:45:37.380 --> 00:45:45.940 critically people coming into recovery within the church actually is the whole church because we are in a state of recovery 00:45:45.940 --> 00:45:51.940 we are being restored to our rightful potential and position in christ and we know that that process of sanctification 00:45:51.940 --> 00:45:57.940 carries on the whole time it's just different levels and in fact when we work with the guys who are seeking recovery 00:45:57.940 --> 00:46:04.500 and healing and restoration we're from coma and post-traumatic stress and um and substance abuse 00:46:04.500 --> 00:46:10.500 and the families being affected etc we are all on the same journey of seeking christ and ready to push into it 00:46:10.500 --> 00:46:16.020 and the church is perfectly positioned perfectly positioned to take a stand 00:46:17.220 --> 00:46:24.260 so we know that scripture well um we know the scripture well and he does he does destroy 00:46:24.980 --> 00:46:30.500 so from our perspective as project x is we love to empower the local church and the joy of digital is 00:46:30.500 --> 00:46:36.100 that the local church stretches far and wide and we really want to change the culture of addiction of 00:46:36.100 --> 00:46:42.260 negativity of um by works into a situation that actually there's work to be done in faith 00:46:42.900 --> 00:46:48.580 and to be able to work together in partnership and in the ability to create a recovery culture through 00:46:48.580 --> 00:46:55.380 recovery services services in a broader community base and the question remains that if the church doesn't 00:46:55.380 --> 00:47:04.660 do this who will i think within the states the war on drugs has been um ongoing uh in many ways 00:47:04.660 --> 00:47:10.980 in terms of walls in terms of budgets in terms of um yeah it's in all over the world that you know the 00:47:10.980 --> 00:47:17.060 the the bridges that have been broken down of trying to get this right um and really the answer remains 00:47:17.060 --> 00:47:23.380 in the church and if the church doesn't who will many churches like host a meeting and they want just a 00:47:23.380 --> 00:47:28.260 meeting to be um great we've got a meeting guys and um i can see you a bit under the weather um at 00:47:28.260 --> 00:47:33.300 church today you're coming to pray for people but perhaps spend a little bit of alcohol um let's send 00:47:33.300 --> 00:47:41.700 them to a a meeting um that's been hosted in the church that's not going to work from my perspective 00:47:42.660 --> 00:47:51.940 we've got to break down the walls between them and us we have to do that the church needs to own the 00:47:51.940 --> 00:47:58.100 ministry as part of the church and when i also own the ministry the congregation the community the 00:47:58.100 --> 00:48:04.260 leadership needs to start speaking about this and talking about it and really running and establishing 00:48:04.260 --> 00:48:10.740 a culture a whirlpool of recovery within the church because we are looking for a church that is not 00:48:10.740 --> 00:48:16.980 inward looking but outward looking and that's where discipleship and restoration takes place 00:48:17.940 --> 00:48:22.260 my favorite scripture we love to do this in training it's a little bit difficult to do online 00:48:22.260 --> 00:48:27.540 but this scripture of leaving the 99 in the wide open country and going after the one 00:48:27.540 --> 00:48:33.060 um and we and we at the moment are in sheep country and let me tell you there's thorn bushes and dry 00:48:33.060 --> 00:48:38.900 ground and snakes and everything else that goes with it but when you go after the night leave the 99 go 00:48:38.900 --> 00:48:45.460 after the one it's not an easy process it's not a quick fix it's about going out and getting dirty 00:48:45.460 --> 00:48:52.820 getting your hands dirty and really really making a difference within that space so remembering that 00:48:52.820 --> 00:49:00.340 leading a dynamic recovery ministry ministry is the church's mandate it's not about the champion in the 00:49:01.060 --> 00:49:06.580 church or the guy who's got a vested interest in this it's not about that because the moment we 00:49:06.580 --> 00:49:12.820 take the iceberg principle we know that only 10 is the actual addiction behavior and then 90 is what 00:49:12.820 --> 00:49:18.020 sustains it and anybody who's been through a death or grieving or post-traumatic stress or any of 00:49:18.020 --> 00:49:25.300 these multiple processes still have that 90 percent of hurt and shame or grief or processing or loss or 00:49:25.300 --> 00:49:33.460 any of these areas to work with and that is the church it's not them and us if we don't create this 00:49:33.460 --> 00:49:42.260 whirlpool deliberately and create that momentum break the inertia and maintain that momentum we are going to 00:49:42.260 --> 00:49:52.020 carry on losing the pathway there's the subject about anonymity is critical um i have a tattoo um which i'm 00:49:52.020 --> 00:49:57.620 not meant to be showing around but i thought why not do it seeing it is online but ezekiel 37 00:49:58.820 --> 00:50:04.820 belly of the bones we are raising up an army and it's not going to help if the guys have been quiet and 00:50:04.820 --> 00:50:12.100 ducking back to be in or not in sin or to be able to create a lack of accountability accountability is 00:50:12.100 --> 00:50:17.860 the church authenticity is the church truth is the church speaking it out bringing it out into the 00:50:17.860 --> 00:50:23.380 light that's the church so whilst we can respect that process of bringing people into the courage 00:50:23.380 --> 00:50:28.340 and ability of developing a testimony because we know we overcome by the power of the blood of the lamb 00:50:28.340 --> 00:50:36.740 and the word of our spoken testimony that it is really really really critical sin dies in the light it is 00:50:36.740 --> 00:50:45.940 a critical component that when i'm weak then i'm strong it's when i'm weak his strength in fact is perfected 00:50:45.940 --> 00:50:53.780 in my weakness not my strength his strength and who wouldn't want that not that i'm encouraging to go 00:50:53.780 --> 00:51:00.660 and become addicted so that you can experience that no quite the contrary it's about you don't have to 00:51:00.660 --> 00:51:08.260 be an addiction to be involved in the recovery of the church we need to shift this from from shame 00:51:08.260 --> 00:51:16.740 into glory to be able to really bring to light spaces where nothing needs to be hidden groups are a 00:51:16.740 --> 00:51:23.140 cutting-edge process to be able to do that and to build community and to build this process so i tonight 00:51:23.140 --> 00:51:28.820 want to just really say to you that life is better in a circle we are born that way i'm not sure how 00:51:28.820 --> 00:51:34.260 much time is left and i would encourage you to jump onto our website and really find out much about 00:51:35.220 --> 00:51:41.860 our approach our approach is innovative it is christ-centered it is new it is cutting edge it's piloted 00:51:42.580 --> 00:51:49.140 it is beautiful and we would encourage you to really partake in life-giving resolution orientated 00:51:49.780 --> 00:51:56.180 resources jeff i think you guys are amazing and we look forward to a way forward in the future and 00:51:56.180 --> 00:52:02.180 really let's raise up an army and get the work done that needs to be done thanks yeah no i i i love this 00:52:02.180 --> 00:52:07.780 conrad don't go anywhere stay on um such such a good presentation i was it was talking offline 00:52:08.500 --> 00:52:17.060 with um andy andy and stacy backstage and just the like the the this is your brain uh this is your brain 00:52:17.060 --> 00:52:23.860 on whatever the drug was and this is your brain on porn like that was yeah that was a no pun intended 00:52:23.860 --> 00:52:34.020 mind-blowing for me um to see you know what what the effect of of that is the idea of um the recovery of 00:52:34.020 --> 00:52:40.180 the church where you know okay you you may or may not be addicted to something but we all 00:52:40.740 --> 00:52:49.540 can have a a part playing in in the the recovery of the church and embracing the stigmas six of seven 00:52:49.540 --> 00:52:55.300 six of seven pastors have have struggled with porn um at some time in their lives and and i just did a 00:52:55.300 --> 00:53:00.820 a mental check and i can think of five that i've had a conversation with my life and i'm a guy that's 00:53:00.820 --> 00:53:08.020 worked with pastors you know the majority of my my my career life around that and so yeah you know 00:53:08.020 --> 00:53:14.260 there's there's a lot of stigmas that that that are surrounded by this now now we're i want to ask 00:53:14.260 --> 00:53:20.500 a couple questions we're a bunch of you know um you know the ragamuffin band uh square pegs and 00:53:20.500 --> 00:53:28.020 brown holes island of toys yeah yeah you know we're close to that very much so and you know we're the 00:53:28.020 --> 00:53:34.660 people who think differently so you know as a as an organization as as an end at the individual 00:53:34.660 --> 00:53:42.420 levels really want to go yes um what what does how do we how do we change like normally how do we enact 00:53:42.420 --> 00:53:48.260 change normally it's like top down okay let's get a you know a lead pastor's got to get a vision and do 00:53:48.260 --> 00:53:54.340 something and then there's like organization change that's that's really not who we are we're we're 00:53:54.340 --> 00:54:01.860 we're individuals kind of at the at the bottom of this and so yeah how would you suggest what does it 00:54:01.860 --> 00:54:09.300 look like to to maybe start to enact that change or create that cultural shift uh within organizations 00:54:10.420 --> 00:54:16.020 sure sure jeff i think you know and and not to be cliched and say like prayer is a good a good solution 00:54:16.020 --> 00:54:21.060 to because it's you know obviously but you know we all have to pray for more wisdom and faith so i 00:54:21.060 --> 00:54:26.260 think it's a good decision to be able to educate ourselves as much as we possibly can in that area 00:54:26.260 --> 00:54:31.860 we were we were up in uh zambia a short while ago working with a whole bunch of of of bishops 00:54:32.500 --> 00:54:37.060 in those in those areas representing multiple churches and we were chatting to them and doing a 00:54:37.060 --> 00:54:43.860 presentation and they said your stats are great conrad but let me tell you ours is that every week we see five bodies 00:54:43.860 --> 00:54:52.100 of people that have killed themselves um from um suicide from shame of pornography or homosexuality 00:54:52.100 --> 00:54:56.580 or those kind of spaces and substance abuse overdoses and that's in lusaka 00:54:57.140 --> 00:55:01.620 um and and when you look at that and you start looking at the amount of children that have gone through 00:55:01.620 --> 00:55:07.620 sexual abuse um and the numbers are just staggering absolutely staggering it comes down to one person 00:55:07.620 --> 00:55:13.140 making a change and making a difference and it's about really embracing that process and saying i'm going 00:55:13.140 --> 00:55:18.740 to be making a difference and making a change start the conversations be authentic be transparent if you're 00:55:18.740 --> 00:55:25.140 struggling or you're going through it then don't hide don't give it the power in fact disempower it by 00:55:25.140 --> 00:55:31.380 bringing into the light with some strong strong folk you can speak to us we can direct you great safe spaces 00:55:31.380 --> 00:55:36.820 initially to get this going um and to build the momentum there's great training online you can jump 00:55:36.820 --> 00:55:41.220 onto the online training we'll teach you how to run groups and i know a lot of us are we run small 00:55:41.220 --> 00:55:46.980 groups and those kind of things but when you have a good technique and good structure in that and then 00:55:46.980 --> 00:55:52.820 you have a depth of resource that is available to you which you can deliver within the group culture 00:55:52.820 --> 00:55:58.740 in the whirlpool very quickly we can create action and many churches start like that through small home 00:55:58.740 --> 00:56:06.100 groups so yeah get it started get get into it uh take a take a stand prophesy i i i love this i was 00:56:06.100 --> 00:56:11.940 going to ask a question about culture um and how to establish the culture but we actually just had a 00:56:11.940 --> 00:56:19.540 question come in in the in in the q a that i think is good what are signs that we are inventing a porn 00:56:19.540 --> 00:56:29.460 addiction um instead of just uh every once in a while fail falling for porn like at what point is is it uh 00:56:29.460 --> 00:56:36.100 it's the person saying i would not call it addiction just a bad thing like at what point does it does it 00:56:36.100 --> 00:56:43.860 become oh i failed you know once to oh yeah garbage i got a problem yeah yeah yeah brilliant question 00:56:43.860 --> 00:56:48.180 thanks for your courage of coming out and doing that um the answer to your questions i think you've 00:56:48.180 --> 00:56:54.740 answered the question um the reality is the in in our minds both uh from a biblical perspective um and 00:56:54.740 --> 00:56:59.780 from a from an addiction perspective is if we move this word addiction and we demystify the word 00:56:59.780 --> 00:57:07.860 addiction it's from a latin word meaning holy devoted to yeah so if we take the picture of needles and 00:57:07.860 --> 00:57:13.460 deaths and everything else out of the way and we look at a behavior disorder and we look that we do not 00:57:13.460 --> 00:57:18.820 want to keep on crucifying christ or going back into living in sin we want to bring it into a place 00:57:18.820 --> 00:57:26.100 behind it there's some hectic quotes um looking at pornography is as if heroin um has been devised 00:57:26.100 --> 00:57:32.900 a hundred times stronger than heroin injected directly into our eyes when that image comes into your mind and 00:57:32.900 --> 00:57:38.740 into your process behind it it's really difficult to remove it alters the way that we think it alters our 00:57:38.740 --> 00:57:43.700 spiritual foundation and our spiritual base in fact jesus you're sure was so strong in it he said if 00:57:43.700 --> 00:57:48.660 you lust with your eyes you've committed adultery already within that space not to give you a heavy 00:57:48.660 --> 00:57:53.860 or to lay a trip in it but if you're assessing it like why would you want to do it why would you want 00:57:53.860 --> 00:58:00.580 to look at the daughter of our king being abused on a screen why would you want to be able to look at 00:58:00.580 --> 00:58:06.580 your daughter perhaps we have to start asking ourselves some really seriously hard questions that 00:58:06.580 --> 00:58:12.660 is that in god's will or my will and if we are really going to be reverent and push you into a 00:58:12.660 --> 00:58:18.340 place of reverence um there's an amazing book of john bevere um maybe for some guys say it's not for 00:58:18.340 --> 00:58:25.460 everybody maybe you don't know but for me the reverence of our king um is something that that changes lives 00:58:25.460 --> 00:58:31.620 um so if if you're going to do it you do it once that's once too much um it is probably the most 00:58:31.620 --> 00:58:39.300 addictive behavior that we can it's we're having run treatment centers um and we've had big treatment 00:58:39.300 --> 00:58:46.260 centers and running it for a long-term treatment pornography is perhaps one of the hardest behavior 00:58:46.260 --> 00:58:52.740 disorders it's hand the word addiction and and discard that that behavior disorder heart is so 00:58:52.740 --> 00:58:59.700 duplicit and stealthy and so close to the truth in terms of sex and in terms of love and creation and 00:58:59.700 --> 00:59:05.140 marriage and all of those kind of things why would we want to endanger ourselves and our godly purpose 00:59:05.140 --> 00:59:11.220 and our wives and our husbands and because the women are like a couple of percent down that road so 00:59:11.220 --> 00:59:18.340 yeah if you're asking the question you need to go challenge yourself yeah so good um it's just even 00:59:18.340 --> 00:59:23.380 even to follow up on this at a personal level and thank you the person that's asking the question and 00:59:23.380 --> 00:59:30.580 honestly yeah yeah um it's um like for at a personal level for me i fought for years whether or not i was 00:59:30.580 --> 00:59:37.140 addicted um in that that years of me asking that question actually prevented me from from getting the 00:59:37.140 --> 00:59:42.660 help that i needed and it wasn't until i said okay i don't even know what it means but okay i'm addicted 00:59:42.660 --> 00:59:50.180 um you know i i stopped the fight where i it the the brokenness of that actually i believe allowed 00:59:50.180 --> 00:59:54.580 god to kind of work through me in that it's not a problem it's not a problem yeah you know romans 00:59:54.580 --> 00:59:59.380 romans 3 as pastors we talk about it all the time you know for all of sin and all in short we're 00:59:59.380 --> 01:00:03.940 we're not we're not getting there and so as a result of that you know what is addiction is it one 01:00:03.940 --> 01:00:10.500 time is it two times it's three times 10 20 does it matter uh you know at the greater point of this 01:00:10.500 --> 01:00:17.060 asking that question honestly became a defense mechanism preventing me from getting the help 01:00:17.060 --> 01:00:24.900 yeah that i that i needed and sure can i jump to the back of what you're saying this when we start 01:00:24.900 --> 01:00:29.140 talking about breaking myths and breaking the process behind it the the introduction of the word 01:00:29.140 --> 01:00:34.660 addict as a qualifying process behind it is a complete misdirection you know it's like it's 01:00:34.660 --> 01:00:40.820 not about like i fit this label or i don't fit this label you you said it we square pigs in around holes 01:00:40.820 --> 01:00:46.100 we we're not the guys that run within the same kind of process around it let's take that word 01:00:46.100 --> 01:00:50.740 addiction completely out that whole thing of rock bottom completely out who do you want to be in 01:00:50.740 --> 01:00:56.260 class how do you want to behave how would your daughter you like your daughter to be treated let's 01:00:56.260 --> 01:01:01.460 ask ourselves some really hard questions take the word addiction out because that is a block to the 01:01:01.460 --> 01:01:06.740 healing and restoration that waits inside for your weakness for history and to be affected so that 01:01:06.740 --> 01:01:11.860 you carry the authority of the creator of the universe on your shoulders game changer why would we want 01:01:11.860 --> 01:01:18.660 to do it yeah so good all right project exodus uh if you're in hublo the links on the website if not 01:01:18.660 --> 01:01:28.820 it's project exodus.net is the website project exodus.net um we the church digital are partnering with with 01:01:28.820 --> 01:01:34.820 project exodus uh to create uh once again project exodus works with churches and organizations 01:01:34.820 --> 01:01:39.940 to create a culture of of recovery and we're happy to announce that we're going to get more into this 01:01:39.940 --> 01:01:47.540 here in a little bit that we are are starting uh a recovery ministry and recovery groups and and moving 01:01:47.540 --> 01:01:53.060 towards in that in that culture of recovery working with project exodus literally in south africa i'm 01:01:53.060 --> 01:02:00.180 excited stacy and the team has been working on this for uh for a couple months now getting certified and 01:02:00.180 --> 01:02:05.860 getting equipped and trained and all this and and so we're going to talk more about the the beta in a 01:02:05.860 --> 01:02:11.940 a little bit but at an organizational level if you're interested in creating a culture of recovery 01:02:11.940 --> 01:02:20.020 project exodus.net is a great option for you conrad i know we've had some frustrating 01:02:20.020 --> 01:02:26.100 tech issues today but i want yeah no good problem and jumping on today and and i hope you have a good 01:02:26.100 --> 01:02:32.420 evening in south africa and uh we'll be in touch soon i'm sure wonderful thanks so much god bless you 01:02:32.420 --> 01:02:40.740 thank you sir bye all right hey uh one hour long stream and this is the third shirt i've been 01:02:40.740 --> 01:02:45.940 wearing this is jeff actually this time live live not not sim live from the conference or from my 01:02:45.940 --> 01:02:54.180 earlier conversation uh with stacy but i i'm excited uh coming off of the conference it was uh it was a 01:02:54.900 --> 01:03:02.660 uh it was it was a joyous headache uh it was a technological nightmare uh but we are so thankful 01:03:02.660 --> 01:03:10.660 for uh the people that came out to watch uh the the the conference engage ask questions as i said with 01:03:10.660 --> 01:03:17.540 stacy it was a different audience than i was expecting uh but i feel like god moved through it 01:03:17.540 --> 01:03:26.100 and actually a lot of the technological issues at a personal level um when uh when the isps broke and 01:03:26.100 --> 01:03:31.940 75 of the world's population could not access the content the conference as we were starting said 01:03:31.940 --> 01:03:38.420 conference which is very discouraging globally um really just kind of got to the place where uh okay 01:03:38.420 --> 01:03:44.020 we've got to do this conference publicly and so we're gonna we're gonna i'm talking with leadership 01:03:44.020 --> 01:03:51.300 we got to figure out a time to schedule it but i really i really am moved towards the fact that we 01:03:51.300 --> 01:04:01.220 need to uh rebroadcast the conference publicly um not not in hublo or not behind a login but in in a 01:04:01.220 --> 01:04:10.820 public environment uh for for many to um benefit from and so if there's one takeaway to nightmare 01:04:10.820 --> 01:04:15.540 technological nightmares it's you know god speaks to the technological nightmares god speaks to the 01:04:15.540 --> 01:04:20.420 difficulties god speaks to others god speaks to situations you know we could break down henry 01:04:20.420 --> 01:04:25.620 blackerby's experiencing god all day long but at the end of the day uh god speaks when the internet 01:04:25.620 --> 01:04:33.540 crashes as well and um i i am uh fully believing that that god was speaking to me through yesterday's 01:04:33.540 --> 01:04:38.740 events and uh maybe just maybe just maybe he was speaking to you as well and so if you enjoyed the 01:04:38.740 --> 01:04:45.380 conference awesome uh we've got europe coming up in five days and something hours uh it's wednesday very 01:04:45.380 --> 01:04:54.020 early 3 a.m eastern uh will be the start of the keynotes in europe 9 a.m cet i believe more information at 01:04:54.020 --> 01:05:00.660 missionary dot digital slash europe www dot missionary dot digital slash europe find more information and 01:05:00.660 --> 01:05:04.900 register for the conference there almost 500 registered for that one we're excited you know 01:05:04.900 --> 01:05:08.660 it's interesting now you know what i'm gonna save that one save that one for the next stream we're 01:05:08.660 --> 01:05:16.020 gonna be giving a sneak peek on tuesday for the europe and so conference so www dot missionary dot digital 01:05:16.020 --> 01:05:24.260 slash europe check out that page and with that we're gonna wrap up today's stream for we'll shoot for 01:05:24.260 --> 01:05:32.980 everybody that spoke at yesterday's conference thank you uh i'm i'm uh very thankful for our friends 01:05:32.980 --> 01:05:39.540 over at project exodus very thankful for our friends at regeneration uh very thankful for our friends at 01:05:39.540 --> 01:05:46.500 at hope made strong uh like there's just been so much support for digital missionaries in 01:05:47.060 --> 01:05:54.660 the recovery in the christ-centered recovery space and i am very very much looking forward to what god has 01:05:54.660 --> 01:06:03.380 in store uh for our missionaries as as we shine the light of uh christ in the dark and as a result of 01:06:03.380 --> 01:06:10.900 that have to be okay shining it on ourselves so uh for basically me on this stream this is me thanks 01:06:10.900 --> 01:06:16.020 for jumping on the stream today we'll see you next time on the show y'all have a good one